Dual-wield sword Barbarian strategy?

[Lord_Satorious]

I recently got back into playing Diablo II and I started two classes, a Javazon and a dual-wielder Barbarian. The Javazon I understand and know what I'm going to do with her, but the Barbarian is a different story altogether. First off, is it even possible? Or would it be far too difficult to maintain a non-shielded melee character later in the game?

Right now I'm using a level 1 Double Swing 100% of the time as my main attack (the character is level 19 in Act 3 so far). I gotta say I cut through hordes of enemies with little trouble. I want to move into other combat skills, but I'm unsure into what ones. The Barbarian has many good combat skills, but if I were to use other combat skills, I think working with my strengths would be best. Frenzy looks good, certainly an improvement over Double Swing. The damage isn't as high as some other skills, but it seems to be made for dual-wielders. Stun doesn't seem useful because it reduces my insane swinging rate. I really don't have any real reason to stun monsters because they die within a single sword or just one Double Swing. Leap Attack is powerful (and allows you to jump around), but it looks to be more for characters using a single strong weapon, whereas I have two decent weapons--and if I want to jump I'll just stick two points into Leap and be done with it. I don't have Lord of Destruction, so I can't switch between two weapon choices (perhaps I'll borrow the CD from a friend though). Concentrate looks to be a main attack for users of slow, damaging weapons. Whirlwind I'm unsure about. A great crowd-cleaner, but I'm unsure about the damage and mana cost. I was thinking about skipping it and getting Berserk instead, doing a lot of magic damage to monsters. Any ideas?

Defense is obviously going to be an issue. I read a long time ago an article on Iron Skin vs Shout. Personally I like Iron Skin because it requires no upkeep. A max Iron Skin with a level 1 Shout adds to +320% defense. A max Shout with level 1 Iron Skin also adds to +320% defense. However, the former only has a 16 second Shout, so that's a lot more recasting, while the latter is a 54 second shout, so a lot less recasting with the same benefit. So should I keep my Iron Skin at level 1 and max out my Shout, or max out my Iron Skin and either use Shout when deemed necessary or forget about it entirely?

Right now, the only warcry I have is a level 2 Find Potion. Howl would be a prerequisite for all the other warcries (and it has it's uses at level 1). Taunt I've never really used. Battle Cry I don't use (should I?). Find Item I don't use. Battle Orders helps, but is it a skill good at level 1 or level 20? I mean I know it's useful at 1, but is it a skill that would warrant maxing out? Grim Ward is fantastic, so that's getting a point. Warcry is a skill for variant Barbarians, so no points there. Battle Command I don't use. Mana is not an issue due to a plethora of potions availble and the fact that I _gain_ mana with every attack (assuming I hit). Thoughts?

Last thing is items. I really have no idea other than some decent mana steal and resists where I can get them and lots of defense. Anything else or something specific I should be looking for? What should be prioritized?

Any references to pre-existing guides would help, as would general advice. Thanks!

[kandrathe]

Defense is obviously going to be an issue. I read a long time ago an article on Iron Skin vs Shout. Personally I like Iron Skin because it requires no upkeep. A max Iron Skin with a level 1 Shout adds to +320% defense. A max Shout with level 1 Iron Skin also adds to +320% defense. However, the former only has a 16 second Shout, so that's a lot more recasting, while the latter is a 54 second shout, so a lot less recasting with the same benefit. So should I keep my Iron Skin at level 1 and max out my Shout, or max out my Iron Skin and either use Shout when deemed necessary or forget about it entirely?

Currently, in v1.09, both skills grow linearly. You can divide 21 points betweent Shout and Iron Skin and still you get +%320 def. So, if that is your goal, I would think 30 sec, or 45 sec is more than ample time between Shouting. Shouting requires mana, which is a distraction if you want to be more melee oriented. If you don't want to have to worry about mana requirements, then put more in Iron Skin. Also, since this is DII (quest for gear), think about the gear you will eventually want to be wearing. Does it add +skills to Warcries, or Masteries, or just all Barbarian skills.

You prabably want to think about Natural Resistance, since you won't be carrying a shield. Concentrate also adds AR, Damage, and Defense, if you get into trouble with double swing. I'm a big fan of frenzy. A defiance Merc might help. Anyway, from your post it sounds like you are wanting to dabble in many different skills. So, do that. Just write this barbarian off as an exercise in learning the game. You will find out what does and does not work so well. Or, you could search through the old lurker lounge for some tidbits on Barbarians, like this one by Brista Safety Barb guide (long)

[Tuy]

I agree with everything Kandrathe said so I'm not going to repeat it. I haven't played Classic Diablo 2 since LoD came out, so I can't really remember anything about it. This is just based on LoD experiences. Two Barbs that I made were a Whirly/Zerk Barb and a Frenzy Barb, which I'll tell you about.

My Whirlwind Zerk Barb would use Berserk on monsters until his life orbs would get low then he would use Whirlwind to refill his Life and Mana orbs. Whirlwind is a good skill to invest in because although the damage starts out negative, it gets higher until it gets into the positives. The advantage with this build as opposed to just using Whirlwind on everything is because you can effectively tank for ranged characters. I'm not sure if this is what you want to do since you seem very interested in the defensive skills, and Berserk lowers your defense to zero.

You also seem interested in Frenzy. I've made a Frenzy Mace barb who is very effective. Frenzy isn't exactly like Double Swing. It doesn't have that dramatic increase in attack speed initially, but as you put points in Frenzy the attack speed will increase with every hit until it's as fast as Double Swing or faster. (I'm not sure how much Double Swing increases your attack speed. It may be 50% or 100% I think.)

Also, I'm not sure how good Battle Orders is in Classic Diablo 2, but it may be worth investing in. Also taunt is a good single point skill to lure those ranged attackers to you.

I hope this helps. :D

[Guest]

Hmmm I think I can help you here. I love barbs. I have made 12 level 99 babas and several more 90+

For dual wield, there are so many variants it isn't even funny. If I was starting out, and I had to choose a dual wield build to play with I guess it would be this

Weapons=Doombringer and Lightsaber both shealed. Very very fast. Absorb lightning, lost of life, ITD, and did I mention very fast? My favorite legit weapon combo in the game for dual wielders and 1/2 way cheap too.

Armour= Well of course a .08 valor (legit), but that is not very practical. Hardly ever drops, and most are duped. For PvM, I would say a close to perfect Gladiators Bane. 1500 defense, cannot be frozen, and some other great mods with damage reduction. If you use Frenzy, you wont have to waste a ring spot with a ravenfrost.

Boots= On any melee character, I always like wartravs. That 15-25 damage seems to be bugged, and the boots add str, vit, and MF, and faster runwalk. Cant ask for too much more. I just trade for some 30% mf ones. They are cheap and easy to get. If you are using frenzy possible the goreriders for crushing blow and deadly strike. There are so many great boots that you can use. IK, Nats (yes they are nice 15% fire and light resist, 40% RW)

Ammy= With frenzy more ias is always nice. With WW I would look for more stats, resist, leech, skills.

Gloves= Since WW is not affected by IAS (WHY WHY WHY) on gloves then I prefer a cheap pair of IK gloves for the 20 str and 20 dex. For frenzy some crafted crushing blow, leech gloves are nice, or the underused Laying of Hands.

Belt= String of ears, T-gods (great with LSABER for lightning absorb), Nos's coil. IF you need resist the disciple belt is great.

Heltmet= Arreat's face. You won't need a gaze as your defense will be very high. And arreats just looks cool. Arrreats has all the great mods + to skills and is just d2 godly.

As a king of Barbarians and the class, it really saddens me to see Barbarians feeling like they have to run around in Shaftstops, Gazes, and storms. PvP I can understand, but PvM? common!! You should hardly ever be hit, and leech faster than a chipmunk in heat with L-saber, and Doom. (both shealed)

Rings=I use C-grips.....Good crafted leech rings with resist are great. BK ring and ravenfrost are also good. IF you use Frenzy, and are not level 85 yet for the G-bane then a raven is a must. Cold frenzy is not pretty

I Like to max the following skills.

WW or Frenzy
Sword Mastery
Battle Orders
Shout
Iron Skin

Then other points as needed in Natural Resist, other skills, and warcries.

What I like about this BABA

1.) Go anywhere, kill anything.
2.) MSLEBS are your biatches (L-saber't-gods)
3.) Monsters don't have Eth runes so Defense mattes. With maxed shout and ironskin and a G-bane you will get close to a 5% chance to be hit in hell. This is great cause you Do not have a shield
4. ) you can make a great build for pretty cheap, cause all the BNET noobs want Iths and such
5. ) you don't look like every other EBAY BARB on bnet

Whirlwind is definatly the combat skill, but Frenzy is very viable and dominate also. Frenzy just suffers now becuase of the endless cow runs. Even in cows wioth warcry and battlecry (damage Red) frenzy can own in cows.

2 shealed scheaffers are also great with frenzy. You need alot of IAS but static really makes up for it. Great for Hell Diablo's 75% block too

If you have any more questions let me know.

Danny

[Nicodemus Phaulkon]

Armour= Well of course a .08 valor (legit), but that is not very practical. Hardly ever drops, and most are duped.

Yeah, that drop percentage really fell off with the release of 1.09 two years ago. :blink:

That's quite the godly shopping list you've authored, "Danny". Do you have any actual strategy to accompany it? I would assume that a dozen or so level 99ers would have garnered you quite a few playing gems that you could pass on besides the usual reference to skills?

Just curious.

[the Langolier]

Defense rating isn't that great in my experience.

Forget leap. It has such a short distance it is worthless. One point in leap attack will allow you to jump to were your cursor is pointing (assuming line of sight) regardless if you are targeting a monster or not. The only benefit of leap over leap attack is that it knocks back enemies within a certain range, but it takes many skill points to actually be useful anyways, so you can forget it.

One point in berserk should do the trick. I forget if there are physical immune monsters in classic, but that is what the skill is used for.

[Grayloch]

...if you read Lord Satorious' post carefully, you'll notice he says he does not have LoD. Since virtually all of your recommended items are expansion-only, I don't think this is going to do him much good.

-G.

[Striker]

Warcry is actually a good skill to use, whether or not you're Variant Scum™. Very useful for the stun, especially for the tougher monsters in Act IV.

I would drop some spare points into Battle Orders. Max out your other skills first, then put an extras here. This is usually the third or sometimes fourth skill I max out.

I would do the standard thing that most barbs do and place one point into Battle Command. Cast it first, and have your other warcries last a smidge longer.

Here's a link to one of the strategy guides hosted here. Old, and more than likely some things are out of date, but it's a good starting point.

[Hammerskjold]

>I forget if there are physical immune monsters in classic,

There sure are. I believe Wraiths and Swarm type monsters gets physical immunities in Hell difficulty.

[Guest]

I did a 2x sword barb waaaay back when in classic, im not sure that he was any better than my sword/shield barb but he sure looked cooler. :D As far as equip, well all I can suggest, this being classic would be good rares wich are random (dupes are bad, do not trade for rare things that are called by name <_< ) , best thing you could do for weapons would be to imbue 2 executioner swords.

Weapons: 2 good rare exec swords
Armor: High defense Ornate
Gloves: bloodfists are nice, as are hands of broc
Boots: cant beat good rares with fhr / frw
Belt: Again, rare
Rings: rare / cathans
ammy: eye of etlich, rare +2 barb /w leech

Since its classic, dont worry about ias if you're whirling, just go for high dmg and be sure to include some cold dmg, it helps a lot.

Skills:
Sword mastery - max (obviously)
WW- max
BO- max
Shout- 5 (if you dont have high base defense, dont bother here)
natural resist- 5 shield (as others pointed out) is your best source of resist, w/o it you need more here

thats basically what my barb's build was, if memory serves me, after all it was.. a few years ago.

[Guest]

Yeah, that drop percentage really fell off with the release of 1.09 two years ago.&nbsp;

That's quite the godly shopping list you've authored, "Danny". Do you have any actual strategy to accompany it? I would assume that a dozen or so level 99ers would have garnered you quite a few playing gems that you could pass on besides the usual reference to skills?

I meant to include a 1.10 valor also, as the mods and life are still great.

Strategy? Press right click and WW. You may do this through or around the pack or monster. Rinse and repeat. Press left click and kill p immunes with beserk. Not really much strategy to a Barb. I guess my strategy would be kill them till they are dead!!:-)

Most of the stuff on that list can be replaced with some items, and many like a Lsaber people will give you.

If you don't have the expansion orignal poster. GO BUY IT. It is like 19 bucks now. LOD is great. I have not played classic since LOD came out, and I am not very aware of the changes they made to classsic with 1.08 , and 1.09. I used to use the old soulsaw in classic diablo 2, or a nice lance. I miss the old river run days....

[Swarmalicious]

I was going to say something along the lines of Nic there, but as usual he beat me to it...

I Mf-ed for a year and found a single lightsaber, out of all the equipment you've listed. As for people just 'giving' these (once incredible) things away, well... that's just another sad testament to the state of affairs.

Open was created for a reason.

[Hammerskjold]

> I have not played classic since LOD came out, and I am not very aware of the changes they made to classsic with 1.08 , and 1.09.

Why did you give him an LoD answer when he was asking Classic?

>If you don't have the expansion orignal poster. GO BUY IT. It is like 19 bucks now. LOD is great.

So for your answer to work, he would need LoD or 19 bucks? Man, if I was to ask a D1 question, I certainly hope I can get better answers than, "Why are you playing D1? GO GET D2!"

>Strategy? Press right click and WW. You may do this through or around the pack or monster. Rinse and repeat.

Realms Beyond Diablo has a good article on Whirlwind. It's a few patches old, but hopefully it can give you some help. Personally, I never liked Whirlwind. But on the occassions that I did use it, I usually try to go around the monster packs. Rarely through, since with my fumble fingers I could stop in the middle, and get chewed and screwed.

[Guest]

I gave him a LOD answer to a classic question........ cause I am a idiot :-) :blink:

If you fumble with your fingers at end up in the middle of the pack, it will not matter with that build. You will have around a 5% chance to be hit, and/or you can use warcry.

I was telling him to purchase LOD because it is a great game. Well worth the 19 bucks. Trying to help a guy out.

Just hold the right mouse button down with WW and move it around or through the pack. It all depends on your leech, weapon speed, and defense. IF you have the defense and the leech, go through the pack and right back. If you are taking lots of hits and not leeching fast enough, WW on the outside of the pack.

And remember, you are a barbarian, you own those monster biatches

[Dozer]

Rings=I use C-grips

AHEM, are you saying you use 2 of these heavily duped rings?



BTW, sorry for linking to a dupe-sale website ;)

[Guest]

I got c-grips and rings like those from classic diablo. I have also traded for them. Everything in the game is heavily duped. and I have never had a rare dupe disseapear. If I have c-grips I use them. Unless i am playing a iron man build. It doesn't personally bother me to use c-grips, but to each his own

[Baylan]

Get away, get out, you disgust me. Knowingly using duped items? Not bothering you? Many a lurker would be more than willing to throw away the most uber item, no matter how much was traded for it if they believed it was duped. Get out, your kind aren't wanted here.

I got c-grips and rings like those from classic diablo. I have also traded for them. Everything in the game is heavily duped.

Everything in the game is NOT heavily duped. Not if you find it, not if you get it legitimately.

and I have never had a rare dupe disseapear. If I have c-grips I use them.

So you know you have more rare dupes? If you've never had a rare dupe disappear what about uniques? I'll say to you again. Get out, get away, we don't want you here. You ruin OUR fun. You ruin OUR style of play. Haven't you figured it out, or read the FAQ, or even the forum rules? DUPES ARE NOT TOLERATED HERE. NOR HACKS, NOR ANYTHING ELSE THAT IS OUTSIDE THE RULES OF PLAY.

Unless i am playing a iron man build. It doesn't personally bother me to use c-grips, but to each his own

And there is your unfolding, and here it is not "to each his own". Here it is about hack free, legitimate play. So be gone blasphemer. Go ruin someone elses game.

Baylan

[kandrathe]

I wouldn't, and I don't think any here would use a known duped item. IMO, using known duped rares is cheating. You may not know that your Vampire Gaze is duped, but by god if you have two rare rings with the same name and stats. Well it's not rocket science, is it?

[kier]

Yeah, duping hit hard on the europe servers, allthough I must admit no way near as bad as the US servers. I usualy go for odd % of uni if i have to trade off someone i dont know. On the europe server there is a differant duped ring i have seen, very similar allthough it has the atribute 15 all res instead (I think, I rarely bother looking if someone shows me there "godly" kit, i just click exit and then kill them, as you usualy find them in cows after they have rushed through every act).

I did find out one day what caused it though, allthough I should probably post this in the maggot lair, I'll mention it here instead :P

Very ocaisionaly you will enter a game, and a message from bliz will apear saying that this server is being closed down in 5 minutes. These games are known as bugged, and, with the knowhow, you can create duplicates of items. I found one a while ago, they are rare to find. I have no interest in these games, so left.

Interestingly though, these games are faults in the server, and not created by hackers :blink:

[ShadowHM]

Those who admit to cheating (and knowingly using dupes falls into that category) don't belong here.

From the forum rules:

No cheating allowed.
If you cheat in multiplayer games, you are not welcome to read or post at the Lurker Lounge. We ask you to respect the administrators' and posters' feelings on this matter and go to another site with less stringent rules against cheaters. However, if you choose not to respect our wishes, don't be surprised when you are met with extreme hostility from gamers who like to play games the way they are meant to be played. If you are ever caught admitting to cheating, you will be banned on sight.

So, if you wish to stay here, and attempt to start clean on a reputation, you had must abjure the use of all dupes or suspected dupes. It really is that simple. There are many here who reformed. You can too.