Naxxramas Loot Spoilers

[MongoJerry]

Curse-Gaming has put up a nice page showing some of the items they saw at E3 that will be dropping soon in Naxxramas. These items will clearly be considered "tier 3" rather than 2.5, as all of it is much better than anything seen in the game so far. Of course, it will probably take months before anyone can progress to be able to kill the main boss in the instance. At least, I hope so.

[Mirajj]

I like the look of the neck off Kel. I also like the look of that +AP trinket. Might have found a replacement for the Royal Seal with that.

[oldmandennis]

MP/5 is the new spirit? It's on everything, making the 5 sec rule almost obsolite.

[lfd]

Of course, it will probably take months before anyone can progress to be able to kill the main boss in the instance.
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I think you mean "before Blizzard balances the fight so that it is actually possible", going by the C'Thun and Ouro disasters.

[lemekim]

MP/5 is the new spirit?  It's on everything, making the 5 sec rule almost obsolite.
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Actually it's mostly on the Shaman/Paladin sets. Since neither Shaman, nor Paladin have any kind of spirit-based in-combat mana regeneration, and both classes have trouble making use of the 5 second rule, Spirit in general is not a very useful stat to them. It is good that Blizzard recognized this, and made sets based on that.

As for the Priest set and the Druid set, both of them seem to sport ample amounts of spirit, with some occasional MP/5 thrown in.

[Tharn]

Have you noticed? There are no resistances on class sets.

[MongoJerry]

Keep in mind that these stats are preliminary and are likely subject to change. One of my guild's mages pointed out a discrepency between the mage and warlock helms:

Frostfire Circlet (mage):
22 Stamina
23 Intelect
12 Spirit
+68 Damage/healing
+1% to hit with spells
+2% to crit with spells

Plagueheart Circlet (warlock):
18 Stamina
25 Intellect
+33 Damange/healing
+1% to hit with spells
+2% to crit with spells

It seems unlikely that the two helms will have such divergent item values when the dungeons are released.

[nobbie]

Are the 1.11 test servers going up tonight?

[lemekim]

Keep in mind that these stats are preliminary and are likely subject to change.  One of my guild's mages pointed out a discrepency between the mage and warlock helms:

Frostfire Circlet (mage):
22 Stamina
23 Intelect
12 Spirit
+68 Damage/healing
+1% to hit with spells
+2% to crit with spells

Plagueheart Circlet (warlock):
18 Stamina
25 Intellect
+33 Damange/healing
+1% to hit with spells
+2% to crit with spells

It seems unlikely that the two helms will have such divergent item values when the dungeons are released.
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That's because somewhere along the long process of jotting down the values from a screen, down to the posting of the item stats on a website, some errors crept into these values. If you look at a different website (http://www.whataboutpp.com/) that shows off some of the Naxx loot, you will see different stats for the above 2 items:

http://www.whataboutpp.com/tier-3.php

As you can see, the Curse-gaming website mage helmet has an extra 35 spell damage, while the warlock one is missing 10 stamina.

[Legedi]

Keep in mind that these stats are preliminary and are likely subject to change.  One of my guild's mages pointed out a discrepency between the mage and warlock helms:

Frostfire Circlet (mage):
22 Stamina
23 Intelect
12 Spirit
+68 Damage/healing
+1% to hit with spells
+2% to crit with spells

Plagueheart Circlet (warlock):
18 Stamina
25 Intellect
+33 Damange/healing
+1% to hit with spells
+2% to crit with spells

It seems unlikely that the two helms will have such divergent item values when the dungeons are released.
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There is a possibility that not all the different sets have items with the same item level on purpose. Earlier bosses could drop the lower level items (the warlock helm and maybe the mage legs. I haven't looked at all the items so I'm just making this up). Then the later bosses drop higher level items (mage helm, warlock legs). I don't know what the purpose of this would be, but who knows.

[MongoJerry]

There is a possibility that not all the different sets have items with the same item level on purpose. Earlier bosses could drop the lower level items (the warlock helm and maybe the mage legs. I haven't looked at all the items so I'm just making this up). Then the later bosses drop higher level items (mage helm, warlock legs). I don't know what the purpose of this would be, but who knows.
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My understanding is that the sets will work like they do in AQ in that the bosses will drop quest items that you turn in to get your set piece. So, an item might drop that works for mages, priests, warlocks, and druids who can then turn that item in for their appropriate set item. This relieves the frustration guilds feel when loot gets streaky -- like say, when a guild gets 10 druid helms off Onyxia but only two mage helms in that same time, for example. I don't know for sure that this is how it will work, but that was my understanding at least and I certainly hope that is how it will work.

[Quark]

Gonna run some through the item sheet and see what I get for ilvls. If Blizzard sticks to form, the ilvls should be 86, so we can see what's off where.

And AQ's sets were off when they released even. Deathdealers recieved a few nerfs because they had too many stats for the ilvl. Apparantly Blizzard is making up the items first and checking, much later, if they actually work <_<

[Rinnhart]

Curse-Gaming has put up a nice page showing some of the items they saw at E3 that will be dropping soon in Naxxramas.&nbsp; These items will clearly be considered "tier 3" rather than 2.5, as all of it is much better than anything seen in the game so far.&nbsp; Of course, it will probably take months before anyone can progress to be able to kill the main boss in the instance.&nbsp; At least, I hope so.
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Redemption is fantastic for heal botting and absolutely nothing else. Yay, back to being completely outclassed by everything in PVP, again.

[Quark]

Bonescythe

Code:

Bonescythe Helmet
         Predicted ItemValue:    152.24  Actual ItemValue:   161.73
Bonescythe Pauldrons                    
         Predicted ItemValue:    112.66  Actual ItemValue:   108.51
Bonescythe Breastplate                    
         Predicted ItemValue:    152.24  Actual ItemValue:   156.67
Bonescythe Bracers                    
         Predicted ItemValue:    82.21   Actual ItemValue:   84.29
Bonescythe Gauntlets                    
         Predicted ItemValue:    112.66  Actual ItemValue:   108.82
Bonescythe Waistguard                  
         Predicted ItemValue:    112.66  Actual ItemValue:   110.68
Bonescythe Legplates                    
         Predicted ItemValue:    152.24  Actual ItemValue:   144.55
Bonescythe Sabatons                  
         Predicted ItemValue:    112.66  Actual ItemValue:   99.61
Bonescythe Ring                  
         Predicted ItemValue:    82.21   Actual ItemValue:   85.22

So some over, some under. The boots are particularly lacking. Overall, Blizzard decided that instead of throwing away itemization on Str (which costs twice AP for the same effect), they'd exploit the ^1.5 factor for this set. I wonder if Rogues will ever get an item that uses the item formula to our advantage.

If it's such a problem that it's unbalancing, well then obviously the values blizzard uses are wrong.

[Quark]

Dreamwalker

Code:

Dreamwalker Headpiece
   Predicted ItemValue:    152.24  Actual ItemValue:   148.15
Dreamwalker Spaulders
   Predicted ItemValue:    112.66  Actual ItemValue:   114.64
Dreamwalker Tunic
   Predicted ItemValue:    152.24  Actual ItemValue:   170.74
Dreamwalker Wristguards
   Predicted ItemValue:    82.21   Actual ItemValue:   86.40
Dreamwalker Handguards
   Predicted ItemValue:    112.66  Actual ItemValue:   113.77
Dreamwalker Girdle
   Predicted ItemValue:    112.66  Actual ItemValue:   110.83
Dreamwalker Legguards
   Predicted ItemValue:    152.24  Actual ItemValue:   155.45
Dreamwalker Boots
   Predicted ItemValue:    112.66  Actual ItemValue:   114.37
Ring of the Dreamwalker
   Predicted ItemValue:    82.21   Actual ItemValue:   92.86

And that's enough of that for now :P

[Quark]

Redemption is fantastic for heal botting and absolutely nothing else. Yay, back to being completely outclassed by everything in PVP, again.
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Hmm ... PvE set ... PvE rewards. Oh my god, it's like it makes sense!

In case you didn't notice, the Tier 2 reworking for paladins was a nerf for healadins. That strength is useless so often to paladins while raiding, yet there it is, taking up itemization points. I know a few paladins who are happy that their new set is like this.

[lemekim]

I wonder if Rogues will ever get an item that uses the item formula to our advantage.
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http://www.thottbot.com/?i=52856 well here is one item that is WAY overbudget. Does that count?

And seriously guys, please realize that whatever item stats are listed on Curse-Gaming are based in large on information gathered from various other websites, as unreliable it might be, and may not be entirely correct.

So when you see some numbers that seem way too small or too large to make sense, perhaps you shouldn't blame Blizzard on making a mistake in the calculation of the item stats (past precendents nonetheless), but perhaps the mistake came the "reporters" - after all, your best-friend's-cousin's-twice-removed-mother's-uncle's-daughter's-mother-in-law is probably not the most reliable source of information; or it came from simple typing mistake by a tired Curse-Gaming editor at 4 am on a Monday.

If you even look at the two items Mongo listed - Frostfire and Plagueheart Circlets, numerous other websites suggest that the values for those helms listed on Curse-Gaming are wrong. Unless we have a screenshot for every set piece, it's hard to verify the exact stats on these items, and all the specilations about set items being over/undervalued should probably be left for the PTR 1.11 (hooray for data mining), which is, apparently, right around the corner.

[Quark]

http://www.thottbot.com/?i=52856 well here is one item that is WAY overbudget. Does that count?

Interestingly enough, those were one of the Deathdealer's Items already nerfed. And no, it doesn't count. I don't want an item that goes over its value limit, that's just unfair to any item that doesn't. I want an item that stays within the value limit but uses it smartly. How many items have you seen with both +agility and +AP on it?

And seriously guys, please realize that whatever item stats are listed on Curse-Gaming are based in large on information gathered from various other websites, as unreliable it might be, and may not be entirely correct.

The Bonescythe stats on Curse match up from the ones Chalon gathered at E3, and Chalon is a pretty respectable rogue. I can't say anything for the rest of the sets.

[Rinnhart]

Hmm ... PvE set ... PvE rewards.&nbsp; Oh my god, it's like it makes sense!

In case you didn't notice, the Tier 2 reworking for paladins was a nerf for healadins.&nbsp; That strength is useless so often to paladins while raiding, yet there it is, taking up itemization points.&nbsp; I know a few paladins who are happy that their new set is like this.
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It is very easy to make the PVE =/= PVP argument when your class benefits in both environments from the same stats, Quark.

There is no "caster" spec for paladins.

[lemekim]

I don't want an item that goes over its value limit, that's just unfair to any item that doesn't.  I want an item that stays within the value limit but uses it smartly.  How many items have you seen with both +agility and +AP on it?
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To be fair, I don't think there any items out there that are optimized for the itemization formula for any class. I am not sure as to the exact stats, but if we take for example warrior items, lots of DPS items have a large amount of strength on them (Onslaught Girdle, http://www.thottbot.com/?i=40573), and if instead of that strength they split it and used certain amount of +AP and certain amount of +STR, the item could be much better then it is now (to the tone of 14 additional AP for that particular belt).

Someone mentioned, and the more I look at it, the more I share that feeling, is that if the items were indeed optimized for the formula, the players would be even more overpowered in relation to the new lvl 60s (and in part to the PvPers). The stats that could be achieved with perfectly optimized gear would be absolutely brutal. So Blizzard is basically "keeping the man down" artificially through exploitation of the itemization formulas, and lowering the speed of the weapons (e.g. the nerf of Death Sting, Dark Edge of Insanity).

Do not worry though, in the expansion we will be able to abuse the system as we wish, thanks to sockets!