South Park vs. Thetans

[Occhidiangela]

My favorite old testament lines regarding religious tolerance:
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Speaking of Semitic religions and their penchant for a unique spin on toleration:

On January 30th, Ayman al-Zawahri released a videotape aired in part by the al Jazeera network.  During the 10-minute tape, he taunts President Bush, whom he calls "the butcher of Washington."  Addressing President Bush, he said: "Not only are you defeated and a liar, but with God's help and force, you bring bad luck to your nation."

More flies with honey?

Most importantly and significantly, al-Zawahri invited Bush to convert to Islam: "If you accept, you will become a brother in our faith and God will forgive you your sins.”

But his is a universal message, sent to Everyman.

He said: "to the American people, who are drowning in illusions. I tell you that Bush and his gang are shedding your blood and wasting your money in failed adventures. The lion of Islam, Sheik Osama bin Laden, may God protect him, offered you a decent exit from your dilemma. But your leaders, who are keen to accumulate wealth, insist on throwing you into battle and killing your souls in Iraq and Afghanistan and God willing on your own land

VIctoria Alexander, a writer at fromthebalcony.com, provides the precedent for such magnanamous offers.

From Muhammad, the servant and Prophet of Allah, to al-Muqawqis, the leader of the Coptic tribe.

“There is safety and security for those believers who follow the correct path. Therefore, I invite you to accept Islam. If you accept it, you shall find security, save your throne, gain twice as much reward for having introduced Islam to your followers. If you refuse this invitation, let the sin of the calamity which awaits your followers be upon you. You too are People of the Book; therefore, let us come to a word common between us and you, that we worship none but Allah and shall not associate anyone with Him. Let us not abandon Allah and take others for Lord other than Him. If you do not consent to this invitation, bear witness that we are Muslims."

There was a guy named Corleone, who made people offers they could not refuse. With over two centuries of Muslim rule in Sicily, (859-1072) I wonder if the Godfather was channeling Mohamed, or one of his follower's, spirit. *shrugs* Who can say?

Occhi

[Doc]

What's stopping you?

Occhi
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I don't have a flock to follow me in my beliefs. Would you like to convert to the First Church of of the Majestic Magnificent Marvelous Mystical Mammaries?

Communion comes in regular or chocolate.

[Guest]

I just finished reading what Scientology is all about and, unless there is some hidden, second side to this "religion," all I have to say is....

"Holy cooking-crap in a crock pot, Batman!"
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Did you read the part about the spirits of aliens from another world?

[Occhidiangela]

I don't have a flock to follow me in my beliefs. Would you like to convert to the First Church of of the Majestic Magnificent Marvelous Mystical Mammaries?

Communion comes in regular or chocolate.
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That is an interesting take on the Divine Feminine, per Dan Brown's somewhat controversial novel.

Does your sect use Guinness in the baptismal font? :w00t:

Occhi

[Doc]

That is an interesting take on the Divine Feminine, per Dan Brown's somewhat controversial novel.

Does your sect use Guinness in the baptismal font?  :w00t:

Occhi
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We revere the fount of life.

As for baptism, what you are saying is akin to blasphemy... How dare ye waste a single drop!

Ye drink it, not bathe in it.

[kandrathe]

There was a guy named Corleone, who made people offers they could not refuse. With over two centuries of Muslim rule in Sicily, (859-1072) I wonder if the Godfather was channeling Mohamed, or one of his follower's, spirit. *shrugs* Who can say?
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Oh, another protection racket. Because when I look around the Islamic world, I see mostly muslims killing muslims. So, it must be more of a gang thing, than a religion thing.

[Premezilla]

Did you read the part about the spirits of aliens from another world?
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I did. It sounds like it belongs on the X-Files. Seriously. Do we have any Lurkers who are Scientologists? I'm interested to know if all the mind control that site talked about is actually true. I mean, come on. PAYING for mind control? taht suxxors.

[Jester]

It sounds like it belongs on the X-Files.
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If you combine the imaginative absurdity of a pulp science fiction novel with the calculating cynicism of a confidence scam, you have Scientology. It's pretty much that simple.

You'd think the fact that the founder was both a science fiction writer and a notorious fraud might have tipped people off. But apparently, faith manifests in some truly strange ways.

-Jester

[Premezilla]

But apparently, faith manifests in some truly strange ways.
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In the words of the immortal Wu-tang Clan.

"Make money. Cash money. Dolla dolla bill, y'all. HOLLA!"

Nothing makes people believe like the feel of a crisp bill in the wallet.

[Jester]

Nothing makes people believe like the feel of a crisp bill in the wallet.
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Of course. But what's so baffling is that the apparent corollary is not true. People keep coming even when they have to pay. Nothing would make me more cynical of a "religion" than a demand that I cough up cash. Even a request is a little seedy.

Not that I need any more reasons not to be religious. But still, I'd figure more people at the bottom would catch on, thus eliminating the lucrative room at the top.

-Jester

[SwissMercenary]

Speaking of Semitic religions and their penchant for a unique spin on toleration:

Speaking of all that, it is quite admirable how the US is displaying its tolerance for freedom of religion, which incidently may or may not include the freedom to execute sheep that stray from the flock, so to speak.

http://news.ft.com/cms/s/5f1b1db2-b948-11d...00779e2340.html

Bringing democracy and freedom to the Middle East must be going well, with the way Afghanistan is still being run by 'mullahs and militias'. Flowers in the street, a quick conversion to freedom, democracy, cheap and friendly oil, and Ma's home cookies indeed.

[Premezilla]

Not that I need any more reasons not to be religious. But still, I'd figure more people at the bottom would catch on, thus eliminating the lucrative room at the top.
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Perhaps it has something to do with the "I want to be in whatever YOU'RE in" mentality.

And sometimes, people are just stupid with their money.

[kandrathe]

Of course. But what's so baffling is that the apparent corollary is not true. People keep coming even when they have to pay. Nothing would make me more cynical of a "religion" than a demand that I cough up cash. Even a request is a little seedy.

Not that I need any more reasons not to be religious. But still, I'd figure more people at the bottom would catch on, thus eliminating the lucrative room at the top.

-Jester
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I get cynical when the church leaders are living in mansions, and driving luxury cars. Yeah, but just look around the world at what people get conned and convinced about and you need to be very afraid...

A fake Zimbabwean traditional healer has been found guilty of conning a businesswoman out of $30,000 to pay for "mermaids" to recover her stolen car.  The money was to have been used to import them from the UK, she claimed, and accommodate them in a local hotel.  Some of the money was to have been used to pay for a bull, whose genitals would supposedly help find the thief of her luxury vehicle.  Belief in animism is widespread in Zimbabwe, and across Africa.  There is a national association of traditional healers but the court found that Edina Chizema was not registered.  She had denied the charges of theft by false pretences but magistrate Sandra Nhau said she was not a credible witness.  Chizema had also asked for money to buy mobile phones to contact the mermaids and said she could solve the businesswoman's undisclosed "personal problems".  She is to be sentenced at a later date. -- BBC News Africa

... sure, people are gullible, but I might have drawn the line at the bull genitals. :blink: Scientology is entirely rational compared to some beliefs that are out there. Consider Heaven's Gate and the self castration, etc.

[Jester]

I get cynical when the church leaders are living in mansions, and driving luxury cars.  Yeah, but just look around the world at what people get conned and convinced about and you need to be very afraid...
... sure, people are gullible, but I might have drawn the line at the bull genitals.  :blink:  Scientology is entirely rational compared to some beliefs that are out there.  Consider Heaven's Gate and the self castration, etc.
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Suicide cults and self-castration are both on their way out, genetically speaking.

That alone puts them above Scientology, which is propagating itself, despite being a plague upon the species.

-Jester

[Occhidiangela]

I did. It sounds like it belongs on the X-Files. Seriously. Do we have any Lurkers who are Scientologists? I'm interested to know if all the mind control that site talked about is actually true. I mean, come on. PAYING for mind control? taht suxxors.
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A rather infamous ex Lurker was one, for a while. I don't think he'll return to discuss it here, however. :shuriken:

Occhi

[Maitre]

Suicide cults and self-castration are both on their way out, genetically speaking.

That alone puts them above Scientology, which is propagating itself, despite being a plague upon the species.

-Jester
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Ha hah! I've found it! Speaking of who's above who: The Proximity to God Report. Performed by Three Dead Tolls, and hosted by Ampcast.

Edit: to actually say something: I'm not so sure that genetics are the way to do away with things that don't spread genetically. Rational thought on the other hand is a better solution, but the bible is against that as well: folowing your own moral compass (Illustrations by The Brick Testament).

[Occhidiangela]

Speaking of all that, it is quite admirable how the US is displaying its tolerance for freedom of religion, which incidently may or may not include the freedom to execute sheep that stray from the flock, so to speak.
http://news.ft.com/cms/s/5f1b1db2-b948-11d...00779e2340.html
Bringing democracy and freedom to the Middle East must be going well, with the way Afghanistan is still being run by 'mullahs and militias'. Flowers in the street, a quick conversion to freedom, democracy, cheap and friendly oil, and Ma's home cookies indeed.
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Last I checked, Washington made a public appeal to the Afghan authorities to show some restraint. I don't expect it will be any more effective than appeals made to the Muslim Brotherhood to stop killing Egyptian Copts.

But that is the problem, isn't it, of trying to fit the square medeival Islamic world into the round hole of Western, Enlightenment based governmental forms. Even more of a problem is the imbedded athiesm of some strands of Enlightenment thought as applied in Europe since the French Revolution Began. In a society profoundly connected to its religion, and to religion in general, adapting what appear to be more godless norms is viewed with apprehension or revulsion. Consider the fight against the godless communists in Afghanistan a couple of decades ago.

Beyond that, the problem of successfullly implementing democracy at the point of a bayonet is fraught with difficulty. Democracy grows best from the ground up. The problem has always been how to protect the saplings of Democracy's tree from the voracious appetites of wandering horses, camels, and donkeys -- who tend to eat the leaves of the immature Tree of Democracy, and to water it with their urine -- this tends to kill it before it can grow tall enough to need watering by the blood of tyrants and Patriots.

Occhi

[Jester]

A rather infamous ex Lurker was one, for a while.  I don't think he'll return to discuss it here, however.  :shuriken:

Occhi
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Wasn't there an incantation for summoning him?

Or am I thinking of someone else... nah, can't be.

-Jester

[Premezilla]

Wasn't there an incantation for summoning him?

Or am I thinking of someone else... nah, can't be.

-Jester
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Who is this mystery Lurker?
Not that I want to know who he/she/it is, of course.
:whistling:

[Griselda]

Wasn't there an incantation for summoning him?

Or am I thinking of someone else... nah, can't be.

-Jester
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You would know where to find him, but I doubt he'd come.