06-02-2004, 11:13 PM
(This post was last modified: 06-02-2004, 11:18 PM by SwissMercenary.)
Now, I was half-way across the country when the game first came out, and have only managed to get it the day before yesterday - I have also played the demo for a day prior to that. After the playing time I put in, I think I am able to answer one question: "Is it a Thief?"
Well, the answer is yes. I was very sceptical of ISA after the Ivisible War fiasco. I was also sceptical of the changes introduced (Body-camera sync, blue loot glow, etc). The game, however, plays like Thief. Actually, that is not entirely correct - it plays like Thief should have played. For the most part.
Gone are the times when you could see 3 guards charging at you, and just bring it on. The dagger is IMHO, a completely useless weapon - not that it particularly matters. Knockouts are also harder to accomplish - luring an alert enemy into a shadow, and circlestrafing them is impossible. Knocking unalert enemies, by hitting the front of their head is gone too. Flashbomb knockouts are also gone - they are only useful for escapes, or house cleaning in undead-infested areas. Overall, I think those changes benefit the game.
If you were looking for atmosphere, Thief has it. Seriously. You don't know the meaning of the term until you step into a hammerite factory - those places are more mind-boggling then even Soulforge (Which has a wonderful reference to it in the first hammer mission). And Bonehoard can't compare to the plague ship, the Abysmal Gale. Eeek. And I haven't even gotten to The Cradle yet, which I hear makes The Return To Haunted Cathederal look like Disneyland. The keeper areas are also wonderfully designed. As for the city... Each district has it's own feel. :D
Where ISA really dropped the ball, was in the game text. For instance, here's two quotes from the first, and the third games each.
"Before Death came,
The liars were made to feast upon the hands of the thieves,
And the thieves were forced to ingest the tongues of their liar brothers,
And we praised the Master Builder for his judgement." - the Hammer book of Tenets
"Builds your roofs of dead wood,
Builds your walls of dead stone,
Builds your dreams of dead thoughts,
Comes crying, laughing, singing back to life, takes what you steal,
And pulls the skins from your dead bones shrieking." - clay tablet in an abondoned Trickster temple.
"Only the virtuous can survive the Builder's trial by fire - the sinful are consumed" - Hammerite Prayer book.
"Says drinks of me, you'll never thirst; honey sweet from out him burst" - Pagan drinking song.
You can see the contrast between the former. and the latter, and I don't even want to go into the Thief 3 Keeper quotes. Three words: "Abuse of ellipses". I think that it would be safe to say that the ambient sounds added to the impact of the quotes from the earlier games, bringing me to the next point - briefing cinematics.
I think that I am most displeased by their loss. If you didn't appreciate the slow camera spirals out of level concept artwork, then I have no hope for you. Well, maybe I have some left. The voice-over text briefings can in no way substitute for those cinematics - it's a difference of night and day.
Now, I did notice one disliked change - the new hammerites. They barely look like the tall, and feared religious fanatics of the first two games (You could just imagine them standing at a street corner, leaning on their hammer). These hammerites look more like fat ninjas, erm guards, with, well hammers. While their new attack animations look great (Especially when the overhead swing), their new weapons are another story - I still can't help but think of them as inferior to the long, thin hammers they used to have. Can't compare to the good old "My hammer awaits thee, thief!", as they bring it up for the two-handed pummel, and strike you down. Getting cornered by one of them was SCARY.
The creature designs are great, except for the fishmen - their fins look as if they were... Glued on at times. The flesh golems (?) in the pagan areas are, on the other hand, a frightening sight to behold, while the invisibility spells keeper mages cast are just beautiful.
Sadly, the new eye candy is marred by the basic gameplay changes. Many stealth aspects have been seriously, and I do mean seriously dumbed down.
For instance, creeping, or moving while crouched makes no noise. No noise whatsoever. In the hammerite factories, all I would do is sneak around crouched, KOing, or avoiding guards - little effort required. Additionally, the climbing gloves, as well as wall-hugging make hiding way too easy - if you managed to turn a corner. Otherwise, the gloves are not very useful in many of the city areas (I am having fun using them in the keeper missions), due to the overwhelming number of pipes. Well, I did manage to get up to the top of the highest tower, in Old Quarter, by jumping from another building, and avoiding the pipe. From there, I could go, or actually fall off the map - who needs WoW? :P
The fence system is allright. It's not great, but it's allright. It does force me to keep laundry lists of who stocks what items... I do greatly dislike the items carrying over from mission to mission. Part of the appeal of Thief, was that you don't need to conserve your equipment for later missions - only the one you are in. Now, when I play, I use very few items - hardly ever need water arrows, little use for moss, flashbombs, and mines. I do use up my holy water, and fire arrows on zombies, but otherwise, my items stay with me. The only problem is, there is a limit to the amount of items you can carry - and the game lets you pick more up, even though you are full. :angry: Maybe I should have swallowed my thiefy pride, and read the manual before playing.
Now, the real gripes begin...
The new body-camera connection sucks. That's an understatement. The controls are cumbersome. Your body is unresponsive. There are some odd bugs with mantling. It's too easy to get stuck in a crack. Out of the box, the game is UN-PLAY-A-BLE. Thankfully, some fan-edited .ini files, and a few changes in defaults.ini (Namely increasing sensetivity, and reducing the HORRIBLE mouse lag setting to 0). Seriously, any person who implements .75 second mouse lag into a game should be flogged. I believe that there is a reason why people prefer playing online games on cable, instead of a 28k modem... Additionally, leaning is nowhere near as effective as it once was - I rely on sound more, and if you really want to cheat, switch to third person view (Which is nearly-unplayable. Can't see what's beneath your feet.).
Overall, I'd say this - Deadly Shadows is probably the worst of the series, but still good. Very good. That is, if you apply all those tweaks. Without them, it's abysmal.
Well, the answer is yes. I was very sceptical of ISA after the Ivisible War fiasco. I was also sceptical of the changes introduced (Body-camera sync, blue loot glow, etc). The game, however, plays like Thief. Actually, that is not entirely correct - it plays like Thief should have played. For the most part.
Gone are the times when you could see 3 guards charging at you, and just bring it on. The dagger is IMHO, a completely useless weapon - not that it particularly matters. Knockouts are also harder to accomplish - luring an alert enemy into a shadow, and circlestrafing them is impossible. Knocking unalert enemies, by hitting the front of their head is gone too. Flashbomb knockouts are also gone - they are only useful for escapes, or house cleaning in undead-infested areas. Overall, I think those changes benefit the game.
If you were looking for atmosphere, Thief has it. Seriously. You don't know the meaning of the term until you step into a hammerite factory - those places are more mind-boggling then even Soulforge (Which has a wonderful reference to it in the first hammer mission). And Bonehoard can't compare to the plague ship, the Abysmal Gale. Eeek. And I haven't even gotten to The Cradle yet, which I hear makes The Return To Haunted Cathederal look like Disneyland. The keeper areas are also wonderfully designed. As for the city... Each district has it's own feel. :D
Where ISA really dropped the ball, was in the game text. For instance, here's two quotes from the first, and the third games each.
"Before Death came,
The liars were made to feast upon the hands of the thieves,
And the thieves were forced to ingest the tongues of their liar brothers,
And we praised the Master Builder for his judgement." - the Hammer book of Tenets
"Builds your roofs of dead wood,
Builds your walls of dead stone,
Builds your dreams of dead thoughts,
Comes crying, laughing, singing back to life, takes what you steal,
And pulls the skins from your dead bones shrieking." - clay tablet in an abondoned Trickster temple.
"Only the virtuous can survive the Builder's trial by fire - the sinful are consumed" - Hammerite Prayer book.
"Says drinks of me, you'll never thirst; honey sweet from out him burst" - Pagan drinking song.
You can see the contrast between the former. and the latter, and I don't even want to go into the Thief 3 Keeper quotes. Three words: "Abuse of ellipses". I think that it would be safe to say that the ambient sounds added to the impact of the quotes from the earlier games, bringing me to the next point - briefing cinematics.
I think that I am most displeased by their loss. If you didn't appreciate the slow camera spirals out of level concept artwork, then I have no hope for you. Well, maybe I have some left. The voice-over text briefings can in no way substitute for those cinematics - it's a difference of night and day.
Now, I did notice one disliked change - the new hammerites. They barely look like the tall, and feared religious fanatics of the first two games (You could just imagine them standing at a street corner, leaning on their hammer). These hammerites look more like fat ninjas, erm guards, with, well hammers. While their new attack animations look great (Especially when the overhead swing), their new weapons are another story - I still can't help but think of them as inferior to the long, thin hammers they used to have. Can't compare to the good old "My hammer awaits thee, thief!", as they bring it up for the two-handed pummel, and strike you down. Getting cornered by one of them was SCARY.
The creature designs are great, except for the fishmen - their fins look as if they were... Glued on at times. The flesh golems (?) in the pagan areas are, on the other hand, a frightening sight to behold, while the invisibility spells keeper mages cast are just beautiful.
Sadly, the new eye candy is marred by the basic gameplay changes. Many stealth aspects have been seriously, and I do mean seriously dumbed down.
For instance, creeping, or moving while crouched makes no noise. No noise whatsoever. In the hammerite factories, all I would do is sneak around crouched, KOing, or avoiding guards - little effort required. Additionally, the climbing gloves, as well as wall-hugging make hiding way too easy - if you managed to turn a corner. Otherwise, the gloves are not very useful in many of the city areas (I am having fun using them in the keeper missions), due to the overwhelming number of pipes. Well, I did manage to get up to the top of the highest tower, in Old Quarter, by jumping from another building, and avoiding the pipe. From there, I could go, or actually fall off the map - who needs WoW? :P
The fence system is allright. It's not great, but it's allright. It does force me to keep laundry lists of who stocks what items... I do greatly dislike the items carrying over from mission to mission. Part of the appeal of Thief, was that you don't need to conserve your equipment for later missions - only the one you are in. Now, when I play, I use very few items - hardly ever need water arrows, little use for moss, flashbombs, and mines. I do use up my holy water, and fire arrows on zombies, but otherwise, my items stay with me. The only problem is, there is a limit to the amount of items you can carry - and the game lets you pick more up, even though you are full. :angry: Maybe I should have swallowed my thiefy pride, and read the manual before playing.
Now, the real gripes begin...
The new body-camera connection sucks. That's an understatement. The controls are cumbersome. Your body is unresponsive. There are some odd bugs with mantling. It's too easy to get stuck in a crack. Out of the box, the game is UN-PLAY-A-BLE. Thankfully, some fan-edited .ini files, and a few changes in defaults.ini (Namely increasing sensetivity, and reducing the HORRIBLE mouse lag setting to 0). Seriously, any person who implements .75 second mouse lag into a game should be flogged. I believe that there is a reason why people prefer playing online games on cable, instead of a 28k modem... Additionally, leaning is nowhere near as effective as it once was - I rely on sound more, and if you really want to cheat, switch to third person view (Which is nearly-unplayable. Can't see what's beneath your feet.).
Overall, I'd say this - Deadly Shadows is probably the worst of the series, but still good. Very good. That is, if you apply all those tweaks. Without them, it's abysmal.
"One day, o-n-e day..."
