Thoughts on Majordomo Executus

[Bolty]

Once again, I had a blast last night running Sulfuras, Golemagg, and Majordomo with the Avarice alliance in Molten Core. You guys are the bombx0r, despite the fact that you put Zippyy in my group.

Anyhow, we had a few noble attempts on Majordomo but came up short in the end. Am I getting ahead of myself too much to post my ideas? Yes? Too bad - I'm doing so anyway! :)

I don't know every facet of this fight - I'm still a little unclear on what the whole shield thing is with Domo's healers. But the basic setup, from what I gathered on my first meeting, is that you have Domo himself, who will submit once you defeat his 8 guardians. Four of them are warriors, and 4 are healers. The healers are sheepable and must be kept sheeped at all times, although apparently they can still cast a reflective shield on themselves WHILE THEY'RE SHEEPED. Haxx! This will result in a Mage sheeping themselves when casting it on a shielded healer.

We had a little talk in Healerchat after our wipes. Quite a few of us bought the farm while still having a significant chunk of mana left because of Domo himself running over and smacking us down. Takes only 2 hits to kill a Priest. This happened to me personally on both fights. On the second fight, he killed me and I got res'ed by our OOC resser. I immediately went back to healing my assigned tank, Darian, but I knew what was going to happen.

Domo was still in the area, picking on another healer, and the moment my heal landed on Darian he came for me once again. Since I had just been ressed, I only had 1200 hps or so - but I was ready, immediately smacking Fade before he even started moving to me and watching Domo zip off to pick on someone else.

A second later I got smacked by a fireball from behind and hit the dirt again. Never did see from whom it came from. :(

Anyhow, from my perspective (since I'm really only aware of about half of what's going on), Domo prevented me from doing my job three times. This isn't a complaint post, it's a "what can we do to stop this" post. I don't know if this was the only major problem during the Domo fights or not; I'm just posting what I saw as the healers' largest obstacle.

Domo has a move that wipes his aggro list from time to time, so of course the first thing he'll go for are the healers. He moves at a pretty good clip, too, from what I saw, and it would be insanely hard for a warrior to keep with him and re-establish aggro while 3,000 hp heals are firing off on the offtanks. We need to figure out a way to do just that, though.

I think we could use a high-aggro ranged attack whenever he wipes his aggro list - something that would pull him back to the main tank so he can be taunted and sundered/bashed/whatever immediately. I don't know if we were doing that last night, but it's all I can think of. If the healers stay vertical, I think a lot of other things will sort themselves out. Healerchat was full of "down" messages in each fight, and those that do survive can't keep it going anyhow. No point in worrying about mana efficiency if we keep dying.

So I'm thinking maybe we assign a hunter to the main tank who can try to yank Domo back whenever he bolts free? Did we try that last night?

Please post your thoughts and observances of the fight. Like I said, I only saw about half of what was going on so I know there's a lot more that needs to be done. Hopefully we can have a battle plan set for the next time we meet him.

This is so much fun!

-Bolty

[Legedi]

I was giving some of the info I saw from my cousin take down Domo once. Now this was a few months ago, and at the time I really couldn't tell what everyone was doing. But one thing he told me after the fight is they made on group that tanked Domo. It had 1 warrior, 1 paladin, 1 priest, 2 hunters (preferable survival spec for extra HP and reduced feign resist).

It's obvious what the warrior and priest did.

The paladin’s job was to stand in the very center of domo (I'm not positive this still works, but I think we should try and find out). This way he would be ported into the pit instead of the warrior. The paladin could then heal any damage he took, and also backup the priest as needed.

The hunter’s job was to pull back Domo to the warrior every time he ran off. And they didn't just use distracting shot or what ever it's called. Every time he ran off they would lay into him as hard as they could. The reasoning behind this was that even if the hunters build more aggro then needed it is infinitely better then healers getting 1-2 shotted. Hunters can also feign, take a few hits, and the warrior should be right next to them to taunt domo.

Basically you have to do what ever you can to keep Domo from killing the healers, and one or even two warriors is not going to work. You need the hunter for the range aggro they can do on Domo.

[Tal]

I like the hunter pull back idea - I had very little success in containing Domo when Shal was backing up the Beast. When I did finally get control of him I was way outside the range of my healer. :(

[savaughn]

Every time he ran off they would lay into him as hard as they could. The reasoning behind this was that even if the hunters build more aggro then needed it is infinitely better then healers getting 1-2 shotted. Hunters can also feign, take a few hits, and the warrior should be right next to them to taunt domo.
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There's a couple fights like this where you get your aggro zeroed out and the squishies are in trouble. You need to have a couple people who can do really high levels of ranged threat. Distracting shot is good but like you said - it's not enough. You have to lay in with everything you've got. Good to do in pairs in case you get resists. I've also heard of folks using shadow priests to Mind Blast but that seems nuts to me.

The goal is to turn whatever boss it is around and have him head towards the distracting team. Generally there's two warriors standing in between the boss and the distracting team who'll both try to taunt the boss inbound. (Having only one warrior means you have a scary moment if the taunt is resisted.)

[Legedi]

Generally there's two warriors standing in between the boss and the distracting team who'll both try to taunt the boss inbound.  (Having only one warrior means you have a scary moment if the taunt is resisted.)
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I think two warriors would be better than one. It would just depend how many warrior we have. You really want one on each warrior/healer, one on Domo, and one to roam and pick up anything that is lose. So that is six right there. If you have more than six I say he should probably be put on Domo.

[Kevin]

I had to leave after Sulfuron (and really I probably shouldn't have even been there for that).

Did we not try the hunter pets on Domo like we discussed after the first time we tried him?

Domo does move faster than a tank can move and you have to be very very quick and have some luck with taunts and sunders to keep him on you after he teleports whoever (and he actually teleported hunters who were no really near him the times I was tanking him so I don't think the closest person to domo is correct). But I know we were going to try and put hunter pets (prefably ones with growl and cower and dash) on him to try and keep him closer to the middle or at least have him on something other than a squishy. Just wondering if that happened at all.

I do like the idea of a hunter on him. I did try some stance switching to intercept but it didn't always work.

I do agree that he is the biggest issue with the fight, zipping off and smacking a healer is a very bad thing. So I like the hunter pull back idea if the hunter pets don't keep him close.

I know that when I tanked him there were times that all I would have needed was just a split second longer of him not moving for taunt or sunder to be back. I tried keeping rends up on him but that is not enough aggro (though I do think it provided enough time to land the critical sunder/taunt a few times).

Anyway I was hoping to check the boards and see a domo victory thread. Wish I could have been there.

[TheDragoon]

I think two warriors would be better than one. It would just depend how many warrior we have. You really want one on each warrior/healer, one on Domo, and one to roam and pick up anything that is lose. So that is six right there. If you have more than six I say he should probably be put on Domo.
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I think that we probably should have put the 6th warrior on Domo so that we'd have the 4 off tanks, and 2 on Domo. Yes, that leaves no "roaming warrior" but it seemed that Domo was the main problem for the healers and that tanking him with one warrior was a mess. I talked to Flyndar last night about it and he said that's what he's used to doing if you have 6 warriors. You just have to trust the mages to keep their targets sheeped.

[Mirajj]

I was thinking that to start the right, we need to have our pally/tank duo run across the pit straight at Domo. I know that they'll take some damage doing that, but a bit of damage is preferable to having all 8 bunch up on one side, forcing the pullers from the unbunched side out of range for a few seconds. It would also give us a very nice split off the start, with Domo where he is supposed to be, and the 4 Elites where they are supposed to be.

[Soraia]

Disclaimer: I started a thread on the Basin forums to ask our members on Tichondrius for advice. The Basin on Tichondrius has successfully taken down Majordomo in the past and successfully downed Ragnaros for the first time on Friday, 14 October. I figured if I should ask anyone, it's them. :)

Anyway, you may want to check out that thread for more information.

The healers are sheepable and must be kept sheeped at all times, although apparently they can still cast a reflective shield on themselves WHILE THEY'RE SHEEPED.  Haxx!  This will result in a Mage sheeping themselves when casting it on a shielded healer.

CTRA (or maybe it was someone else with a mod) pops up saying '5 seconds until Power(s)' or that sort of thing. JaduL of the Basin suggests resheeping targets when this goes off. I might suggest a periodic fifteen second or so resheep anyway just to be safe.

We had a little talk in Healerchat after our wipes.  Quite a few of us bought the farm while still having a significant chunk of mana left because of Domo himself running over and smacking us down.  Takes only 2 hits to kill a Priest.

I avoided being seriously visited by Domo until the very end in the second attempt last night. (Although I was looking at 142 health at one point.) In retrospect, I think I've had more issues with roaming priests than with Domo himself.

Anyhow, from my perspective (since I'm really only aware of about half of what's going on), Domo prevented me from doing my job three times.  This isn't a complaint post, it's a "what can we do to stop this" post.  I don't know if this was the only major problem during the Domo fights or not; I'm just posting what I saw as the healers' largest obstacle.

For a more general issue: Roamers are bad for the healers, be they warriors, priests, or Domo.

No point in worrying about mana efficiency if we keep dying.

True. We'll need to worry about this sooner or later though...

It might be a good idea for everyone to get a high Stamina gear set and switch into that for Domo. It may cost us mana but a dead Priest costs us even more.

So I'm thinking maybe we assign a hunter to the main tank who can try to yank Domo back whenever he bolts free?  Did we try that last night?

I like Legedi's suggestion for two hunters personally.

[Soraia]

When I did finally get control of him I was way outside the range of my healer. :(

To be honest, that's my fault. I lost track of you and wasn't entirely sure what you were doing after your target went down. I'll try to do better next time...

[Tal]

To be honest, that's my fault.  I lost track of you and wasn't entirely sure what you were doing after your target went down.  I'll try to do better next time...
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There is absolutely no reason to apologize. Part of being a tank is also dragging your mob around for healing range. :)

[Gort]

I've participated in 1 MajorDomo kill on Al'Akir (European server) as a mage, having missed the guild's previous 2 kills for various reasons. My job was to stand still, ignoring the chaos around me and make sure my assigned Healer stayed in his wooly coat. Nothing seemed to target me, was just a case of watch/sheep/watch/sheep and make sure to start casting the instant either the previous poly effect broke or when the 5 second warning went off. IIRC there were no specific positions assigned to individual tanking teams, it was literally left to the OTs to make sure their Elite went *nowhere* while the DPS was switched around. This was accomplished with assigned hunter pulls and a healer or two dedicated to each OT with the DPS left to fend for themselves with bandages pots and out of the danger area.

The order was something like the one posted on the Basin boards in the thread linked by Legedi already. 2 Elites killed, 1 Healer, 2 Elites/1 Healer taken down to 20%, then one of the remaining Healers killed, kill the 3 mobs on 20% and then do the last Healer.

I do think we were overcautious when setting up and positioning isn't important enough to justify the emphasis given to it in preparation.

[Darian]

I do think we were overcautious when setting up and positioning isn't important enough to justify the emphasis given to it in preparation.
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Yes... it is, for the tanks. The Elites have a 360 degree cleave, and therefore have to be spread out unless we want to expend twice the mana keeping the tanks vertical.

[Tal]

Yes... it is, for the tanks.  The Elites have a 360 degree cleave, and therefore have to be spread out unless we want to expend twice the mana keeping the tanks vertical.
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Yar. And all I can say is OWWW. Poor Shal went from 100% health to wtfpwnville in seconds flat.

[Legedi]

Yar. And all I can say is OWWW. Poor Shal went from 100% health to wtfpwnville in seconds flat.
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That's because your not supposed to tank all nine at once silly :lol: .

[Soraia]

Yar. And all I can say is OWWW. Poor Shal went from 100% health to wtfpwnville in seconds flat.

One moment you're alive, the next you're dead, splat. I didn't even get the chance to cast a Flash Heal on you...

I'm concerned that Mirajj's idea of running through Domo and his coterie will result in a lot of point-blank damage to that team and flatten them pretty quickly. However, I'm having a small issue picturing this scenario in my mind so I could be wrong.

[Trien]

In the raid group I run with, typically we have all the warriors spread out with the elites they're tanking to keep cleave damage down to a minimum, so for managing Domo's agro, we have all the hunters sic their pets on Domo with taunt on. Does a fairly decent job of keeping him in one place.\

Edit:

And as to kill order... since they become sheep immune once 4 are killed and we don't like having any healers around to do anything... 1 elite, then all 4 healers, then the last 3 elites. Just make sure whoever's watching the tanks on the elites are not wasting mana, and you can hold out for a long long long time (usually we assign a priest/druid/paladin team, and unless we have healer deaths elsewhere, we end up at maybe 1/4 - 1/2 mana if we're on the last elite to go down).

[martini]

One moment you're alive, the next you're dead, splat.  I didn't even get the chance to cast a Flash Heal on you...

I'm concerned that Mirajj's idea of running through Domo and his coterie will result in a lot of point-blank damage to that team and flatten them pretty quickly.  However, I'm having a small issue picturing this scenario in my mind so I could be wrong.
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What if the pally in the group goes in first, shielded? Would that help with the initial damage while everything else is getting sorted out and moved into their OT-ing positions?

[anadrol]

Once again, I had a blast last night running Sulfuras, Golemagg, and Majordomo with the Avarice alliance in Molten Core.  You guys are the bombx0r, despite the fact that you put Zippyy in my group.

Anyhow, we had a few noble attempts on Majordomo but came up short in the end.  Am I getting ahead of myself too much to post my ideas?  Yes?  Too bad - I'm doing so anyway!  :)

I don't know every facet of this fight - I'm still a little unclear on what the whole shield thing is with Domo's healers.  But the basic setup, from what I gathered on my first meeting, is that you have Domo himself, who will submit once you defeat his 8 guardians.  Four of them are warriors, and 4 are healers.  The healers are sheepable and must be kept sheeped at all times, although apparently they can still cast a reflective shield on themselves WHILE THEY'RE SHEEPED.  Haxx!  This will result in a Mage sheeping themselves when casting it on a shielded healer.

We had a little talk in Healerchat after our wipes.  Quite a few of us bought the farm while still having a significant chunk of mana left because of Domo himself running over and smacking us down.  Takes only 2 hits to kill a Priest.  This happened to me personally on both fights.  On the second fight, he killed me and I got res'ed by our OOC resser.  I immediately went back to healing my assigned tank, Darian, but I knew what was going to happen.

Domo was still in the area, picking on another healer, and the moment my heal landed on Darian he came for me once again.  Since I had just been ressed, I only had 1200 hps or so - but I was ready, immediately smacking Fade before he even started moving to me and watching Domo zip off to pick on someone else.

A second later I got smacked by a fireball from behind and hit the dirt again.  Never did see from whom it came from.  :(

Anyhow, from my perspective (since I'm really only aware of about half of what's going on), Domo prevented me from doing my job three times.  This isn't a complaint post, it's a "what can we do to stop this" post.  I don't know if this was the only major problem during the Domo fights or not; I'm just posting what I saw as the healers' largest obstacle.

Domo has a move that wipes his aggro list from time to time, so of course the first thing he'll go for are the healers.  He moves at a pretty good clip, too, from what I saw, and it would be insanely hard for a warrior to keep with him and re-establish aggro while 3,000 hp heals are firing off on the offtanks.  We need to figure out a way to do just that, though.

I think we could use a high-aggro ranged attack whenever he wipes his aggro list - something that would pull him back to the main tank so he can be taunted and sundered/bashed/whatever immediately.  I don't know if we were doing that last night, but it's all I can think of.  If the healers stay vertical, I think a lot of other things will sort themselves out.  Healerchat was full of "down" messages in each fight, and those that do survive can't keep it going anyhow.  No point in worrying about mana efficiency if we keep dying.

So I'm thinking maybe we assign a hunter to the main tank who can try to yank Domo back whenever he bolts free?  Did we try that last night?

Please post your thoughts and observances of the fight.  Like I said, I only saw about half of what was going on so I know there's a lot more that needs to be done.  Hopefully we can have a battle plan set for the next time we meet him.

This is so much fun!

-Bolty
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Here is my post from the carpe boards:

Here is the way i see it:

1. NEED two warriors on domo, with preferably two healers...dont need to be priests, just healers since domo hits soft. Domo will periodically just lose aggro for no reason at this point the other tank can grab, one tank should always have taunt up. His aoe is to crappy to let him run around and it adds to the confusion.

2. 20% life rule on adds to hard to implement. The guards are hitting to hard to tank them all down, we should be focuing on FOCUSED DPS on targets that have wariors/paladins on them to hold aggro. all of the raid waiting for dps targets and mark will be really necessary.

3. MA needs to make sure a tank is on something, and NO ONE BREAK SHEEP. If sheep is broken and no tank on it the whole raid support system can get destroyed in brief order.

4. We are moving more toward needing an autonomous group set up, in other words, each group should be self sustaining and have a job such as "tank an add". If we start to view things in this light we can assign groups to each add to hold them and let dps do their job by focusing dps.

While this encounter will get easier i think that we really need to practice good raid discipline each time we are in molten core. the most important thing right now seems to be speed in organization, autonomous groups with specific rules, and not a single person not using the MA and MA being clear on what target to focus ALL dps on as quickly as possible, simplifying the fights with many adds.

[MongoJerry]

As far as kill order, I suggest killing two elites, 1 healer, burn the other two elites to 20%, kill second healer, finish off the two elites, kill the last two healers as described here:

http://www.lurkerlounge.com/forums/index.p...indpost&p=88722

I don't like the "tank 3 elites until all healers are dead" tactic, because that requires four tank/healer teams to perpetually hold Domo and the three elites down. That requires a larger than necessary healing battery and doesn't give any breaks for people to regenerate mana. Plus, the margin for error is smaller if something goes wrong and Domo kills a couple of healers.

As far as tanking Domo goes, the typical strategy is to have two tanks. However, as I understand it, what Domo really does is teleport the person he is closest to, so I've heard that if the tank tanks him at maximum melee range and if hunters send their pets at him, he'll end up teleporting the pets rather than the tank. The Core's never tried this, but it seems like an intriguing idea.

Definitely spread out the guards when you're fighting.