Debuff limit will be changed to 16 in patch 1.7

[Drasca]

226k every minute from no resists and she has around 900k to 1 Million Health depending (slightly more, slightly less).
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It'd be nice to actually know your debuffs are on there. With the current interface, assuming no macros to help you, you simply don't know that's your corruption or curse debuff on the enemy. You can watch your combat log, but the graphical display simply doesn't show if that's your debuffs on the enemy. Its a nightmare just to figure out who's debuff is who's between 2-3 locks. I don't want to coordinate over 5 locks worth of debuffs. Each lock has a minimum of 4 debuffs and a maximum of over 8. Just one lock has too many debuffs on one enemy. 40 is trying to juggle a minimum of 80 debuffs on a fire immune target.

You propose a 5 minute battle? ~900k hp --> 3000 dps spread over a 40 man raid. You'd only have to avg 75 dps per player. Not that easy when you must pause for breaks, but not that hard either. Dps classes can temporarily easily do over 200 dps each solo when desired, and each maintain a minimum sustained dps.

If loot and debuffs weren't an issue, I'd love to see over 10 warlocks in an onyxia raid. All those improved shadow bolts.... drool.

[MongoJerry]

I wonder if with the 16 slot limit whether you can do some massive combinations of -damage on big boss mobs and render them practically harmless. Like, have every hunter keep a Scorpid Sting on the boss (-68 Strength and Agility) and every warlock keep a Curse of Weakness up. Doing that with a main tank with maximum tanking gear, and I wonder if bosses that deal physical damage could deal any significant damage.

[Lissa]

I wonder if with the 16 slot limit whether you can do some massive combinations of -damage on big boss mobs and render them practically harmless.  Like, have every hunter keep a Scorpid Sting on the boss (-68 Strength and Agility) and every warlock keep a Curse of Weakness up.  Doing that with a main tank with maximum tanking gear, and I wonder if bosses that deal physical damage could deal any significant damage.
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Weakness can only be there once. Other Warlocks casting it just overwrite the one already there. Also, the vast majority of high end bosses are immune to scorpid sting, I don't think I've seen any serious named boss in Scholo, Strat, BRS, and up that isn't immune to Scorpid.

[MongoJerry]

Weakness can only be there once.  Other Warlocks casting it just overwrite the one already there.  Also, the vast majority of high end bosses are immune to scorpid sting, I don't think I've seen any serious named boss in Scholo, Strat, BRS, and up that isn't immune to Scorpid.

Ah, too bad. Well, actually, it's good that this potential problem was taken care of. Still, I've always figured that the reason why the 8-debuff limit existed was to prevent this very thing. If this potential problem has been taken care of with immunities, though, then why have such a limited debuff limit at all?

[Quark]

Ah, too bad.  Well, actually, it's good that this potential problem was taken care of.  Still, I've always figured that the reason why the 8-debuff limit existed was to prevent this very thing.  If this potential problem has been taken care of with immunities, though, then why have such a limited debuff limit at all?
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Because you're a lazy programmer who figured debuff[8] was enough for the monster class and never really thought about it?

[MongoJerry]

Because you're a lazy programmer who figured debuff[8] was enough for the monster class and never really thought about it?

Nahhh... can't be. :lol:

[Arnulf]

The best part about the whole "DB cause" debate is that it ALWAYS sparks up midfight.

"No! South! South! We're too close together up north!"
"I thought we decided that proximity didn't matter?"
"Whelps!"
"Mage down!"
"South! Move south!"
"No! Chase her! Keep up the damage!"
"GET AWAY FROM THE WHELPS, YOU IDIOT!"
"thanks for the fast re-"
"Mage down!"
DEEP BREATH
Paladins:"Haha! We're alive! Wooh-"
DEEP BREATH
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/rofl :D

[Artega]

Because you're a lazy programmer who figured debuff[8] was enough for the monster class and never really thought about it?
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I'd attribute it to the apparent lack of a QA department for WoW <_<

[Zarathustra]

Ah, too bad.&nbsp; Well, actually, it's good that this potential problem was taken care of.&nbsp; Still, I've always figured that the reason why the 8-debuff limit existed was to prevent this very thing.&nbsp; If this potential problem has been taken care of with immunities, though, then why have such a limited debuff limit at all?
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The 8-debuff limit ws implemented to make sure 40 Druids don't destroy everything in their game with the uber DPS spell, Moonfire.

*pause*

</sarcasm>

[Kevin]

The 8-debuff limit ws implemented to make sure 40 Druids don't destroy everything in their game with the uber DPS spell, Moonfire.

*pause*

</sarcasm>
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I'm doing the math just for the heck of it. This post is a complete pointless ramble.

Hmmm (205 + 384) * 40 = 23560 damage in 12 seconds = 1963 1/3 DPS. Sure 35% of that comes for the front loaded part, but who cares. :)

That would be 117K per minute. So an 8 to 9 minute Onxyia fight with just moonfires. :) Plus healing, combat rez, potential bear tanking, innervates, and balls of wrath. Whelps would be an issue for 40 druids though. Sorry just have to get in on the silly 40 group ideas. :)


So yeah, addressing the fact that moonfire may be the worst DoT in the game. Moonfire is 96 damage a tick, 4 ticks. Certianly not the 142 damage/tick for 6 (instead of 4) ticks of a SW:P. :) Yep, Serpent sting is 98 per tick so it's got moonfire beat as well. Hmm is there a worse DoT in the game? Ah Garrote, 73/tick for 6 ticks. I think even consecrate will do more than that. Oh well, just rambling again.

[Quark]

So yeah, addressing the fact that moonfire may be the worst DoT in the game. Moonfire is 96 damage a tick, 4 ticks.&nbsp; Certianly not the 142 damage/tick for 6 (instead of 4) ticks of a SW:P.&nbsp; :)&nbsp; Yep, Serpent sting is 98 per tick so it's got moonfire beat as well.&nbsp; Hmm is there a worse DoT in the game?&nbsp; Ah Garrote, 73/tick for 6 ticks.&nbsp; I think even consecrate will do more than that.&nbsp; Oh well, just rambling again.
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Rupture - 62/tick for 3 to 11 ticks. And I find Rupture more useful than Garrote :lol:

Rip - Varies, from 38/tick to 122/tick for 6 ticks. 3+ combo points makes it better than Rupture (DPS wise), less makes it worse.

Rake - 25/tick for 3 ticks in 3 second pulses. But that's getting buffed.

[Kevin]

Rupture - 62/tick for 3 to 11 ticks.&nbsp; And I find Rupture more useful than Garrote&nbsp; :lol:

Rip - Varies, from 38/tick to 122/tick for 6 ticks.&nbsp; 3+ combo points makes it better than Rupture (DPS wise), less makes it worse.

Rake - 25/tick for 3 ticks in 3 second pulses.&nbsp; But that's getting buffed.
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LOL I play a druid I didn't look at the other two druid DoTs. :) Shows how much I use them. :) I do use rake for a cheaper combo point though since it is only 35 energy for me and claw is 40 but I don't pay attention to the damage. It's just something to get me a cheaper combo point at times. :) Rip I rarely use either. If I'm fighting heavily armored foes there is a warrior around to drop a lot of that armor and ferocius bite, even with the bug chance at losing combo points is still a better way to dump most of the time. It's definitely better against cloth wearers for me.

[Artega]

Rend is probably the worst. 147 or 199 damage over 21 seconds. I don't think it does the same amount per tick, however.