Assassin Build

[diablo1ks]

Hey,

I want to start a new assassin, but as usual with me, it's no ordinary one... I don't intend on using any of the 'Martial Arts' tree or use a Shadow. Master/Warrior. My original plan was to max 'Burst Of Speed' and 'Venom' and use a bow with some lighting traps for back-up. But recently I have become interested with 'Blade Fury', a few questions please:

- Would 'Burst Of Speed' have any effect on 'Blade Fury' and if so, would maxing it be stupid?

- Does Venom work with 'Blade Fury'?

- How does 'Blade Fury' actually work? Is it like an 'Inferno/Arctic Blast'?

Please feel free to comment on anything relevant to anything I have mentioned...

Thanks in advance B)

[adeyke]

- Would 'Burst Of Speed' have any effect on 'Blade Fury' and if so, would maxing it be stupid?

No. You can't speed up BF at all, ever.

- Does Venom work with 'Blade Fury'?

Yes. Note that all damage (not just physical damage) is subject to the 3/4 penalty.

- How does 'Blade Fury' actually work? Is it like an 'Inferno/Arctic Blast'?

It's sort of like inferno, except that it fires discrete missiles (1 every 6 frames, IIRC) instead of a continuous jet. It carries your weapon damage and all sorts of effects.

Some things to note:
It doesn't reduce the durability of ethereal items, so you can use those for extra damage (provided you don't have something else that does damage them.

Go for a single point in BF. Extra points aren't worth it.

Two-hand weapons get their damage halved for BF, so they may not be worth it.

[LiquidDamage]

I have made 3 Blade Fury assassins now, and I have the following information to share that you may or may not be aware of:

1) Blade Fury uses AR. You will definately want lots of it. Options are claw mastery (if you use claws), Ignores Target's Defense, Visionary helms (+%AR), 1 or 2 angelic rings with either the armor or amulet (or both, for an additional 50% MF and +1 skills) for a huge level based +AR boost, an off hand katar with the fool's or Hawkeye prefix, +AR charms, or an eth socketed weapon.

2) The reason Adeyke suggests to not raise Blade Fury above 1 is that it gets a puny damage bonus, and increases the mana cost per blade. The ideal Blade Fury assassin would likely have +1 to Blade Fury on a primary or off-hand Katar, and never put a point in it, due to the way +assassin or +trap skills don't work on skills you don't have a point in (+ all skills, such as that gained from Tarnhelm and the Angelic amulet individual set bonus do work though). This is really just wishful thinking, however, as you would obviously want more than just the +1 to blade fury on the claw.

3) Get the following affects if you can: Knockback, Ignores Target's Defense, Freezes Target, Chance to cast on Striking, and Prevent Monster Heal. Blade Fury attacks so quickly that many of these abilities are extremely useful-- being able to keep a unique in stunlock from knockback is extremely helpful, as is freezing or slowing targets. Note that Monster Flee and Hit Blinds Target are also extremely useful, except for the fact that they will overwrite other necro curses that you might want on them, so you may or may not like them. Shadow Killer, the unique Battle Cestus, is a fantastic Blade Fury weapon. It does lots of damage, freezes the Target, has -25% target's defense, and also has a 33% chance to cast a decent level frost nova on striking. It doesn't have knockback or PMH, but you can get those from Cleglaws or crafted Hit Power gloves, and Hwannin's belt, respectively. I will have a Delerium Diadem when I get to 64 with my latest assassin, I can't wait to try out that level 18 Confuse on striking. (Yes, I chose the Diadem for the potential bonuses it will give to my Shadow)

4) Do not use venom with Blade Fury unless you have PMH when you get to hell difficulty. Venom truncates the length of any other source of poison damage to .4 seconds, which means it will not counter monster regen in Hell Difficulty.

5) You are going to have loads of points left if your only plans are the 1 point in Blade Fury and 20 in Venom. I suggest maxing Fade. This way, you can use dual claws for an extra AR bonus (get a Fool's claw in your off hand), and you will have 20% physical resistance, which is always nice. Also, Max Claw Mastery, as even if you have ITD, you will need AR against act bosses and such. With maxed Claw Mastery and a Fool's claw, your AR will be in the 10k+ range at 75 (I think it was 13k, I am at work, so I don't have the notes I made for my BF assassins). The damage boost from Claw mastery is nice, too.

6) Get 1 point in cloak of shadows, and use it. Don't go over 1 point, as it lasts too long and cannot be recast (it is on a really weird special timer), which will prevent you from getting new monsters with it before the last one wears off. This will lower their defense, and keep them out of your face because of the blindness. Also, if you play hardcore with halfway intelligent people, they will love it regardless of the annoying darkness effect.

7) If you are one of those super rich folks, get a Demon Limb for your weapon switch. The Enchant charges will do wonders for your AR, and add some usable fire damage.

8) People rave about crushing blow for Blade Fury. I had an Ethereal Strength Wrist Sword, and the 25% crushing blow chance just didn't seem to do squat. In Hell difficulty, with Maxed Claw Mastery and that claw, I really couldn't kill a thing even in a 2 player game (I don't play hell hardcore solo). I guess if you had 100% it might be significant, but I just didn't see much benefit. I say go for the raw damage if you can get it. I should note that I didn't have anything for countering monster regen, so that may have been a significant factor, so if you can get both, test it out.

Well, thats all I have to add for now. Have fun.

[bigeyedbug]

  This way, you can use dual claws for an extra AR bonus (get a Fool's claw in your off hand),

I would love to get AR bonuses (as well as others) from the off-hand claw. Unfortunately, all the information I've seen implies that weapon mods (AR, ED, PMH, CTC, CB, yadda yadda yadda) from the secondary claw do not impact BF while personal mods do. (+Stat, Resist, +Skill, MF, yadda^3) My own experience with 1 L81 BF Assassin backs this general idea up, as well as some amount of dedicated testing. Admittedly, I have not tested +AR specifically. If you are certain off-hand AR is taken into account, I would enjoy hearing about the source of your certainty.

Also monster regen can be circumvented not only by PMH or long-duration poison, but also by Open Wounds--for 8 seconds, at least. While I thought you made a good point about the disadvantage of Venom, it's damage is pretty darn useful in Hell if one can get around the regen issue.

I hope my tone doesn't seem condescending. It is obvious to me that you have much more experience with this game than I do.

Oh, and one hint for the original poster: A Malice weapon can be a great choice all the way through Nightmare, especially if you have AR issues. My untwinked Assassin used hers all the way through Act I Hell.

[Deadpan]

You can go a long way using complete Cleglaw's: Crushing Blow, Deadly Strike, scaling max damage, AR, resists, knockback, slow and mana leech. Deep into NM, I keep on swapping out for seemingly better gear but always end up back at what I was wearing at level 18.

Skills: if you're not going to be using a Shadow you definitely need to consider a single point in Mind Blast for the stun and chance to convert. I'm in two minds about pumping it - longer stun is nice but you can always recast for a second chance at conversion. Damage-wise, forget it.

[LiquidDamage]

I would love to get AR bonuses (as well as others) from the off-hand claw.  Unfortunately, all the information I've seen implies that weapon mods (AR, ED, PMH, CTC, CB, yadda  yadda yadda) from the secondary claw do not impact BF while personal mods do.

I think you are right about not getting AR bonuses from the off-hand. The LCS says you are.

I have loads of experience with Trap and Blade Fury assassins, but I have never used a dual claw one, I have always used Claw/Shield, or weapon/shield. I knew weapon mods didn't apply, but I thought AR fell in the "stat" category. It apparently doesn't. I will test it though, when I can use my claws. The AR difference will be massive, so it should be pretty obvious.

Also, thanks for reminding me of Open Wounds. That is another affect I forgot about. And you don't sound condescending at all, don't worry about it. :)

Well, darn. I found what I thought was my near-dream off-hand claw:

Ethereal Battle Cestus
+2 assassin skills (I am a primary trapper with a shadow, so I'll take the mana cost increase to BF in exchange for more trap damage and a better shadow)
30% IAS (for weapon block speed, I hear it is based upon weapon speed. Again, I've never used dual claws)
Fool's (+16.5 AR per level)
+1 to Fade

It also has +20 to maximum damage (on top of the level based +max from Fool's), and 4% mana steal, but as I said, it was going to be an offhand claw, so I didn't consider that to be important.

Now, I COULD use it as my primary, but my ethereal Bartuc's does so much more damage :P. I may use it anyway, as while it averages only 87 damage at level 75 (65.25 with blade fury), and the ethereal Bartuc's averages 157 (117.5 with BF), I will probably hit far, far more with the Battle Cestus, plus it has enough mana steal that I will likely only need one other source (or I could socket a pskull in it).

I'm going to have to figure out exactly how much more often I will hit with the Battle Cestus. I may wind up just sticking an Eth or a pamythist in the Bartuc's.

Thanks for pointing this out, by the way. I was planning my character around that, and I'd hate to have socketed the wrong things in those claws.

[Treesh]

Something simple, but blade fury also picks up handy little modifiers from shields equipped as well. I have a blade fury assassin (still a baby in hardcore because my husband wants a friend for his elemental druid) who wears umbral disk and the blind from umbral carries on blade fury. I just saw everyone mentioning picking it up from weapons, and just wanted to chime in that it picks up some things off of your shield as well.

[bigeyedbug]

Treesh--Yeah that's a good point. Just to spell it out a little more, all the tasty mods that specifically don't work with BF on the secondary claw do work on a shield. Swordback Hold is often mentioned in this regard for its Open Wounds Mod. Another thing you can do (and particularly annoying to me as a double claw enthusiast) is slap ED% and elem. damage jewels in a shield and it will boost BF. A second claw still has its own--very substantial--advantages. These are basically +skills and the possibility of Weapon Block.

LiquidDamage--The only mod that's useful on that claw (on secondary for BF) are the +skills. Nothing seems to affect BF's speed. You might be thinking of kick attacks? The ideal second claw would have +2 skills, some useful staffmods, resists, +stats...and oh, why not MF?

I think that might make a great secondary claw for a Taloner, but my knowledge of that skill is pretty unreliable.

[LiquidDamage]

LiquidDamage--The only mod that's useful on that claw (on secondary for BF) are the +skills.  Nothing seems to affect BF's speed.  You might be thinking of kick attacks?

I never said Weapon Speed affected BF. Perhaps you missed the note next to the 30% IAS listing that said "(for weapon block speed, I hear it is based upon weapon speed. Again, I've never used dual claws)"?

Anyway, according to some posts I read at the Amazon Basin, weapon speed is what determines Weapon Block speed. Someone tested weapon block speed, varying claw types and IAS, as well as trying Guardian Angel. The results showed that Weapon Block used Weapon Speed to determine block rate, and Increased Chance of Blocking and Faster Block Rate do nothing for it.

I know that nothing speeds up BF, but thanks anyway. :)

[Crystalion]

according to some posts I read at the Amazon Basin, weapon speed is what determines Weapon Block speed.  Someone tested weapon block speed, varying claw types and IAS, as well as trying Guardian Angel.  The results showed that Weapon Block used Weapon Speed to determine block rate, and Increased Chance of Blocking and Faster Block Rate do nothing for it.

Ah, I summon Tommi! ;)

Furthermore, FBR speeds up the assassin's Weapon Block. It has the same speed as blocking with a shield, i.e. the normal FBR break points for the assassin apply to it

Which suggests a link to the AB posts would be helpful, so this issue can be verified/resolved... inquiring minds want to know!

[bigeyedbug]

Perhaps you missed the note next to the 30% IAS listing that said "(for weapon block speed, I hear it is based upon weapon speed. Again, I've never used dual claws)"?



I know that nothing speeds up BF, but thanks anyway. :)

Oh, my blind. :ph34r: Sorry about that. I am also curious about the WB speed issue if you or anyone else know more about it.

[LiquidDamage]

Which suggests a link to the AB posts would be helpful, so this issue can be verified/resolved... inquiring minds want to know!

I am looking for them. Damn, I thought you were the one that had determined this, and almost named you, but I wasn't sure.

Edit:

Haven't found them yet, but I did check the skills.txt file, and it has UseAttackRate = 1. That doesn't necessarily mean it actually uses it, but this may have been where someone got the idea, originally. It supposedly doesn't benefit from Increased Chance for Blocking, either, so it is somewhat logical, given these two pieces of information, to think that Weapon Block speed might be adjusted by IAS.

I am still looking for the threads, the AB search function doesn't seem to work like most search engines I am used to using, where putting something in quotes means you are looking for that exact phrase. If I can't find them, I will just test it myself with two dramatically different claw speeds and BoS.

[LiquidDamage]

Here is the AB post:

http://www.theamazonbasin.com/d2/forums/in...opic=3951&st=45

It is the second post on the page, by TrueMuppet. This may be inaccurate in 1.10, as it was posted in 2001.

I will test it and post my results. Also, I am dismayed to learn in my searching that weapon block lowers the durability on the right (primary) claw, so blade fury using assassins with ethereal claws do NOT want to go claw/claw if this is the case (I will test it as well).

[LiquidDamage]

Well, I grabbed an assassin with a level 8 weaponblock (47% blocking) and had my roommate fire guided arrows at me from a shortbow.

With 2 Hatchet Hands and no burst of speed, on compared to 2 greater talons with a level 9 BoS, I couldn't see a difference, visually.

I would say, then, that this means that block rate is not affected by IAS, but doesn't block rate work differently now? I thought I read (here we go again) that in 1.10 they attempted to remove blocklock by making faster block rates allow for additional blocks for some time after you block, without any animation.

Here is the thread I got this from:

http://www.theamazonbasin.com/d2/forums/in...topic=33333&hl=
(third post down, by Zath)

If this is the case, then my testing may very well be inconclusive, as my IAS may very well have increased my block rate, but my roommate's amazon can't fire guided arrows fast enough from any bow he has that won't kill me in one hit.

Edit:

Forgot to say that in our testing, no durability was removed from the claws I used. I probably blocked a total of 50 shots or so, because he just sat there pelting me with guided arrows for about 2 minutes.

[LiquidDamage]

Ah, I summon Tommi! ;)

Oh, you left out the second line, by the way:

Furthermore, FBR speeds up the assassin's Weapon Block. It has the same speed as blocking with a shield, i.e. the normal FBR break points for the assassin apply to it. In some cases, also the weapon wielded affects the block speed.

So maybe Tommi has knowledge suggesting that FBR as well as Weapon Speed affect Weapon Block. Perhaps it is base weapon speed and not IAS. Perhaps it only uses IAS on the weapon.

Perhaps I wish the source code for all combat related actions was publicly available. :(

[adeyke]

I thought that line just meant that amazons block slower when using a swinging weapon than when using a thrusting weapon. While in your quote, it seems that line specifically refers to weapon block, the actual quote from the page just has that at the end of a paragraph with all sorts of blocking explanations, meaning there's no implied connection to weapon block.

[LiquidDamage]

That makes sense.

[Crystalion]

Well, I grabbed an assassin with a level 8 weaponblock (47% blocking) and had my roommate fire guided arrows at me from a shortbow.

Admirable sacrifice, thanks! Unfortunately, as you say, your results are inconclusive.

This whole fbr = no-block-lock in v1.10 is very mysterious to me (I've not seen any good explication by code-reading or thorough testing). Because I don't know how it works I can think of several possibilities that would mean that your test wasn't sneaky enough to probe the issues.

I'll stick it onto my test list, in case the mood strikes me before someone else enlightens us. (I can do simple mods quite easily, which makes testing certain things much less opaque).

adeyke was right, I omitted Tommi's last sentence because I knew he was refering to zon weirdness etc., and I didn't want to confuse the issue here.

BTW, do shadows claw block?

[AtomicKitKat]

Been a while since I've played with an Assassin in a party, or any party for that matter, but do Assassins(or anybody else) make the "Clank!" sound when they (weapon or shield)block(from the viewpoint of other party members. I know it always sounds for the player affected) The clanking sound might be used to determine if the new "anti-block-lock" measures are working one way or the other(ie, if you still make multiple "clank"s while in block animation, you're blocking even while in block recovery)

If you don't understand the above, ask me to put it in simpler words. :P

[Caaroid]

However, I'd think that "clank" and blocking animation go hand in hand. That is, you do not clank when you block, you clank as part of the animation.

knowledgable people confirm please