D3's difficulties get CNN coverage - again.

[Elric of Grans]

Elric does not need to say anything: he could never hope to belittle you as well as you do yourself! He also does not sit on the forum 24/7, so may take hours to respond to a post. Yes, Elric is speaking in the third person, because all the cool kids do it

Nightmare is not a `cast' effect, like Waller or Vortex. It is a chance to occur on any hit. This is why things that hit you for small, regular damage (eg the fire pits from Guardians) will chain-fear you, while slow-attacking enemies (eg Berserkers) may never fear you in the entire encounter.

[FireIceTalon]

Elric does not need to say anything: he could never hope to belittle you as well as you do yourself! He also does not sit on the forum 24/7, so may take hours to respond to a post. Yes, Elric is speaking in the third person, because all the cool kids do it

Nightmare is not a `cast' effect, like Waller or Vortex. It is a chance to occur on any hit. This is why things that hit you for small, regular damage (eg the fire pits from Guardians) will chain-fear you, while slow-attacking enemies (eg Berserkers) may never fear you in the entire encounter.

And to that I will say, a lie told often enough becomes the truth. You are right about one thing though: You can't belittle me in the slightest, cause I dont know you, nor care enough about you for it to make any difference to me. That aside...

being feared while being walled (so you dont run anyway, and instead you stop fighting and become vulnerable to all damage while while being trapped and not being able to fight back) is fun stuff, huh? I really wonder if Blizz actually thinks these kind of mechanics challenge us. Or more importantly, if they are fun.

[ViralSpiral]

My theory is that no Blizzard employee has played a toon from 1-60 in a year or more. If they even still play at all when not working on Titan, I'm sure they just debug up a character of whatever class and level they want, with 99 billion gold, insert it wherever they want to play, decked out in whatever gear they want. This is why stuff that's obvious to the player base as tedious falls on deaf ears. I've been watching their forums and they listen to complaints on the AH/RMAH, but all the gameplay related complaints about balance or repairs or difficulty are all met with "we don't think this is an issue." Which in some cases, some of it might not be, but I don't think the player base, whingy as they are there, are wrong about every single thing, and I would think some of these issues would be obvious if the devs played the game the way we do.

[smegged]

My theory is that no Blizzard employee has played a toon from 1-60 in a year or more. If they even still play at all when not working on Titan, I'm sure they just debug up a character of whatever class and level they want, with 99 billion gold, insert it wherever they want to play, decked out in whatever gear they want. This is why stuff that's obvious to the player base as tedious falls on deaf ears. I've been watching their forums and they listen to complaints on the AH/RMAH, but all the gameplay related complaints about balance or repairs or difficulty are all met with "we don't think this is an issue." Which in some cases, some of it might not be, but I don't think the player base, whingy as they are there, are wrong about every single thing, and I would think some of these issues would be obvious if the devs played the game the way we do.

Wait, what? Leveling a toon is actually quite a lot of fun. The problems with the game start when you've realised that there's jack all to do once you reach 60.

[ViralSpiral]

Yeah, but you get very few gear upgrades from drops in those last ten levels, which Blizzard seems to refuse to acknowledge as a problem. This is one of the main reasons I'm suspicious they haven't actually played the game that was released, because they seem to think this is perfectly acceptable.

[MongoJerry]

being feared while being walled (so you dont run anyway, and instead you stop fighting and become vulnerable to all damage while while being trapped and not being able to fight back) is fun stuff, huh? I really wonder if Blizz actually thinks these kind of mechanics challenge us. Or more importantly, if they are fun.

What's interesting is that Diamond Skin can also be cast while you are feared by Nightmarish. I haven't tested Mirror Images with Nightmarish, yet, but I suspect that since it breaks other cc's that it also breaks Nightmarish.

[Tal]

Hardly. I'm not the one running around the forum tattle tailing because someone made a post I didn't like. Guess I just have thicker skin than that

Also, I think Elric can reply and/or report me on his own if he has a problem with me, he doesn't need Hammer to be his PR tool.

If the website admin tells you to stop doing something - take it to heart. Right now he's the only person standing between you and a very long vacation from this forum.

Stop attacking the other posters.

[FireIceTalon]

Yea, because double standard rules just rock, dont they? Especially when you are on the "favorable" side of them.

---

My theory is that no Blizzard employee has played a toon from 1-60 in a year or more. If they even still play at all when not working on Titan, I'm sure they just debug up a character of whatever class and level they want, with 99 billion gold, insert it wherever they want to play, decked out in whatever gear they want. This is why stuff that's obvious to the player base as tedious falls on deaf ears. I've been watching their forums and they listen to complaints on the AH/RMAH, but all the gameplay related complaints about balance or repairs or difficulty are all met with "we don't think this is an issue." Which in some cases, some of it might not be, but I don't think the player base, whingy as they are there, are wrong about every single thing, and I would think some of these issues would be obvious if the devs played the game the way we do.

Blizz might want to go to take a long look at the ratings of all 3 games on Amazon, and see what people are saying. D1 and D2 have 4 stars each with generally overwhelming positive comments. D3 has 2 stars with mostly 1-star reviews, and while alot of those bad reviews are kind of stupid (many complaining about server issues), there are a number of legitimate ones also. When you have an overwhelming consensus like this, it should occur to them that perhaps the issue is with the game and not the players.....they have too much pride though, or more likely, they love that 15% cut.

[Tal]

Yea, because double standard rules just rock, dont they? Especially when you are on the "favorable" side of them.

You're taking it too far. Bolty is pretty tolerant of it but you're taking it to a whole another level.

[RTM]

And what is the cooldown for each monster? 1, MAYBE 2 seconds tops? ROFL.....that hardly can be called a CD, as they still spam the ever-loving shit out of it to the point where you want to go through the screen, grab the monsters by their necks and say "stop it, now!!!!", and then do the same thing to the dev team afterward....

Wow. Dude, I seriously think you need to step away from the game for awhile. Get some perspective. It's a video game. Stop and think about that for a minute. You're talking about snapping the dev's necks? Even in jest, geez...

[ViralSpiral]

http://www.forbes.com/sites/insertcoin/2...-and-fast/

Forbes is in on the action now too. D3 is srs bsns, apparently.

[Mavfin]

http://www.forbes.com/sites/insertcoin/2...-and-fast/

Forbes is in on the action now too. D3 is srs bsns, apparently.

The Forbes guy has already proved he's an idiot, coming up with an 'exploit' that never existed to excuse himself being hacked.

[Jester]

Which in some cases, some of it might not be, but I don't think the player base, whingy as they are there, are wrong about every single thing, and I would think some of these issues would be obvious if the devs played the game the way we do.

What *are* the issues?

I've yet to hear any real agreement on this by "the player base." Even the most widely discussed problem - Inferno too hard - is also matched by the complaint that gear trivializes the game.

-Jester

[Mavfin]

Which in some cases, some of it might not be, but I don't think the player base, whingy as they are there, are wrong about every single thing, and I would think some of these issues would be obvious if the devs played the game the way we do.

What *are* the issues?

I've yet to hear any real agreement on this by "the player base." Even the most widely discussed problem - Inferno too hard - is also matched by the complaint that gear trivializes the game.

-Jester

I see one set of people in agreement, and another set mostly not in agreement. One is more visible, because the ones not in agreement are spending more time playing the game, rather than sitting on forums. (I'm at work, that's why I'm on here.)

[Wessonality]

The core player complaint (on bnet forums) seems to be "it's all about the gear".
Related complaints are:
"They're forcing us into the AH" (to get the gear)
"The drops (affixes) aren't good" (takes a long time to get good gear)
"Can't level past 60" (no continuing improvement except for gear)
"Can't customize character" (my Wiz is diff from your Wiz only in gear.)
"Champs/elites remove choice in play" (survival when damage cannot be avoided comes down to gear check.)

Yes, they're aware that Diablo series has always been about getting gear.

--- Math diversion follows ---

Mathematically, it's an interesting thought that since combat factors (def and att) are multiplied out, ANY means of changing def or att will be multiplied out. So a weapon going from 20 to 30 DPS will *multiply* your overall dam by a factor of 1.5, instead of just adding something to your overall attack.

So the underlying math multiplying makes it a very clean design, but it also makes your character's life very dependent on every piece of gear.

You can see this at level 9, when adding a couple of 2-4 dam rings can double your DPS and make life a cakewalk at least until 15-20. That's because that new 4-8 dam (+100% to weapon dam) is multiplied by your weapon speed and multiplied by your attack stat (str, dex, int.) Compare with D1 where upgrading your weapon from 10 to 12 dam might take your overall attack from 40 to 42.

So D3 is a smooth linear ascent *on a log scale*. Being undergeared (too low on that log scale) means you're outgunned by N:1 not just ougunned by N.

Now skills are keyed off weapon dam as well ...

Add to that the sudden violence of the encounters in D3 - kill or be killed - a tipping point situation where even a small difference could be critical - and then gear really is very very critical.

The effect is less critical with armor and resists just because there are so many more slots, so that the effect from upgrading any one slot might just multiply your lifespan times 1.02 or some small increment.

Note that this places a heavy burden on item/affix design; any small change can produce a big effect.

[ViralSpiral]

There's lots of complaints about no PvP yet, Barbs being overpowered, WDs being underpowered, lots of GUI complaints...I mean really, anything you can think of has probably been complained about over there. So far as things where consensus actually exists, it's PvP, bad drops, weak WDs, too many "unkillable" pack combos in Inferno, no benefits for grouping, too much WoW and not enough Diablo in the game, and oddly several complaints about the story - I didn't actually think anyone over there would care.

I mostly just look over there to see if there's any information from blues.

[Elric of Grans]

Yes, they're aware that Diablo series has always been about getting gear.

It never was for me. I like character builds; loot was a fringe benefit. The quality of loot drops has always been extremely random and filled with trash. I remember someone once commenting on how one of my DII Amazons had a Windforce, yet almost all her other gear could (and possibly did) drop in Normal difficulty. You get crazy stuff. The big difference was that it did not overly matter before and anything you found could be good (for the right character), whereas Diablo III requires minimum equipment levels, and essentially the same equipment for all characters, to progress. The loot dynamic has shifted considerably from `w00t I found something cool' to `gah, I need precisely x or y to progress'.

[Kurosu]

Hardly. I'm not the one running around the forum tattle tailing because someone made a post I didn't like. Guess I just have thicker skin than that

Also, I think Elric can reply and/or report me on his own if he has a problem with me, he doesn't need Hammer to be his PR tool.

If the website admin tells you to stop doing something - take it to heart. Right now he's the only person standing between you and a very long vacation from this forum.

Stop attacking the other posters.

D3 excels at inducing rage towards the game, other forum posters and the backing companies, that's undeniable.
The frustration with the game has to go somewhere, and often people end up lashing out at the wrong places or being overly sensitive to some statements.
Even though I haven't posted here for long, I've lurked here for a long time, so I recognize most of the posters, and I'm a bit surprised how heated the discussions here get about D3.
Although it's mostly the same few people in the pro and anti-D3/Blizz camps of course.


On topic: I'm appalled that the increased damage issue still has not even been commented on by Blizzard after a full two weeks, let alone being dealt with.
As this is a significant issue, and it contributes to a large portion of the high difficulty of the game: people are taking more damage than they should, and the damage numbers were already out of hand before this factor came into play.

They took down the servers several times this week for maintenance, but it all seems related to adding features to the RMAH, what's up with those priorities!
Although I'm probably seen to be firmly in the "anti-Blizzard/Diablo/hater" camp, as most of my posts are negative towards either (including this one), I'm really not trying to do this on purpose.
It's simply hard for me to be content with the attitude Blizzard is seemingly taking up about this.

There was a period of several weeks where their own representatives completely ignored the community regarding any significant and/or game-breaking issues, and now they seem to be posting again but these threads are being actively ignored.
There is a plethora of information in countless threads regarding the increased damage, loot drop rate and quality issues, which I feel are the most significant issues currently which don't get a single reply.
But meanwhile, mostly inane issues (such as convenience features like crafting several items at once), is what the representatives comment on.

It nearly feels like an insult when a blue poster regularly makes updates such as "now you can buy Gold and Gems in the RMAH too!", but the actual issues of importance are not even being commented on.
Whether that is their intention or not, that's how it seems where their priorities lie, and IMHO, that's not what they should be doing right now.

And I'm rambling again.

[Wessonality]

I share your perspective, Elric; I was just trying to acknowledge that finding gear has always been important, but also pointing out that it now hugely dominates.

From a more impressionistic perspective:

I felt about WoW that it was like "riding on rails" - difficult to plan your own adventure - areas 5 below your level are useless and areas 5 above your level are impossible. D3 feels even more like riding on rails somehow, being in a little train going through an amusement park, where you feel as if you are making progress but actually are just being taken along for the ride.

D3 seems very professional and developed next to D2 or D1, the combat system design (Att and Def) seems so well designed by comparison - as per my remarks about the math above. There are few strange difficulty sags or jumps, for example (leaving out Inferno which was deliberate.) Skills scale properly at all levels ... etc ...

So it's very smooth. But too smooth. Without the eccentricities some of which Elric speaks of above, so abundantly present in D1 and D2, the game feels a little soulless somehow. Perhaps I will find a way of creating my own eccentricities. Starting out a new character has always had that enjoyable sandbox feeling for me, not knowing what could be happening next. But that is not exciting now that Normal difficulty is so much easier than D1 Normal or D2 Normal.

[MongoJerry]

But that is not exciting now that Normal difficulty is so much easier than D1 Normal or D2 Normal.

I seriously doubt that I could naked no-skills punch my way through normal difficulty Act I in D3 much less do it throughout the entire difficulty, which apparently someone on the Amazon Basin did in D2. D2 normal was even easier than what D3 normal is.

It nearly feels like an insult when a blue poster regularly makes updates such as "now you can buy Gold and Gems in the RMAH too!", but the actual issues of importance are not even being commented on.
Whether that is their intention or not, that's how it seems where their priorities lie, and IMHO, that's not what they should be doing right now.

Keep a few things in mind. First, there are different teams of people who work on different things. Second, a spokesperson doesn't want to say anything until something is definitely set in concrete -- in this case, a fix has been found and a date and means of distributing the fix has been agreed upon. Otherewise, they might set up expectations only to have them dashed, making the situation worse. Third, there is not only the current game to think about but also the development of future content patches, so they have to constantly juggle whether it is worth it to take someone working on future content off the project for an afternoon to track down a bug and fix it. It might be worth it to do so, but this is part of the calculation that they have to think about. Fourth, there is not only the issue that you are currently worried about, but the thousands of complaints, gripes, etc., that millions of players are expressing. What may seem absolutely critical to you may not rate as highly to many other people. (In this case, I personally agree with you that the damage issue should rate highly, though).