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Treesh · 05-20-2006, 05:31 AM

Yes, our small little guild on Terenas walked into MC tonight, despite the horrific server issues, for the first time. We dropped Luci on the first try, with many, many folks who are completely new to MC. I'm so proud of our folks. Who would have thunk that our little guild, started by GG and myself just so we wouldn't have to be guild invite spammed all the time, would walk into MC and pwn, with the help of our wonderful Keeper friends! FOR THE HORDE!

LochnarITB · 05-20-2006, 09:49 AM

Congratulations on another little guild that could! (I think we can... I think we can...)

Sabra · 05-20-2006, 12:41 PM

Treesh,May 20 2006, 01:31 AM Wrote:Yes, our small little guild on Terenas walked into MC tonight, despite the horrific server issues, for the first time.  We dropped Luci on the first try, with many, many folks who are completely new to MC.  I'm so proud of our folks.  Who would have thunk that our little guild, started by GG and myself just so we wouldn't have to be guild invite spammed all the time, would walk into MC and pwn, with the help of our wonderful Keeper friends!  FOR THE HORDE!
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Holy Moly, Treesh! Well done and a hearty WOOT to our Horde Bretheran.

Tal · 05-20-2006, 01:33 PM

Treesh,May 20 2006, 01:31 AM Wrote:Yes, our small little guild on Terenas walked into MC tonight, despite the horrific server issues, for the first time.  We dropped Luci on the first try, with many, many folks who are completely new to MC.  I'm so proud of our folks.  Who would have thunk that our little guild, started by GG and myself just so we wouldn't have to be guild invite spammed all the time, would walk into MC and pwn, with the help of our wonderful Keeper friends!  FOR THE HORDE!
[right][snapback]110379[/snapback][/right]

\o/

Alram · 05-20-2006, 03:18 PM

Terrific! I wish I had been there. Congratulations to all. Who was the raid leader and who was the main tank?

Treesh · 05-20-2006, 03:19 PM

Alram,May 20 2006, 09:18 AM Wrote:Terrific! I wish I had been there.  Congratulations to all.  Who was the raid leader and who was the main tank?
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It was Morde and Otheo, although Conc being the stud he is, ended up tanking Luci for most of it because he was able to figure out where to stand to not give the healers all sorts of trouble. ;)

Concillian · (This post was last modified: 05-22-2006, 12:06 AM by Concillian.)

Quote:It was Morde and Otheo, although Conc being the stud he is, ended up tanking Luci for most of it because he was able to figure out where to stand to not give the healers all sorts of trouble.;)

Yeah it started out pretty hectic, with people getting on DPS a little early (well, a lot early) because I made a mistake on one of the guards (taunted at the wrong time) AND GG had a resist on feign. That guard went nuts and killed a few of the Aggro Monkeys ™ early on.

Meanwhile the #1 tank and maybe #2 tank went down (maybe the raid was still working on the #2 tank's target? I think he went down though) due to learning positioning both on the part of the tanks and healers. I didn't pay too much attention to positioning, I just put Luci somewhere that looked good and luckily the raid leader clearly noted DPS OFF and allowed me some time to get solid aggro before leaning into her for the last 80% or so.

The funniest thing to me is that the people who cared about the DPS meters were msging me on the trash up to Luci that I was leading in DPS, then there was speculation in /raid that I was fury spec'ed (as if to suggest I may not be that great of a tank choice, I think, I don't really know why it was mentioned, anyone who inspected me and Wimpy... the other choice, also a Lurker, would see that I was far better geared. Nothing against Wimpy, of course. I've just been 60 a lot longer than him and had time to collect a nicer set of tanking gear.).

To me it's pretty ironic that the leading DPSer steps in to pickup and hold Luci at 80%. Hopefully some of those people implying I might not be the best tank learned a little about warrior capabilities (and how much more good gear matters than talent spec for warriors).

I must thank Mav for keeping WF up, that surely played a big role in putting me so high up in the damage category. He also is probably the one who healed my misc damage, though not a big deal on the trash to Luci. This is why damage meters sucks so bad, I would never have been so high without Mav and nobody sees Mav's contribution. It also encourages the Aggro Monkeys ™, and I admit I was one on one of the ancient core hounds :blush:. Luckily he was almost dead, and I positioned his head away from the raid before he had a chance to spray everyone.

Overall, I was a little surprised about how routine and easy Luci was. We had people who knew we needed to de-curse and de-magic and really that is all the info we needed. The fight is easier than Venoxis in that there are no boss "Phases" or transitions. Luci doesn't hit hard or do anything to screw with aggro, or really much at all. And we probably actually killed her with 30 people or so given what happened in the beginning, I guess a lot has to do with average "blue" gearing levels compared to when MC was released. I guess I have to figure Luci is the first boss for a reason. Teach people to coordinate who is de-cursing and who is healing / DPSing, etc...

Mirajj · 05-22-2006, 05:29 AM

Quote:Overall, I was a little surprised about how routine and easy Luci was. We had people who knew we needed to de-curse and de-magic and really that is all the info we needed. The fight is easier than Venoxis in that there are no boss "Phases" or transitions. Luci doesn't hit hard or do anything to screw with aggro, or really much at all. And we probably actually killed her with 30 people or so given what happened in the beginning, I guess a lot has to do with average "blue" gearing levels compared to when MC was released. I guess I have to figure Luci is the first boss for a reason. Teach people to coordinate who is de-cursing and who is healing / DPSing, etc...

He's not that bad, really, especially if you have folks who know what to expect, and can help prep the group a bit. Simply knowing things like "4 mages have to decurse, and decurse only" sorts of things, can turn a couple of hours of wipes into a successful shot.

It sounds like you've got a good group, and I know several of the folks in that group from Stormrage. MC will get a bit harder, but also more fun (IMHO, after 10 months or so, I still enjoy going and beating on things in there). Gear does help quite a bit, but the skill of the player also comes heavily into factor. If you have a good group with good raid situational awareness, you'll be beating on things in there in no time.

Personally, I find that I really enjoy the Geddon and Domo fights. Geddon...well, he's the bomb, s'all you can say. Domo...even nearly a year later, he can really only best be described as semi-controlled chaos. But Bo-Peep has fun.;)

Good work guys, keep it up.

Tuftears · (This post was last modified: 05-22-2006, 10:00 PM by Tuftears.)

Big congratulations! Getting Lucifron down is a huge milestone, it means your raid knows how to put it together with 40 people, the rest is just follow-through. Next week, second tranq book and Magmadar, right? :D

Edit: added 'with 40 people', to clarify the cat-herding problems scale up significantly between 20-mans and 40-mans:)

Kevin · 05-22-2006, 10:33 PM

Quote:Big congratulations! Getting Lucifron down is a huge milestone, it means your raid knows how to put it together with 40 people, the rest is just follow-through. Next week, second tranq book and Magmadar, right? :D

Edit: added 'with 40 people', to clarify the cat-herding problems scale up significantly between 20-mans and 40-mans:)

Next week will actually be 3rd tranq book as we had a hunter who got in a run with another guild and got a tranq from that. We did make one attempt on Mags, but it was late. Terenas has been like Stormrage was after the first couple of weeks after game release lately. Up and down all the time. The raid actually started something like 4 hours late. :)

But even though Treesh, Mav and I (and maybe even some others not remembering well) won't be able to be there I'm confident they will get Mags down, maybe even Gehennas and Garr time permitting (we had 6 locks on that first run, I would love to hit Garr with 6 locks for the first couple shots at learning him as opposed to the 1 to 3 locks and only 3 to 5 warriors we seemed to have when learning him on Stormrage).

I had 3 resisted FD's the whole run, two of them were on the Luci fight and I died (I was appearently 5th on my own, 2nd with my pet on damage getting to Luci) and I died when I should not have. I know better and I was pissed at myself for when I died.

Xame · 05-23-2006, 06:01 PM

Quote:I must thank Mav for keeping WF up, that surely played a big role in putting me so high up in the damage category. He also is probably the one who healed my misc damage, though not a big deal on the trash to Luci. This is why damage meters sucks so bad, I would never have been so high without Mav and nobody sees Mav's contribution. It also encourages the Aggro Monkeys ™, and I admit I was one on one of the ancient core hounds :blush:. Luckily he was almost dead, and I positioned his head away from the raid before he had a chance to spray everyone.

Overall, I was a little surprised about how routine and easy Luci was. We had people who knew we needed to de-curse and de-magic and really that is all the info we needed. The fight is easier than Venoxis in that there are no boss "Phases" or transitions. Luci doesn't hit hard or do anything to screw with aggro, or really much at all. And we probably actually killed her with 30 people or so given what happened in the beginning, I guess a lot has to do with average "blue" gearing levels compared to when MC was released. I guess I have to figure Luci is the first boss for a reason. Teach people to coordinate who is de-cursing and who is healing / DPSing, etc...

I'm starting to really really HATE damage meters. I don't mind it if people are playing their role, but when it turns into a Aggro Monkey score card it becomes a danger to the raid as a whole. Instead of waiting that extra 0.5 seconds to let the tank get a better lock, they shoot early hoping not to crit. Bad bad behavior with 40 people where the odds of a early crit are high. Thankfully most of the Keepers and Lurkers will hold their fire until we get a good lock (the reason I believe we won in the end).

As far as decursing goes, I've seen this fight before in green/blues and this time I was ready for it. I swapped my epics for lots of mana and mp5. I looked more like a priest then a mage. I gave up almost 150 +dmg for 50 mp5 with 40% larger mana pool with +spirt gear to refill. The video I took of the fight shows me clearing almost 6:1 curses over ALL the other mages combined. I believe we as a group can do better. I'm very happy that we killed Luci with 30 people in a very very controlled fashion after such a rocky start not locking down the guards.

If we wait for a good sunder count at the start, get our positioning better and get the mages to cross party decurse effectively (or stop worrying about their position in damage meters!!!), this fight will be a cake walk.

On to Magi without the dwarf's fear ward.

Mavfin · 05-23-2006, 06:22 PM

Quote:I'm starting to really really HATE damage meters. I don't mind it if people are playing their role, but when it turns into a Aggro Monkey score card it becomes a danger to the raid as a whole. Instead of waiting that extra 0.5 seconds to let the tank get a better lock, they shoot early hoping not to crit. Bad bad behavior with 40 people where the odds of a early crit are high. Thankfully most of the Keepers and Lurkers will hold their fire until we get a good lock (the reason I believe we won in the end).

As far as decursing goes, I've seen this fight before in green/blues and this time I was ready for it. I swapped my epics for lots of mana and mp5. I looked more like a priest then a mage. I gave up almost 150 +dmg for 50 mp5 with 40% larger mana pool with +spirt gear to refill. The video I took of the fight shows me clearing almost 6:1 curses over ALL the other mages combined. I believe we as a group can do better. I'm very happy that we killed Luci with 30 people in a very very controlled fashion after such a rocky start not locking down the guards.

If we wait for a good sunder count at the start, get our positioning better and get the mages to cross party decurse effectively (or stop worrying about their position in damage meters!!!), this fight will be a cake walk.

On to Magi without the dwarf's fear ward.

Aggro control, like everything else, is something people have to learn. We still have some trouble with it on our 2nd raidlock runs. people not waiting for the tank to get a couple sunders in, etc. It's part of the learning process. May need to have the RL step on some necks and not have *anyone* start DPS on that fight till it's called, until people get smart about it and that's no longer needed.

(Yes, I hate damage meters for that reason, too. As far as Conc, hey, dropping totems *is* a shaman's job, regardless of spec, and topping him off is something I took on myself, as I know very well how fast a tank can die in there in just blues, and a dead tank holds no aggro and does no damage.)

Kevin · 05-23-2006, 06:42 PM

Quote:I'm starting to really really HATE damage meters. I don't mind it if people are playing their role, but when it turns into a Aggro Monkey score card it becomes a danger to the raid as a whole. Instead of waiting that extra 0.5 seconds to let the tank get a better lock, they shoot early hoping not to crit. Bad bad behavior with 40 people where the odds of a early crit are high. Thankfully most of the Keepers and Lurkers will hold their fire until we get a good lock (the reason I believe we won in the end).

As far as decursing goes, I've seen this fight before in green/blues and this time I was ready for it. I swapped my epics for lots of mana and mp5. I looked more like a priest then a mage. I gave up almost 150 +dmg for 50 mp5 with 40% larger mana pool with +spirt gear to refill. The video I took of the fight shows me clearing almost 6:1 curses over ALL the other mages combined. I believe we as a group can do better. I'm very happy that we killed Luci with 30 people in a very very controlled fashion after such a rocky start not locking down the guards.

If we wait for a good sunder count at the start, get our positioning better and get the mages to cross party decurse effectively (or stop worrying about their position in damage meters!!!), this fight will be a cake walk.

On to Magi without the dwarf's fear ward.

And this is why I'm mad at myself. I was trying to push my damage. It's pretty much all I can do as a hunter in MC if I'm not doing pulling, and I was relying on FD to let me do so. I knew the guard wasn't locked down, but he was also at 80% health from other DPS. I knew I was playing a game I shouldn't have of stay behind the other DPSers and hope a taunt and a few sunders landed (since taunt will give you the aggro that was already built you can get a mob locked down pretty quick even with some DPS going on that mob, as long as it isn't taunt immune). I was pretty much going with just auto shoot, and I got a few crits, hit FD and it was resisted. At that stage I should have just stopped attacking. The guard was already down to 60% or so though so I kept plinking. I saw the mob on Conc at that point and saw a few more sunders so I opened up. Got an aimed crit just before FD came back FD was resisted and the guard came and smacked me. Disengage didn't drop enough aggro at that point and I died like I deserved to, because I knew I shouldn't have been shooting at all.

And I freely admit the reason I was doing damage was because I had checked my meter during the set up time to see how I was doing. Curious as to how a beastmaster hunter with not quite as good of gear as the marks hunters we had, was doing for damage. I was 5th (2nd if you added in pets just a little behind Conc) and only behind one of the other hunters on just hunter damge (Drec) and that by just a little. So I freely admit that I died and hurt the raid because I wanted to stay up on damage meters. I should have just left it minimized and looked at it at the end of the raid like I normally do but I didn't so I got caught up in it.

The only other times I check it in raids or if I've changed my gear set-up and want to see how that affected things for me. Normally I've got it set to just display my personal details so I can see my miss and crit rates, but I actually went to check the total damage of everyone on the run and did bad things because of it. This is why I'm mad at myself. Set a bad example for the other hunters, endangered the raid, made life difficult for a tank, all because of a little ego boost.

And I've not been playing well on Marn in 5 mans lately and I'm not sure why. It really bugs me. I know I'm a better player than I have been lately, most of you know I am too.

Ah well. It was still very very cool to see Luci go down on Terenas. I've derailed the thread enough. Hopefully you guys there are there next week will be able to put up a Mags, Gehennas, and Garr down thread(s). :)

Mirajj · 05-23-2006, 06:44 PM

Quote: Luci doesn't hit hard or do anything to screw with aggro, or really much at all.

Wait until the run where your tanks get chain-MC'ed. That'll play a little havoc with aggro. Or have a tank get MC'ed...and AoE Fear folks into the Imp Cave....;)

Mavfin · 05-23-2006, 06:50 PM

Quote:Wait until the run where your tanks get chain-MC'ed. That'll play a little havoc with aggro. Or have a tank get MC'ed...and AoE Fear folks into the Imp Cave....;)

Yeah. On Sunday, I was MT on Luci. I hadn't much more than taunted him off the hunter that pulled, when he MCed me. 4 seconds later, I had to run and grab him before he pwned anyone. It was a credit to the raid, I was able to grab him, toss a sunder/revenge on him, and then look around to see if I was in a good or bad spot. I decided it was good enough, and settled in and finished the fight, but it was a little exciting to start.

Ruvanal · 05-23-2006, 10:18 PM

Quote:Yeah. On Sunday, I was MT on Luci. I hadn't much more than taunted him off the hunter that pulled, when he MCed me. 4 seconds later, I had to run and grab him before he pwned anyone. It was a credit to the raid, I was able to grab him, toss a sunder/revenge on him, and then look around to see if I was in a good or bad spot. I decided it was good enough, and settled in and finished the fight, but it was a little exciting to start.

Ah, that was why Luci chased Taunshu farther back in the cave than usual. I was wondering what had happened to net myself so much of the aggro to cause that. Of course Lucifron then Mind controlling Taunshu right after that made things somewhat interesting too (but somewhat safer for the raid overall).

vor_lord · (This post was last modified: 05-27-2006, 08:53 AM by vor_lord.)

This week, despite yet another server reboot (robbing us of 3 epics we were frantically trying to hand out before the reboot), we brought down Luci, Mags, and Gehennas.

We pushed to Garr with 34 people, but poor positioning led to a wipe at 18%. We'll get him next time.

Congrats to Xarhud who is the first Lurker guild member to get a Tier 1 epic set piece.

Tal · 05-27-2006, 12:31 PM

Quote:This week, despite yet another server reboot (robbing us of 3 epics we were frantically trying to hand out before the reboot), we brought down Luci, Mags, and Gehennas.

We pushed to Garr with 34 people, but poor positioning led to a wipe at 18%. We'll get him next time.

Congrats to Xarhud who is the first Lurker guild member to get a Tier 1 epic set piece.

Congrats! Sucks about the loss of the epics.:(

Tuftears · 05-30-2006, 07:02 PM

Congrats! Put in a GM petition, they should be able to get you those epics back. You'll need to tell them to whom the epics would have gone, and identify the time at which it took place and who was in the raid, I believe, but when they verify the claim, they're able to just mail the epics to you. Heh.

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