Political Action in Action

[kandrathe]

I suppose it's not entirely common knowledge for those who aren't Terenas lurkers, but I'm not in Canada either. I'm in the UK.

And this is kind of part of the point. The rest of the free world has had much more stringent regulations on this kind of thing for years, in some cases decades. "Freedom" vs. "security" ebbs and flows in a negotiated balance, but the existence of stable, free democracies (like Canada) that regulate more kind of makes the slippery-slope-frogs-boiling talk sound a little crankish.

The rest is just rhapsodizing. If you have the faintest clue about economics, you'll know that the demand for kids' toys is not going to go down, and thus, the equilibrium supply will remain unaltered. You can keep the secret freedom tunnel under your house locked for a few more years, don't worry. The jackboots are not yet coming for your tricycles.

Good to know. I guess the boiling frogs comment was hitting close to home then! :) Well, then you know the problem all too well. The only place more over regulated than some parts of the US, would be some parts of the EU. I can't imagine having to manage negotiating EU regulations for the likes of Germany and France, let alone the rest of your European motley crew! Btw, you could pass as a Canadian any day. Demand will not go down, however supply will go down and prices will have to go up considerably, unless you want the standard "Toys'R'Us" widget where 5 million of the same thing are made to defray the price of testing (an additional $1200 per component). Beyond the testing, there are strict guidelines that the product now has to have a permanent certification label which will add a cost to every toy. So, toys will be a luxury that some kids will not be able to afford. I wonder what the lead content of mud pies are? I guess it would depend on where you live. I would hazard it is lower than the mercury level in most seafood.

[Jester]

The only place more over regulated than some parts of the US, would be some parts of the EU. I can't imagine having to manage negotiating EU regulations for the likes of Germany and France, let alone the rest of your European motley crew!

Japan?

Btw, you could pass as a Canadian any day.

That's because I am a Canadian. I'm just in the UK. Blessings of being a dual citizen.

Demand will not go down, however supply will go down and prices will have to go up considerably, unless you want the standard "Toys'R'Us" widget where 5 million of the same thing are made to defray the price of testing (an additional $1200 per component). Beyond the testing, there are strict guidelines that the product now has to have a permanent certification label which will add a cost to every toy. So, toys will be a luxury that some kids will not be able to afford.

Adding a few thousand bucks to the production runs of toys will adjust its price by a very small amount. What is more likely than the price going way up is the diversity going down, as larger production runs compensate for fewer distinct products. Given that testing for even the most complex product could not realistically take more than the wages of a single employee for a single year, I really don't think this is going to have much of an effect on medium or large producers. What happens to small producers will depend on how they iron out the issues with small crafts producers during their yearlong break.

-Jester

[kandrathe]

What happens to small producers will depend on how they iron out the issues with small crafts producers during their yearlong break.

You can have any color you like, as long as it is blue.

[Hammerskjold]

Yeah, it was figurative. But, then again, we Americans sort of think of Canada as a northern province sometimes. :-) Who knows, maybe our politburo might decide you unsafe Canadians might do better as a part of the North American Union.

Pfft, never going to happen. Sure, right now a lot of people are all OMG Globama! USA is A-OK! But from a practical point of view, Canada will never be absorbed into 'Uhmerca, nation or continental union wise. Why?

What will obnoxious american tourist overseas claim they're from? Mexico? I highly doubt that.

As for quoting Leary, I think I'd check if Bill Hicks said it first.

[kandrathe]

Pfft, never going to happen. Sure, right now a lot of people are all OMG Globama! USA is A-OK! But from a practical point of view, Canada will never be absorbed into 'Uhmerca, nation or continental union wise. Why?

What will obnoxious american tourist overseas claim they're from? Mexico? I highly doubt that.

The reason Uh..Mericans claim to be from Canada, is that no one can get angry with Canada. So... What other English speaking country (which is getting harder since the past few decades has seen American English drift even farther from English) might we pretend to be from? Personally, I'd go for Belize myself.

As for quoting Leary, I think I'd check if Bill Hicks said it first.

Yes, which is why I actually credited it to the fictional character, Edgar Friendly, since I do know he did say it.

[Hammerskjold]

The reason Uh..Mericans claim to be from Canada, is that no one can get angry with Canada. So... What other English speaking country (which is getting harder since the past few decades has seen American English drift even farther from English) might we pretend to be from?

Try New Zealand. They're the new 'Canada'.

Having said that, seriously, give the North American Union bit a rest. It's not gonna happen. In addition to the reason I already mentioned. Every 4 years, any serious thought of doing so promptly gets dashed on the cold hard rock of reality. The losing side of the U.S. presidential election would not be able to gnash their teeth and shout 'That's it! I'm going to Canada!', if sovereignty were swept aside for a continental mega-union .

Not that I don't find this kind of talk mildly entertaining, I mean to me Lou Dobbs and Glenn Beck are masters of this kind of genre comedy. But really, even if the Amero is actually legal tender in circulation, it's still not even half as good as the Canadian spy coin.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,270413,00.html

Yes, which is why I actually credited it to the fictional character, Edgar Friendly, since I do know he did say it.

Uh huh. Look, Demolition Man is an ok popcorn movie. I'd even go as far as say possibly more entertaining than Judge Dredd. Using it to try to support some of your more hyperbolic sounding assertions, I do believe that's not playing fair to Wesley Snipes, Stallone, or Sandra Bullock so wittily named character 'Huxley'.

[kandrathe]

But really, even if the Amero is actually legal tender in circulation, it's still not even half as good as the Canadian spy coin.

I know that thing is evil, because the poppy's eyes seem to follow me when I walk by one.

Using it to try to support some of your more hyperbolic sounding assertions, I do believe that's not playing fair to Wesley Snipes, Stallone, or Sandra Bullock so wittily named character 'Huxley'.

Yes, I ignored most of the silly far fetched futurist predictions (e.g. pansy cops, frozen criminals, the 3 sea shells, etc.), but the main theme was that of a creeping legalism attempting to establish a perfect society. That theme of the film, as does the theme of 1984, or Brave New World, ring true to the nature of people and the process by which we eventually surrender our free societies to totalitarianism. The founders of America wrote extensively about this very topic, and predicted the eventual demise of their creation. So, here we are, on the road to hell, paved with good intentions.

This is the path we walk when we restrict freedoms because some people do not practice them in moderation, or when some other people find them annoying. For example, smoking in public used to be a common thing and we are on the verge of outlawing it even within a home, or a persons vehicle. The federal Congress, when misused, is a stupidly broad 2x4 of injustice which results in banning lead in toys, so that we cannot tolerate even the minuscule amount of lead that is used to solder the electrical components deep inside the "Baby wets herself" doll. Parental intuition should be enough to know that if the "baby wet herself" is disassembled and your child is sucking on the circuit board it might be hazardous. But, no, Congress must pass a law to horribly fine anyone who makes or sells a thing that has the potential to be hazardous, even when horribly misused. Justification for these laws are not based on the weight of evidence, or scientific study, rather they are based on the twisted nightmare scenarios suggested by some hearsay anecdote. It is horrible thing when a child is harmed, but our society of law must seek to correct or even to prevent this harm by trying to outlaw the offending mote. In the meantime, our society continues to ignore the majority of causes of child harm which are plainly available to anyone who truly wishes to protect children. I rather think that these "feel good" laws are used for political gain, because who could be against protecting children from lead.

[Kevin]

It sounds like this has gone from the apocalyptic end of all crafts business, thrift stores, libraries, booksellers and knitting grannies into a minor to moderate inventory purge for sellers of kids' plastic toys.

Maybe they should set up some kind of tax rebate to compensate for the losses.

-Jester

Edit: Whoops, they even gave classic kids' books the okay, since they're classified as collectors' items, not play toys.

There are other business affected.

Dealers pull mini-bikes and parts

Again they may not be a business killer. Though I did first hear about the story on the radio about a store in Springfield, MO (and I can't find a web link to that one, only this one). The on air report mentioned that one store was worried about going out of business because they had basically carved their niche in the smaller market. As mentioned in that second article, I've heard of some small track owners worried about going under.

Is it the end of the economy? No, not even close, but there are products that folks don't always think about and issues that folks don't always think about and this is one area where I agree that legislation is whacked out.

My views on regulation in general I'm not going to get into, but I'm not a fan of this piece of legislation and it's impacts are more far reaching than people realize.

[Jester]

There are other business affected.

Dealers pull mini-bikes and parts

Again they may not be a business killer. Though I did first hear about the story on the radio about a store in Springfield, MO (and I can't find a web link to that one, only this one). The on air report mentioned that one store was worried about going out of business because they had basically carved their niche in the smaller market. As mentioned in that second article, I've heard of some small track owners worried about going under.

Is it the end of the economy? No, not even close, but there are products that folks don't always think about and issues that folks don't always think about and this is one area where I agree that legislation is whacked out.

My views on regulation in general I'm not going to get into, but I'm not a fan of this piece of legislation and it's impacts are more far reaching than people realize.

I suspect mini-bikes will be covered under the exemption for the inaccessability of their parts; I don't think it's reasonable to assume that children under 12 will be taking apart their engines. Likewise with batteries. Paint is perhaps another matter.

As for ordinary bicycles, they may have to replace parts which are over the lead limits, although I'm not sure that's such a terrible thing in the long run. However, invenntory is still a problem, and if the government is going to ban the sale of something, essentially retroactively, they should at least provide tax credits to compensate.

Another thing to watch out for in a year, I suppose. I think Congress is getting earfuls from enough industries that they're already in full retreat. (I'm certain they didn't plan to "advance" to this extent in the first place.)

On the paint angle, now might be a good time to invest in custom lead-free paint shops. <_<

-Jester

[Kevin]

On the paint angle, now might be a good time to invest in custom lead-free paint shops. <_<

-Jester

The paint industry will survive. They survived when they had to stop using uranium too. :) Though it was fun when my physic teacher in HS brought in a plate that had a uranium based glaze on it. Very vibrant color, fun to watch the Geiger counter next to it too. :)

[kandrathe]

I suspect mini-bikes will be covered under the exemption for the inaccessability of their parts; I don't think it's reasonable to assume that children under 12 will be taking apart their engines. Likewise with batteries. Paint is perhaps another matter.

As for ordinary bicycles, they may have to replace parts which are over the lead limits, although I'm not sure that's such a terrible thing in the long run. However, invenntory is still a problem, and if the government is going to ban the sale of something, essentially retroactively, they should at least provide tax credits to compensate.

Another thing to watch out for in a year, I suppose. I think Congress is getting earfuls from enough industries that they're already in full retreat. (I'm certain they didn't plan to "advance" to this extent in the first place.)

On the paint angle, now might be a good time to invest in custom lead-free paint shops. <_<

-Jester

Lead in most paints and in ceramic glazes has already been pretty much outlawed.

[kandrathe]

I suspect mini-bikes will be covered under the exemption for the inaccessibility of their parts; I don't think it's reasonable to assume that children under 12 will be taking apart their engines. Likewise with batteries. Paint is perhaps another matter.

It's not the paint, its the alloys and battery that fail the 600ppm limit. Also, the law was also rolled out in stages, so by August, 2009 the limit drops to 300 ppm. Overlawyered -- CPSIA and Mini bikes

As for ordinary bicycles, they may have to replace parts which are over the lead limits, although I'm not sure that's such a terrible thing in the long run. However, inventory is still a problem, and if the government is going to ban the sale of something, essentially retroactively, they should at least provide tax credits to compensate.

Tax credits would make a bad situation worse. You would in essence then be taking billions away from the people to compensate businesses for the losses that the government over-regulation created. The other problem with tax credits is that in order to be effective, you need to earn a profit. For a bicycle store that just lost 1/2 it's customer base, that might be difficult. The problem here is over-regulation, because you and I know that selling bicycles is not chemically hazardous to children. Getting hit by a car might be a problem, but that is another matter.