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I sent Bolty a PM about 1.5 weeks ago asking if I could create a "links" page stickied in these forums which basically linked to lots of useful information all over the net for Diablo, however initially he pointed me to our Community page and asked if that wasn't enough. I convinced him most lurkers went directly to the forums and that a stickies page with all the most useful information would be best for everyone. However his suggestion about the community page got be thinking how I've never really checked it out before, so I started reading over the community pages and checking out their websites. Right away, I began feeling overwhelmed at the scope of this project, because I did not realize exactly how much useful information there was out there, not when I was so wrapped up in my own little world. Sure, I have my own useful site I visit, but this does not even touch the scope of what is out there, and all the information buried in the lounge itself... how do I find and organize all this useful information into something that makes sense with links? My initial thought was for more of a webpage style interface where you can click on a topic, it takes you to a section with other refined topics, and after choosing one of those, you can find a bunch of links to what your looking for. Here is an example of what I had been working on:
Quote::STICKY: (Links page. No comments allowed!)
!IMPORTANT! The community here at the Lurker Lounge is a LEGIT-ONLY community, and does not allow any cheating, hacking, or game exploits to be discussed for use in an exploitative way. Offering links to hacks or material objectionable to the Lurker Lounge philosophy is prohibited and will result in your banning.
::TOP-TIER::
Legit-Community
Strategy + Guides
Calculators
Information
Download-Links
Trading Sites
Single-Player/Testing Resources
::SECOND-TIER::
Legit-Community:
The Amazon Basin ::THESE ARE DIRECT LINKS::
Diabloii.net
Strategy + Guides:
Amazons ::THE FOLLOWING LEAD TO 3RD-TIERS::
Assassins
Barbarians
Etc...
Diablo Clone ::NOTE THAT THE FOLLOWING ARE LEGIT GAMEPLAY EXPERIENCES, NOT EXPLOITS::
Uber Tristram
Uber Leveling
Calculators:
Skill Planner (D2ITEMS) ::THE FOLLOWING ARE DIRECT LINKS::
Skill Planner (GERMAN WEBSITE)
Weapon Speed
Block Calculator
Etc...
Information:
Sites ::LEADS TO 3RD TIER WITH:Diablowiki,Arreat Summit,Frozen Keep (technical),Etc.::
Magic Find
Gambling
Skills ::THE FOLLOWING LEAD TO 3RD-TIERS - THIS INFO FROM THE LL AND ALL OVER THE NET!::
(i.e. the unlisted info such as how telekinesis works as a synergy)
List of battle.net commands, ::DIRECT LINK TO ANOTHER STICKY?::
in-game tricks (i.e. /nopickup),
and window tricks (i.e. -skiptobnet)
Download-Links:
Rune Word chart ::THESE ARE DIRECT LINKS::
Craft chart
Hireling Info.
Summons Damage Info.
Etcâ¦
Trading Sites:
JSP (forum gold) ::THESE ARE DIRECT LINKS::
Diabloii.net
Single-Player/Testing Resources:
Frozen Keep (Information) ::THESE ARE DIRECT LINKS::
Atmas
Hero Editor
Item Database
Any comments would be much appreciated. The more input you guys give me, the better this stickied links page will become!
"The true value of a human being is determined primarily by the measure and the sense in which he has attained liberation from the self." -Albert Einsetin
Posts: 4,063
Threads: 68
Joined: Feb 2003
Hi,
Quote:I sent Bolty a PM about 1.5 weeks ago asking if I could create a "links" page stickied in these forums which basically linked to lots of useful information all over the net for Diablo, however initially he pointed me to our Community page and asked if that wasn't enough. I convinced him most lurkers went directly to the forums and that a stickies page with all the most useful information would be best for everyone.
I suspect you've already seen this, but whatever you do should play well with however the new LL works or you will have done a lot of work for little gain. You are right that many people go directly to the fora. That is part of what Bolty is trying to change with the proposed changes.
Personally, I think what you want to do is good, but how you want to do it isn't. The fora are for discussion, the main site is for information. Taking the information out of the main site and putting it into the fora is a step backward. It replicated what we already have but in an inferior manner. I think that your effort would be better spent in helping to maintain the existing links page. Adding links, removing obsolete links (or at least pointing out that they are obsolete information), adding commentary about what each link contains, etc.
Also, a big part of extracting information about any game nowadays is identifying information that is no longer true. Very little of the information out there is tied to either a date or a game version. Often it is nearly impossible without much digging to resolve conflicts in the information and determine what is still applicable to the game at present. This, too, is maybe something you would want to consider in whatever you do. Perhaps something as simple as dating the links and labeling them with the game version number.
--Pete
How big was the aquarium in Noah's ark?
Posts: 1,920
Threads: 227
Joined: Feb 2003
Quote:Personally, I think what you want to do is good, but how you want to do it isn't. The fora are for discussion, the main site is for information. Taking the information out of the main site and putting it into the fora is a step backward. It replicated what we already have but in an inferior manner. I think that your effort would be better spent in helping to maintain the existing links page. Adding links, removing obsolete links (or at least pointing out that they are obsolete information), adding commentary about what each link contains, etc.
I agree with what you are saying here, however feel the transition would be that much simpler if the links page were already in place, IMO.
Quote:Also, a big part of extracting information about any game nowadays is identifying information that is no longer true. Very little of the information out there is tied to either a date or a game version. Often it is nearly impossible without much digging to resolve conflicts in the information and determine what is still applicable to the game at present. This, too, is maybe something you would want to consider in whatever you do. Perhaps something as simple as dating the links and labeling them with the game version number.
This is definitely true. I only have links for 'current' patch information, but if people wanted older patch info for some reason, I couldn't give it too them. I know this is backwards from what your are getting at, but the concept remains the same and dating information. Perhaps "dating" the info isn't what your referring too, but more along the line of, "sorting" the info based on its relevant patch. This makes much more sense.
"The true value of a human being is determined primarily by the measure and the sense in which he has attained liberation from the self." -Albert Einsetin
Posts: 4,063
Threads: 68
Joined: Feb 2003
Hi,
Quote:I only have links for 'current' patch information, . . .
Yes. Now, if you were to take those links to current information and make a page out of them, eventually they would be links to obsolete information (assuming Blizzard keeps changing the game). So when Joe Newbie shows up in two years, how will he know if the information is really current? You could, of course, commit to maintaining the links up to date, removing links to obsolete info and adding links as new info comes out or as the game changes. And if you did that, it would be amazing and wonderful. But, still, how would Joe know? Which is why I think putting a date or a version number (or both, for the logically challenged) with the links might be a good idea.
Quote:Perhaps "dating" the info isn't what your referring too, but more along the line of, "sorting" the info based on its relevant patch. This makes much more sense.
Yes. Linking the info to the relevant patch would be ideal. Something like "this page applies to version blah blah through bork bork." But that would be more work than simply saying "this page appeared on Septoper 32, 2055". With two such links, each referring to information that contradicts the other, knowing their relative dates is a very useful bit of data in determining which is presently correct.
--Pete
How big was the aquarium in Noah's ark?
Posts: 1,920
Threads: 227
Joined: Feb 2003
Quote:Hi,
Yes. Now, if you were to take those links to current information and make a page out of them, eventually they would be links to obsolete information (assuming Blizzard keeps changing the game). So when Joe Newbie shows up in two years, how will he know if the information is really current? You could, of course, commit to maintaining the links up to date, removing links to obsolete info and adding links as new info comes out or as the game changes. And if you did that, it would be amazing and wonderful. But, still, how would Joe know? Which is why I think putting a date or a version number (or both, for the logically challenged) with the links might be a good idea.
Yes. Linking the info to the relevant patch would be ideal. Something like "this page applies to version blah blah through bork bork." But that would be more work than simply saying "this page appeared on Septoper 32, 2055". With two such links, each referring to information that contradicts the other, knowing their relative dates is a very useful bit of data in determining which is presently correct.
--Pete
Ohhhhh! I understand what your saying now. No, I promised I'd maintain the links page if it were put up. This actually sound rather exciting to me, if I post the stickies links page, then people PM me with either more relevant information, or info they'd like to see that is not on there, and I can add it and/or make corrections. But this page would only be for D2, which is why I feel it would be best in these forums.
"The true value of a human being is determined primarily by the measure and the sense in which he has attained liberation from the self." -Albert Einsetin
Posts: 1,920
Threads: 227
Joined: Feb 2003
I've had a near complete rough-draft of this "stickies page" document sitting on my desktop since April, but have realized a few things since then:
1) Other sites have the same info, but do it better
2) Web-sites come, go, and change addresses (i.e. Planet Diablo)
3) Patch 1.13, which was suppose to come out at the end of April, is still not out - which is essentially all I was waiting for before submitting my page, that is until Planet Diablo got the boot which messed up some of my links.
So I suppose the real question at this point is if anyone is interested in this idea anymore. My enthusiasm for this project has waned greatly and the idea of maintaining the links for this obviously dated game seems trivial and otiose if no one else is interested.
Thoughts?
"The true value of a human being is determined primarily by the measure and the sense in which he has attained liberation from the self." -Albert Einsetin
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