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Best Builds
05-17-2008, 07:44 AM
Post: #41
Best Builds
So I'm back after some years and what do I see? Astra still bashing heads in and out of the game...hehehe... some things never change.
Astra, this scepter you're talking about... it's still the one with MY NAME carved into it, isn't it?;)
Great to see old faces (Astra, Lunan)...others still around? Any hellriders left? You old geezers still play?
Im thinking about dusting off my Diablo CD, I will definately do so if some old faces show up so we can all beat up each other again =)
Cheers!
=)
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05-17-2008, 07:31 PM
Post: #42
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Why has no one outlined a build utilizing Torn Flesh of Souls? Clearly, all the builds posted so far are sub-par.

A plague of exploding high-fives.
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05-18-2008, 05:16 PM (This post was last modified: 05-18-2008 05:27 PM by FireIceTalon.)
Post: #43
Best Builds
Quote:Why has no one outlined a build utilizing Torn Flesh of Souls? Clearly, all the builds posted so far are sub-par.

Nonsense......


TFOS is quite useless, unless of course you are one of those people who loves experimenting with crazy variants and off-beat playing types. But the assumption here is that the char is normal and looking for the best and most efficient type of item for the particular build in question. Do you really believe a TFOS is better then an Awesome Stars FPM, or if you like low ac chars, an Obsidian Stars plate/mail?? Come on now.....

I play a low ac rogue in hell/hell, with the dream set up on my main: Obsidian Stars mail (scale mail 40%/11 to all), Royal Circlet, Obsidian Zodiac (amulet 37%/19 to all), Dragons Zodiac x 2 (rings 60/19 to all and 55/20 to all), Massive Swfitness long war bow (+97% damage, indestructible).....if thats a sub par build, then I guess there is no such thing as a good build.

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05-19-2008, 05:35 AM
Post: #44
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Quote:Nonsense......

Let me elaborate on what Sheep said... it's called humour.

"What contemptible scoundrel stole the cork from my lunch?"

-W.C. Fields
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05-19-2008, 03:15 PM
Post: #45
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Hi,

Quote:. . . Do you really believe a TFOS is better then . . .
First, let me point out that that should be 'than' not 'then' -- but that's a nit;)

I don't really believe there are 'better' characters, just better players. In the words of the JDAM song, given the ease of CD, "Well, hell, even Jerry's kids could do this #$%&, too." So if you've got the skill and get bored of being invulnerable, you look for the handicaps. It keeps the game interesting. Of course, if you need god-mode to enjoy, or even just to play, the game, then you go for the gear.

--Pete


How big was the aquarium in Noah's ark?

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05-19-2008, 04:40 PM
Post: #46
Best Builds
Quote:Hi,
First, let me point out that that should be 'than' not 'then' -- but that's a nit;)

I don't really believe there are 'better' characters, just better players. In the words of the JDAM song, given the ease of CD, "Well, hell, even Jerry's kids could do this #$%&, too." So if you've got the skill and get bored of being invulnerable, you look for the handicaps. It keeps the game interesting. Of course, if you need god-mode to enjoy, or even just to play, the game, then you go for the gear.

--Pete

Yes, a player should judged on his skill before his items, this I agree. Still, at high lvls when you are playing in the more difficult realms (in particular hell/hell) playing the more off-beat variants becomes more a "drag" then a true measure of challenge. I play a rogue with low ac and no ms in hell/hell at a very fast pace, which makes for exciting gameplay in co-op. Pretty much 3 hits from any melee monster is certain death, even with using the best items.

I could see a build using TFOS being interesting in the lower-mid difficulty realms, but rather unlikely for chars playing in hell mode.

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"Your very ideas are but the outgrowth of conditions of your bourgeois production and bourgeois property, just as your jurisprudence is but the will of your class, made into law for all, a will whose essential character and direction are determined by the economic conditions of the existence of your class." - Marx (addressing the bourgeois)
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05-20-2008, 10:01 AM
Post: #47
Best Builds
Quote:I play a rogue with low ac and no ms in hell/hell at a very fast pace, which makes for exciting gameplay in co-op.
Exciting is a relative term. What might be exciting for you can be tedious for others, and vice-versa.

"What contemptible scoundrel stole the cork from my lunch?"

-W.C. Fields
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12-16-2008, 03:55 PM
Post: #48
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Quote:every now and again someone comes around and asks "whats the best items for my class?" or "whats the best build i can get?"

so i thought a topic might be interesting to see what people think


wha do YOU think is the best way to build your favorite class and type?

Surprisingly people aren´t mentioning the Godly Tower Shield of the Ages. With that you could have a warrior with

Godly Tower Shield of the Ages (AC = 60)
Helm of Spirits (AC = 12)
KSOV
Awesome FP of Harmony (AC = 187.5)
Obs/Zod x 2
Drag/Zod

You have AC = 283.5 which is good enough + life and mana steal.

For a tank mage just switch out the Helm of Spirits for a thinking cap and the KSOV for a dreamflange and you´re good to go.
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12-17-2008, 01:16 AM (This post was last modified: 12-17-2008 01:17 AM by FireIceTalon.)
Post: #49
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Quote:Surprisingly people aren´t mentioning the Godly Tower Shield of the Ages. With that you could have a warrior with

Godly Tower Shield of the Ages (AC = 60)
Helm of Spirits (AC = 12)
KSOV
Awesome FP of Harmony (AC = 187.5)
Obs/Zod x 2
Drag/Zod

You have AC = 283.5 which is good enough + life and mana steal.

For a tank mage just switch out the Helm of Spirits for a thinking cap and the KSOV for a dreamflange and you´re good to go.

Godly Ages is pretty overrated if you ask me. Id rather use a Holy Tiger, but even that shield is overrated as well. Emerald Tiger rules all.

Perfect setup for a high ac warrior:

Emerald Tiger
RC
Awesome FPM of the Stars
2 x Drag Zodi
Obs Zodi
Kings Vampires/Speed and/or Haste

My warr has about 270 ac, max resists, 520 or so hp, about 300+ mana using that setup, though I prefer to usually play as a LAW anyway.

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"Your very ideas are but the outgrowth of conditions of your bourgeois production and bourgeois property, just as your jurisprudence is but the will of your class, made into law for all, a will whose essential character and direction are determined by the economic conditions of the existence of your class." - Marx (addressing the bourgeois)
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12-17-2008, 01:41 PM
Post: #50
Best Builds
Quote:Godly Ages is pretty overrated if you ask me. Id rather use a Holy Tiger, but even that shield is overrated as well. Emerald Tiger rules all.

Perfect setup for a high ac warrior:

Emerald Tiger
RC
Awesome FPM of the Stars
2 x Drag Zodi
Obs Zodi
Kings Vampires/Speed and/or Haste

My warr has about 270 ac, max resists, 520 or so hp, about 300+ mana using that setup, though I prefer to usually play as a LAW anyway.

Maybe. My setup allows for both life and mana steal. However, it allows for a high ac mage with +4 to all spell levels. The best you can possibly do is +5 to all spell levels and that comes at the cost of using Naj which means, effectively, no armor at all. I don´t think there is any competition there at all.
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12-17-2008, 10:16 PM
Post: #51
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Quote:Maybe. My setup allows for both life and mana steal. However, it allows for a high ac mage with +4 to all spell levels. The best you can possibly do is +5 to all spell levels and that comes at the cost of using Naj which means, effectively, no armor at all. I don´t think there is any competition there at all.

Yea on the warrior if you want to be high ac and still keep life/mana steal, then a Godly Ages might be necessary, though a holy/tiger could probably do the trick just about as well and you get more hp.

I really dont see the point of such a set up though. I was never a big fan of HOS, but thats just me. A warrior doesnt really need high ac anyway long as he got perfect block. I play the same exact way as a LAW that I would a standard warrior, minus blind teleporting.

as for the mage set up, a mage even more so doesnt need armor, lol. Any class that can be played naked is overpowered to begin with. But a good Artillery Mage using Naj and lvl 19 spells will rarely get hit anyway, and he has probably 300+ more mana then a tank mage does. If I want to go high ac on mage, id probably just use Lunan's build, as lvl 15 spells on a sorc are still more then plenty to kill fast enough. Perhaps only on 16 you might see a real difference when a lvl 19 fb can kill a BK in 2 hits, where a lvl 15 fb would probably take 3. I can see why someone would love to have the benefits of an Arty and a Tank all in one but such hybrid mages are weaker then both in their respective areas.

with my Arty i use the following:

Naj, TC, DF, Emerald Ages, 3 x drag wiz (or 2 x drag wiz/drag harmony if need be). Pretty standard, but the lack of ac doesnt mean much unless you are totally reckless.

on my tank/battle mage I use Awes Stars, Storm, RC, obs heavvens/zodi, drag zodi, and kings haste basty.....its like 285 ac with PB, lvl 15 spells, max resist, 830 mana, and 75-100 melee damage.....basically, a legit version of godmode.

Typing this post reminded me of why I pretty much only play rogue and warrior now, heh.

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"Your very ideas are but the outgrowth of conditions of your bourgeois production and bourgeois property, just as your jurisprudence is but the will of your class, made into law for all, a will whose essential character and direction are determined by the economic conditions of the existence of your class." - Marx (addressing the bourgeois)
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12-18-2008, 02:02 PM (This post was last modified: 12-18-2008 02:02 PM by weakwarrior.)
Post: #52
Best Builds
Quote:basically, a legit version of godmode.

I would only call it godmode if you had a couple of bountiful staffs of apoc in your bag. But yea, it gets real boring real fast. Incidentally, in all these setups your emerald shield can be replaced by an obsidian one and you could still have max resists.
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12-18-2008, 06:00 PM (This post was last modified: 12-18-2008 06:01 PM by FireIceTalon.)
Post: #53
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So where do you game at (WeakWarrior)? Usually im on USA East realm, channel Diablo LE though I will be in the Europe server at times.

Diablo LE was a great channel, its been in decline as of late for reasons I wont get into here, but still worth checking out if you want to get a game going with some legits. I play hell/hell co-ops and im very much into PvP. I dont play Ironman but there are some who do there. Stop by time if you get a chance.

Cheers

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"Your very ideas are but the outgrowth of conditions of your bourgeois production and bourgeois property, just as your jurisprudence is but the will of your class, made into law for all, a will whose essential character and direction are determined by the economic conditions of the existence of your class." - Marx (addressing the bourgeois)
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12-18-2008, 08:38 PM
Post: #54
Best Builds
Quote:So where do you game at (WeakWarrior)? Usually im on USA East realm, channel Diablo LE though I will be in the Europe server at times.

Diablo LE was a great channel, its been in decline as of late for reasons I wont get into here, but still worth checking out if you want to get a game going with some legits. I play hell/hell co-ops and im very much into PvP. I dont play Ironman but there are some who do there. Stop by time if you get a chance.

Cheers

I am in Argentina for the year - 3 hours ahead of the east coast at this time of year. What time are people on? I usually play around multiplayer on my own since the few times I logged onto battlenet I didn´t see anyone. The one time I did join a game someone was casting some weird spell I´d never seen, in town no less. I´d love to play though. Regarding pvp, judging by the equipment you have I think just clicking the pvp mode with you around will kill any one of my characters.

Back to best build I decided to try and get Wirt to sell me a Godly Shield (20). I figure my chances should be pretty good given that I only need the prefix. I found a few, but with the best base shield being 15 I wasn´t interested. I was thinking about it, and I began to wonder about Wirt´s item generation. Does he first pick the base item (let´s say full plate), then decide whether to put a prefix, if yes then decide which prefix (among those possible) to use (not king´s it´s not relevant, not holy - too expensive), then decide on suffix etc. Does he first decide on prefix then object then suffix etc...

My second question is has anyone tried a warrior build with AFP, unid´d Gotterdamerung, and a strange bow of burning (or whatever). With good accuracy (from the bow) and massive damage (naturally) I would think a warrior could do o.k., maybe as well as a rogue (the massive damage would offset the slower shooting).
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12-19-2008, 01:18 AM (This post was last modified: 12-19-2008 01:25 AM by FireIceTalon.)
Post: #55
Best Builds
Quote:I am in Argentina for the year - 3 hours ahead of the east coast at this time of year. What time are people on? I usually play around multiplayer on my own since the few times I logged onto battlenet I didn´t see anyone. The one time I did join a game someone was casting some weird spell I´d never seen, in town no less. I´d love to play though. Regarding pvp, judging by the equipment you have I think just clicking the pvp mode with you around will kill any one of my characters.

Back to best build I decided to try and get Wirt to sell me a Godly Shield (20). I figure my chances should be pretty good given that I only need the prefix. I found a few, but with the best base shield being 15 I wasn´t interested. I was thinking about it, and I began to wonder about Wirt´s item generation. Does he first pick the base item (let´s say full plate), then decide whether to put a prefix, if yes then decide which prefix (among those possible) to use (not king´s it´s not relevant, not holy - too expensive), then decide on suffix etc. Does he first decide on prefix then object then suffix etc...

My second question is has anyone tried a warrior build with AFP, unid´d Gotterdamerung, and a strange bow of burning (or whatever). With good accuracy (from the bow) and massive damage (naturally) I would think a warrior could do o.k., maybe as well as a rogue (the massive damage would offset the slower shooting).

In that case you are actually 6 hours ahead of me since im from the West Coast. Best time to check LE though is weekdays after 7 PM EST, or during the weekends. It varies however. People are in and out rather speratically over the course of the day. This is one of the last legit channels left on Bnet, besides a few in the Europe/Asia servers.

PvP just takes practice more then anything :) I duel with all classes but using a bow Rogue is my favorite. Having nice items certainly helps matters, but knowing how to move is probably even more important. Its why cheaters usually get smashed when it comes duel time: they have all the nice items in the world but dont understand the mechanics of the game, how to utilize those items, movement, how lag/desync works, etc etc......

Not sure how the wirt thing works. The only thing I know is that all items at vendors as well as drops are determined at the creation of the game. But the order of the base item and its affixes, that I am not sure of. Im not even sure if that can be determined. My guess is that its just random and can spawn given it doesnt exceed the price cap or other limitations (like Whale items may spawn only at Wirt). Like an Obsidian Stars full plate mail for example is too expensive to buy, but one could buy rags all the way up to a Plate Mail (at Gris at least).

ive seen people try warrior variants using a bow before. I imagine its playable, but no way would he be as effective as a rogue. A rogue with max dexterity would still do more damage then a warrior using a bow, as bow damage works differently then melee damage. The warrior can get crits with a bow, the rogue cannot....but even so, the rogue's damage is still more effective as she fires the bow much faster (especially if she is using a Swiftness bow of some sort) and her base damage will be higher then the warriors. This is what is so cool about Rogues and why they are my fav class: They are the most versatile of the 3 by far. Neither warr or sorc is that great with a bow, warriors are mediocre casters at best, and mages even with top gear still have low melee damage though just enough to be effective. Rogues however, are good at everything and outstanding with the bow. Their primary disadvantage is that they have lower hp then a warrior and less mana then a mage, and thus in some ways are more fragile then those two classes. A bow warrior Id think is playable but certainly not more efficient or as deadly as a rogue is.

Anyway hope to see you in Diablo LE, take care:)

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"Your very ideas are but the outgrowth of conditions of your bourgeois production and bourgeois property, just as your jurisprudence is but the will of your class, made into law for all, a will whose essential character and direction are determined by the economic conditions of the existence of your class." - Marx (addressing the bourgeois)
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12-22-2008, 09:57 PM (This post was last modified: 12-23-2008 12:43 AM by weakwarrior.)
Post: #56
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Quote:ive seen people try warrior variants using a bow before. I imagine its playable, but no way would he be as effective as a rogue. A rogue with max dexterity would still do more damage then a warrior using a bow, as bow damage works differently then melee damage. The warrior can get crits with a bow, the rogue cannot....but even so, the rogue's damage is still more effective as she fires the bow much faster (especially if she is using a Swiftness bow of some sort) and her base damage will be higher then the warriors. This is what is so cool about Rogues and why they are my fav class: They are the most versatile of the 3 by far. Neither warr or sorc is that great with a bow, warriors are mediocre casters at best, and mages even with top gear still have low melee damage though just enough to be effective. Rogues however, are good at everything and outstanding with the bow. Their primary disadvantage is that they have lower hp then a warrior and less mana then a mage, and thus in some ways are more fragile then those two classes. A bow warrior Id think is playable but certainly not more efficient or as deadly as a rogue is.

I found a strange bow of thunder with my warrior. Useless. And that was on regular difficulty/hell.
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12-23-2008, 11:40 PM
Post: #57
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Quote:I found a strange bow of thunder with my warrior. Useless. And that was on regular difficulty/hell.

Pretty much. Warriors and sorcerers only get half as much base (non-weapon) damage when using a bow as they do with a melee weapon. When you combine that with the slower attack speed and chance to hit issues, it is a pretty toothless attack. Thunder and burning can do big damage, but only to vulnerable enemies who could be killed easily with spells.

Even for a rogue, a bow is more effective as a companion to spell attacks rather than as a primary attack. Bow attacks are perhaps a bit underpowered in Diablo. They can still get the job done, especially for cautious sneak around type players.
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12-24-2008, 03:12 AM
Post: #58
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Quote:Even for a rogue, a bow is more effective as a companion to spell attacks rather than as a primary attack. Bow attacks are perhaps a bit underpowered in Diablo. They can still get the job done, especially for cautious sneak around type players.

True enough-which is why my immortal hero rogues rarely make it past Nightmare caves. Of course, another reason is the damage done by skeleton archers and illusion weavers (unless an ROE is found). Too bad Diablo doesn't have evasion items which would work like pre-1.07 of thieves items.
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12-25-2008, 01:49 AM (This post was last modified: 12-25-2008 01:50 AM by Vultur.)
Post: #59
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Quote:True enough-which is why my immortal hero rogues rarely make it past Nightmare caves. Of course, another reason is the damage done by skeleton archers and illusion weavers (unless an ROE is found).

Archers are always an issue.

Spell attacks are great; I'm currently playing a magic-heavy rogue in singleplayer (she's currently in caves). I already found Naj's Light Plate and I think that will be my final armor; this means I can get away with very low Strength, since the biggest bow Str requirement is 45 and I have plenty of +all stats from items (2 items "of the moon", which I hope to trade in for Heavens/Zod eventually). So I can boost Magic fairly high.
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12-25-2008, 02:45 PM
Post: #60
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Quote:Archers are always an issue.

Spell attacks are great; I'm currently playing a magic-heavy rogue in singleplayer (she's currently in caves). I already found Naj's Light Plate and I think that will be my final armor; this means I can get away with very low Strength, since the biggest bow Str requirement is 45 and I have plenty of +all stats from items (2 items "of the moon", which I hope to trade in for Heavens/Zod eventually). So I can boost Magic fairly high.
True as to value of spell attacks for a rogue. Unfortunately, Immortal Hero rogues cannot use spell attacks:)
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