SSC/TE Attunements Gone!

[Mirajj]

From Tigole

After a lot of thought and deliberation, we’ve decided to remove the attunement requirements to enter Serpentshrine Cavern and Tempest Keep: The Eye. While many of our attunements in the Burning Crusade have been good progression checks, a few of the attunements have turned out to cause unnecessary stress on guilds either doing the content or attempting to do the content. With Black Temple and Battle for Mount Hyjal thriving, we want to encourage (rather than prevent) new guilds and raid groups to attempt Serpentshrine and TK. We are going to leave the current attunement quests in the game so that players can still engage in the challenge and the lore of those quests should they choose to. At a later point, we are considering adding a final reward step to those quests as well (that way those who have already completed them would not miss out on a *new* reward).

We’re listening to feedback from you guys constantly and your opinions are important to us. We want this game to be the best possible MMO experience for our players.

Enjoy Serpentshrine and Tempest Keep =)

(Please note: This change will go live later today -- it's not yet active)

Blue Post here

[Sword_of_Doom]

From Tigole
Blue Post here

A year ago i would have been spitting mad at a change like this but as a casual raider now i could care less. I want to see all the content and this is a nice change that will allow any raiding guild to see content they otherwise would not.

It is somewhat bittersweet as i completed all the Heroic Trials and was partway through on an alt. I felt the Trials were a good test of skill and those that made it through were worthy of Tempest Keep. O well most of the hardcore raiders cheesed the Heroic Arcatraz one anyways (you could turn in the quest to Millhouse) until Blizz fixed the loophole. But Heroic Shattered Halls was awesome and to complete that was a great feeling, almost like downing an end raid boss like C'Thun or Nefarian.

[Pesmerga]

A year ago i would have been spitting mad at a change like this but as a casual raider now i could care less. I want to see all the content and this is a nice change that will allow any raiding guild to see content they otherwise would not.

It is somewhat bittersweet as i completed all the Heroic Trials and was partway through on an alt. I felt the Trials were a good test of skill and those that made it through were worthy of Tempest Keep. O well most of the hardcore raiders cheesed the Heroic Arcatraz one anyways (you could turn in the quest to Millhouse) until Blizz fixed the loophole. But Heroic Shattered Halls was awesome and to complete that was a great feeling, almost like downing an end raid boss like C'Thun or Nefarian.

And, in the long run, it currently only helps the guilds that have Karazhan, Gruul, and Mag figured out. It's not as if some guild who hasn't done anything in the raiding scene is going to waltz into these places and drop a few bosses (minus Void Reaver, from what I hear).

I like this change.

[nobbie]

Yeah, I had to double-check if we have April 1st today. Nice move, though;)

[Sword_of_Doom]

And, in the long run, it currently only helps the guilds that have Karazhan, Gruul, and Mag figured out. It's not as if some guild who hasn't done anything in the raiding scene is going to waltz into these places and drop a few bosses (minus Void Reaver, from what I hear).

I like this change.

My guild only raids 3 days a week and we are 3 bosses in to SSC (Hydross, Morogrim and Lurker Below). Getting people attuned was a logistical nightmare and i know the lifting of the attunements was made for such a guild as mine. We will probably walk into Tempest Keep either tonight or Thursday and down Lootreaver. But a guild that has not done Gruul or Mag will wipe on the opening trash in SSC all night. Its not easy and there is gear checks in place which i like.

There is a reason Blizzard has 8 million subs. They listen to the majority of their playerbase and it works. Everyone experiencing content at some point is a good thing and i like that it can be done at a reasonable pace now not at the break neck speed i use to play at.

[Bolty]

Haha, a week after my guild downs Magtheridon for the first time and I thus complete all my attunements, they do this.

Still, it's awesome, and will allow us to hit up SSC with more than the currently-less-than-25 attuned people we have. I like it, even though I realize these attunements were put in for a reason - if you can't get attuned, you probably didn't belong in the zone in the first place. Then again, having to wait months just to see Tempest Keep: The Eye because one's compatriots are taking their time attuning isn't much fun. Kudos to Blizz.

O well most of the hardcore raiders cheesed the Heroic Arcatraz one anyways (you could turn in the quest to Millhouse) until Blizz fixed the loophole.

Not all guilds were so unscrupulous. I stopped playing with some members of one guild who abused this cheese right in front of my eyes. The end does not justify the means. It's a shame that the pressures of raiding make people do these things. The worst part was they did it even after Blizzard declared it a loophole that they'd fix in the following patch - basically direct, knowledged *abuse* of game mechanics. Not much different from standing in the hallway while fighting Prince Malchezaar (can of worms alert).

But Heroic Shattered Halls was awesome and to complete that was a great feeling, almost like downing an end raid boss like C'Thun or Nefarian.

Heck yeah.

-Bolty

[Mavfin]

But Heroic Shattered Halls was awesome and to complete that was a great feeling, almost like downing an end raid boss like C'Thun or Nefarian.

Heck yeah.

-Bolty

But, just because you don't *have* to do it anymore doesn't mean they removed it from the game. There are people who will get groups together and do it just because they can. Works for me.

[Legedi]

I'm glad they are gone. I've still got heroic SL to do, but that's just because I haven't tried yet. And even if I'd done it in a week we wouldn't have enough people for TK:E for months. And right now we didn't have enough people for SSC.

If they want attunments, keep 25 man attunment in 25 mans. It's logisticaly hard to get the 5 and 10 man stuff done. And while it might be fun to do it once for your toon, do you want to do it 5 more time with other people? Or do you want to wait for months? Now we can actually enjoy raiding.:)

[Taelas]

I feel a bit relieved. I'm still not Revered with Honor Hold, so I couldn't do the last quests for the Eye. Now I won't have to. It's a bit less stress.

Still, it also feels a bit cheesy. I feel sorry for those who completed the entire chain.

[Skandranon]

A year ago i would have been spitting mad at a change like this but as a casual raider now i could care less. I want to see all the content and this is a nice change that will allow any raiding guild to see content they otherwise would not.

Frankly, as a non-casual raider, I still think this is a good move. Past a certain point, attunements weren't checking whether you deserved to be in the zone or not - just checking your time and luck. Pre-nerf Heroic SH was madness, and pre-nerf Heroic Arcatraz was stupid, too. You could be skilled players, but random stuff could wipe you flat and poor group comp was certain doom. How does that do anything but increase the frustration factor with attunements? Only the most obnoxiously elitist raiders didn't recognize that the line for attunement to the Eye was excessive.

Sure, most guilds won't be able to waltz in there and drop a boss. But some will, and that is also a good thing. The more people are involved in raiding, the better.

[vor_lord]

But not really -- it's been nerfed. So it won't feel as cool.

But, just because you don't *have* to do it anymore doesn't mean they removed it from the game. There are people who will get groups together and do it just because they can. Works for me.

[Quark]

But not really -- it's been nerfed. So it won't feel as cool.

One of the reasons we did Mercy the night before 2.1 was released:)

In some perverse way I'm almost more motivated to stop slacking and finish the two runs necessary for my trials. It's gone from a "I need this to start doing X" to a "Hey, fun quest with a resist reward". Obviously to get better when they get real rewards.

[Bolty]

But not really -- it's been nerfed. So it won't feel as cool.

True. In 2.1, the trash got nerfed to smithereens, making completing the quest in 55 minutes significantly easier - and it was the trash that made the place so hard. However, the bosses are pretty much the same difficulty as before, minus the fact that epic gear was buffed in 2.1.

Now that attunement requirements are gone, though, it will be easier to just outgear the place before attempting the trial. But that's true of all content, really - Blizzard releases it very difficult for the hardcores to go for, then makes it steadily easier and easier for increased accessibility. The Black Temple being the apparent exception.

Completing the Shattered Halls trial the day before the 2.1 patch came out, on our first try, will remain one of my fondest memories with my guildies. To say "we went all out" would be an understatement; we approached it like a raid encounter, consumabled to the gills, and focused hard. It was awesome.

-Bolty

[Tal]

Completing the Shattered Halls trial the day before the 2.1 patch came out, on our first try, will remain one of my fondest memories with my guildies. To say "we went all out" would be an understatement; we approached it like a raid encounter, consumabled to the gills, and focused hard. It was awesome.

-Bolty

It was epic. Holding 4 mobs against healing aggro and SoC spam easily was my highlight.

[Monkey]

Now that attunement requirements are gone, though, it will be easier to just outgear the place before attempting the trial. But that's true of all content, really - Blizzard releases it very difficult for the hardcores to go for, then makes it steadily easier and easier for increased accessibility. The Black Temple being the apparent exception.

Hey, they might still make The Black Temple easier and easier! Based on everything I've heard (and seen Blizzard do), I'm hoping to solo it in about 6 months. :shuriken:

[Brista]

Hey, they might still make The Black Temple easier and easier! Based on everything I've heard (and seen Blizzard do), I'm hoping to solo it in about 6 months. :shuriken:

One has to chuckle but I can see how the way Blizzard is tuning its raid encounters really is in the best interest of all their customers. Raids that require everyone to be a really good player deserve attunements to check each person. But if they nerf the raid down so it's only really the hardcore who need to be up to speed and you can fill the raid out with reasonably sensible people who can do their function without standing in the If You Stand Here You Die spot then if makes sense to not to have to attune those filler players

Currently my latest project is rather stalled because my Warrior is ready for Heroics, has the gear, has the keys but the rest of my new guild isn't ready. And I can certainly empathise with the frustration of people who are ready for SSC/TK but can't fill out the raid because others aren't. I may be the only tank who can't find a group!

Another point is that if attunements had stayed the mid-level guilds now entering SSC/TK are far far more vulnerable to losing members to more progressed guilds than those uber guilds who have blazed through the content thus far. On my server only one guild is in SSC and I suspect that people in the second and third guild who are attuned but waiting on everyone else drift over to them as and when they have vacancies keeping the top dog top and the rest behind.

Anyway Kauben at EJ summed it up rather nicely with:

1) It's nice for those who can't play as much.

2) It's horrible for the neckbeards who think high-end content should be exclusive.

3) Many boss fights will still require certain gear/experience checks.


There, I summed up this thread and now I'm closing it.