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How to calculate ilvl
07-18-2006, 01:20 AM (This post was last modified: 07-18-2006 01:44 AM by Ace360.)
Post: #1
How to calculate ilvl
I wish to know how to calculate ilvl. I believe it has to do with qlvl (id hope) but i cant find it ,in the guide, where it tells you how to calculate ilvl. Maybe i missed it, idk.

<div align="right">Any help would be appreciated.</div>

EDIT VVV

If anyone does know can they show a step by step on a few items, so that it covers all the basics.

Thanks
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07-18-2006, 03:27 AM
Post: #2
How to calculate ilvl
The guide explains quite clearly how to calculate the ilvl in sections 3.8 and 3.9

"What contemptible scoundrel stole the cork from my lunch?"

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07-18-2006, 04:53 AM
Post: #3
How to calculate ilvl
Quote:The guide explains quite clearly how to calculate the ilvl in sections 3.8 and 3.9

Ive just reread 3.8 and 3.9 and i still dont see a way to calculate ilvl from an item you have, that the origin unkown. Maybe its their hidden umong the text (not written out) but i cant see it.

What i mean is to say, you dont know were it came from, you traded for it, and its a...

Gold [Bastard] Sword of the Bat

qlvl Gold= 12
qlvl Bat= 8
qlvl Bastard Sword= 10

(i am making a guess but qlvl is involved to determine ilvl?)

excuse my bad knowledge on ilvl
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07-18-2006, 07:16 AM
Post: #4
How to calculate ilvl
Quote:Ive just reread 3.8 and 3.9 and i still dont see a way to calculate ilvl from an item you have, that the origin unkown. Maybe its their hidden umong the text (not written out) but i cant see it.

What i mean is to say, you dont know were it came from, you traded for it, and its a...

Gold [Bastard] Sword of the Bat

qlvl Gold= 12
qlvl Bat= 8
qlvl Bastard Sword= 10

(i am making a guess but qlvl is involved to determine ilvl?)

excuse my bad knowledge on ilvl

Well, just remember that ilvl is no more equal to qlvl than armor class is equal to durability...

But never mind that. The ilvl of an item makes no sense anyway, so it's no wonder you don't see how to calculate it.

The way it works is this: when something (a monster, a chest or whatever) drops an item, it determines an ilvl for the drop, and that ilvl determines a range of possible qlvls for the item, as described in Jarulf's guide (which you clearly basically understand).

For instance, a normal monster drops magical items whose prefix and suffix -- say "gold" and "bat" -- are in the range [ilvl/2]--ilvl, where ilvl is equal to the monster's mlvl unmodified by difficulty level. [The complication is that the the base type -- say "bastard sword" -- is in the range 1--mlvl where mlvl is modified by the difficulty level, which explains why you find better base types in the church/cats in nm/hell difficulty than you do in normal difficulty, though you don't find any better prefixes/suffixes. Presumably, this was a completely unintended oversight on the part of the programmers, who probably even now do not realize the agony they created in the search for non-existent godly drops from monsters.]

Your gold bastard sword of the bat (with 8 <= qlvl <= 12) could, for example, have been dropped by a normal monster with an mlvl (equal to the ilvl of its drop) anywhere from 12 to 17, from say a fire clan archer to a frost charger, and it would be just the same item from any of them.

So, you see, it really makes no sense to ask about the ilvl of your item, as opposed to its qlvl (though perhaps -- and I don't know enough about the inner workings of the game to say if this is true or false -- there might be something in the item seed that would tell you a bit about where it came from).
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07-18-2006, 07:22 PM
Post: #5
How to calculate ilvl
The reason i asked is because of an earlier post, "at what clvl does griswold sell" something or other, (i cant remember) and all i could make out from what griswold sells, is that if its under 200000, and your clvl 28 he will sell any item in slot 6, (and if youve been to hell in single player). what i couldnt find was the ilvl to the item the guy wanted to match it to his clvl. but if ilvl and qlvl are basicaly the same are they averaged together ((base qlvl)+(prefix qlvl)+(suffix qlvl)/3) to equal the ilvl? thanks.
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07-18-2006, 10:07 PM (This post was last modified: 07-18-2006 11:40 PM by Nystul.)
Post: #6
How to calculate ilvl
Quote:The reason i asked is because of an earlier post, "at what clvl does griswold sell" something or other, (i cant remember) and all i could make out from what griswold sells, is that if its under 200000, and your clvl 28 he will sell any item in slot 6, (and if youve been to hell in single player). what i couldnt find was the ilvl to the item the guy wanted to match it to his clvl. but if ilvl and qlvl are basicaly the same are they averaged together ((base qlvl)+(prefix qlvl)+(suffix qlvl)/3) to equal the ilvl? thanks.

Items do not have an ilvl. Things which can give you an item (Griswold, Sir Gorash, a barrel, etc.) have an ilvl. You use Jarulf's Guide to determine the ilvl of the thing which can give you an item, and then you use the ilvl rules for that source to determine the possible qlvl range for the base item, prefix, and suffix. Now if we are starting with the item and trying to determine what source can give it to us, unfortunately we have to work backwards.

Example working forwards: I have a level 15 multiplayer character. What range of premium items can I get from Griswold?

First we determine the ilvl of each of his slots. Ilvl for slots 1 and 2 is clvl-1 = 14. Ilvl for slots 3 and 4 is clvl = 15. Ilvl for slot 5 is clvl +1 = 16. Ilvl for slot 6 is clvl +2 = 17. (Griswold is unusually complicated... most sources have only one ilvl.) It is important to remember that Griswold's maximum ilvl is 30.

Next we determine the qlvl range for the base items based on the ilvls. Range of qlvl for base item of a premium item at Griswold is ilvl/4 to ilvl. So on slots 1 and 2, you can get a base item with qlvl 14/4 to 4. 14/4 in integer math (you always "round down") is 3. So the base item range for slots 1 and 2 is qlvl 3 to 14. For slots 3 and 4 it will be 3 to 15. For slot 5, it will be 4 to 16. For slot 6 it will be 4 to 17.

What about the qlvl range of the prefix and suffix? The formula here is ilvl/2 to ilvl. So for slots 1 and 2 it will be 7 to 14. For slots 3 and 4 it will be 7 to 15. For slot 5, it will be 8 to 16. For slot 6, it will be 8 to 17.

So now you can look at the item charts in Jarulf's Guide, and see all the possible items that character might be offered in each of his slots.


Example working backwards: What level do I have to be to get a massive long war bow of swiftness from Griswold?

Qlvl of long war bow: 19. Qlvl of massive: 20. Qlvl of swiftness: 10. I'm not going to bother to check that the price is low enough, but you can do that if you like.

All three qlvls must be valid at the same ilvl. We want to know every ilvl for which this is possible.

Ilvl where base item qlvl 19 is possible: ilvl/4 to ilvl = 19. The minimum here is obviously 19. The maximum would be 19*4 + (4-1) = 79, but since the maximum ilvl at Gris is 30 let's stick with that. So ilvl 19-30 at Gris could give us a long war bow.

Ilvl where suffix qlvl 10 is possible: ivl/2 to ilvl = 10. The max would be ilvl = 10*2 + (2-1) = 21. The min would be ilvl = 10.

Ilvl where prefix qlvl 20 is possible: ilvl/2 to ilvl = 20. The min would be 20. The max would be 41, but again actually we can't go higher than 30 at Gris.

So when we put all three together, we take the highest min and the lowest max, and this is our valid ilvl range. The highest min is 20, for massive. The lowest max is 21, for swiftness. So the ilvl at Gris has to be between 20 and 21, for us to have any chance at a massive long war bow of swiftness.

Now unfortunately, Gris has these different ilvls for each slot, so we are back to that deal again. Slots 1 and 2 have ilvl = clvl -1. So on these slots you would have to be between levels 21 and 22. Slots 3 and 4 have ilvl = clvl, so here you would have to be between levels 20 and 21. Slot 5 has ilvl = clvl +1, so here you would have to be between 19 and 20. Slot 6 has ilvl = clvl +2, so you would have to be between 18 and 19.

So you can see that the total range of levels where Gris could give you this item in multiplayer is clvl 18 to 22. However, he would be most likely to give it you at clvl 21 (when it is available from 4 of 6 slots). So if you were going to shop over and over again specifically for this item, you would want to do it preferably with a clvl 21 character.

Hopefully, this helps. Griswold is the most complicated case, so if you can figure out how to do items at Griswold, then items from monsters should be a breeze.

Edit: Let's try using the right numbers when doing the calculations...
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07-18-2006, 10:12 PM (This post was last modified: 07-18-2006 10:15 PM by LennyLen.)
Post: #7
How to calculate ilvl
Quote:what i couldnt find was the ilvl to the item the guy wanted to match it to his clvl. but if ilvl and qlvl are basicaly the same are they averaged together

Qlvl and ilvl are NOT the same thing!

Qlvl is the level of the item itself, or the level of it's affixes. Ilvl is the level of the source of the item, ie. the monster that dropped it, the chest it was in, your character level when shopping, etc.

edit:

Quote:Hopefully, this helps. Griswold is the most complicated case, so if you can figure out how to do items at Griswold, then items from monsters should be a breeze.

I wrote this on item generation at Griswold a while ago. It might help.

Oh, and monster generation is even easier to figure out with LICK.;)

"What contemptible scoundrel stole the cork from my lunch?"

-W.C. Fields
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07-18-2006, 10:36 PM
Post: #8
How to calculate ilvl
Quote:Qlvl and ilvl are NOT the same thing!

Qlvl is the level of the item itself, or the level of it's affixes. Ilvl is the level of the source of the item, ie. the monster that dropped it, the chest it was in, your character level when shopping, etc.

edit:
I wrote this on item generation at Griswold a while ago. It might help.

Hey, that's a pretty handy little writeup. Have to be careful with this inverse of integer division though... the rounding issue can be pretty significant if we were looking at lower end items. Although not many people are interested in lower end items.

Quote:Oh, and monster generation is even easier to figure out with LICK.;)

Sure, but what fun is math if there is no challenge or risk of <strike>dying</strike> screwing things up? :P:blink:
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07-18-2006, 10:52 PM (This post was last modified: 07-18-2006 11:08 PM by Thecla.)
Post: #9
How to calculate ilvl
Quote:The reason i asked is because of an earlier post, "at what clvl does griswold sell" something or other, (i cant remember) and all i could make out from what griswold sells, is that if its under 200000, and your clvl 28 he will sell any item in slot 6, (and if youve been to hell in single player). what i couldnt find was the ilvl to the item the guy wanted to match it to his clvl. but if ilvl and qlvl are basicaly the same are they averaged together ((base qlvl)+(prefix qlvl)+(suffix qlvl)/3) to equal the ilvl? thanks.

In multiplayer Diablo, Gris generates 6 premium items with ilvls from clvl-1 (bottom two slots) up to clvl+2 (the last slot), with a maximum ilvl of 30. This explain why he can sell any item it's possible for him to sell in the last slot once you reach a clvl of 28, and in all slots once you reach a clvl of 31. (The price cap in Diablo is 140,000 though, not 200,000 as in later versions of Hellfire.)

In a slot with a given ilvl, Gris will sell items whose preffix and/or suffix have a qlvl in the range [ilvl/2]--ilvl. There is no averaging that goes on --- the ilvl just determines the minimum and maximum possible qlvls.

For instance, suppose you want to know at what clvls Gris can sell a massive (qlvl=20) bow of swiftness (qlvl=10) in multiplayer Diablo. Both qlvls are less than 30, and the price of such a bow is always less than 140,000gp, so there is no restriction on Gris selling the item. Also, since 10 >= [20/2]=10, the item is a possible one, whereas a savage (qlvl=23) bow of swiftness (qlvl=10) can't occur, since 10 < [23/2] = 11. (This is just the condition that the qlvls of the prefix and the suffix have to lie in the range [ilvl/2]--ilvl for some ilvl.)

To get massive, you need ilvl >= 20 (otherwise the upper limit ilvl is too small to get a qlvl of 20), and to get swiftess you need ilvl <= 21 (otherwise the lower limit [ilvl/2] is too large to permit a qlvl of 10). So the ilvl has to be in the range 20--21. To buy one at Gris, this means your clvl has to be in the range 18--22. Using the ilvls of the slots given in JG(1, 2=clvl-1; 3,4=clvl; 5=clvl+1; 6=clvl+2) , you see that the possible slots to find the bow are:

clvl=18: slot 6
clvl=19: slot 5, 6
clvl=20: slot 3, 4, 5
clvl=21: slot 1, 2, 3, 4
clvl=22: slot 1, 2

As far as the base type goes, according to JG Gris sells premium items with base type in the range [ilvl/4]--ilvl. For ilvl=20,21 this gives base type qlvls of 5--20 or 5--21. This means he can sell a massive/swiftness bow in all bases types up to a long war bow (qlvl=19), except for a short bow (qlvl=1) or a hunter's bow (qlvl=3), whose qlvls are too low to be allowed on any massive bow sold by Gris.

Hope that helped...
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07-18-2006, 11:07 PM
Post: #10
How to calculate ilvl
Quote:Qlvl of long war bow: 19. Qlvl of massive: 20. Qlvl of swiftness: 10.

The highest min is 19, for both long war bow and massive.

Heh, you beat me to it.;)But I'm sure you misread the qlvl of massive as 19 here for the highest min, right? :)
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07-18-2006, 11:30 PM (This post was last modified: 07-18-2006 11:36 PM by Nystul.)
Post: #11
How to calculate ilvl
Quote:Heh, you beat me to it.;)But I'm sure you misread the qlvl of massive as 19 here for the highest min, right? :)

Woops! Guess I better proofread my examples. JG is hard enough to understand without someone throwing random wrong numbers into the mix.

Funny how few of these items exist that people would actually bother to do the full calculation for. Massive/swiftness obviously being one of them.
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07-19-2006, 12:33 AM
Post: #12
How to calculate ilvl
Quote:Funny how few of these items exist that people would actually bother to do the full calculation for. Massive/swiftness obviously being one of them.

Yup , but still funny we picked exactly the same item.

What is also strange about all this is that in the years I played D2, I never felt any urge to understand exactly how its item generation system worked. I don't know if that's an example of less is more, but I'm sure it says something about the special character that D1 somehow managed to posses.
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07-19-2006, 03:38 AM
Post: #13
How to calculate ilvl
Quote:I wrote this on item generation at Griswold a while ago. It might help.


Your Griswold item generation guide helped alot, cleared it up. Thanks for the help guys, problem solved.
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07-19-2006, 09:39 AM
Post: #14
How to calculate ilvl
Quote:Hey, that's a pretty handy little writeup. Have to be careful with this inverse of integer division though... the rounding issue can be pretty significant if we were looking at lower end items. Although not many people are interested in lower end items.

That's been on the to-do list for a couple of years.:)

Quote:Sure, but what fun is math if there is no challenge or risk of dying screwing things up?

I like to plug LICK once every few months to remind myself that writing a new version has been on my to-do list for more than a couple of years.;)

"What contemptible scoundrel stole the cork from my lunch?"

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