A disservice?

[swirly]

I've been wondering if it is a disservice to play with people who are experiencing Normal for the first time. Since I'm in Nightmare all my younger toons tend to have gear handed down and sometimes even big gems and they just feel really overpowered. I'm feeling like I should avoid playing with people who are doing their first trip through so that they get a more honest experience. I'm curious what others think about such.

I realize I could try to avoid using gems and handed down gear, but that isn't always completely easy. Like often I'd have a character I have already been playing and so using such since it was just me. Then I'll see somebody else is in the same level range on their first play through. I'd like to play with them, but yet I feel like I'd be taking something away from them. I suppose what I need to do is play characters who don't use the stash at all for hand me down stuff. That is part of the point of the shared stash though.

I really wonder if gems don't trivialize early content. I'm undecided if that is good or bad. Early content is pretty easy anyway that gems could just speed it up for people making new characters. Yet it still somehow does seem bad too.

[Frag]

I don't have time to fully expound now, but I agree, and feel the auction house does the same thing.

[MongoJerry]

I've been wondering if it is a disservice to play with people who are experiencing Normal for the first time. Since I'm in Nightmare all my younger toons tend to have gear handed down and sometimes even big gems and they just feel really overpowered. I'm feeling like I should avoid playing with people who are doing their first trip through so that they get a more honest experience. I'm curious what others think about such.

Let the other person make their own decisions about their feelings. If that person wants to try the game out at their own pace, they have the option to play on their own or with people they know who are also starting out. We certainly did a lot of both when we started so that we could explore the world. However, if the person starts a public game or asks you to join them, they are saying that they want people with them to help them, and you shouldn't feel guilty about doing so.

I don't have time to fully expound now, but I agree, and feel the auction house does the same thing.

(Note: The following comments apply only to the in-game gold auction house and not the real money auction house. As you know, I'm a hardcore player, so I don't have to deal with the real money auction house issue).

This has been a motif that has been expressed by several Lurkers, and I have to say that I disagree. I think that this revulsion for the Auction House comes from the bad experiences with Diablo I and II with dupers, where you couldn't determine if an item you're trading for was a fake or legitimate item. But that's not the case in Diablo 3 for the moment. All items up for bid on the auction house are legitimate items found by players during their adventures.

The game is designed around trading. When you craft, for example, you know that chances are that even when you create a useful item, it will likely not be useful to your specific character. Among our friends, if my character creates something that I know Frag, Swirly, or Kevin can use, then of course, I'd give the item to them. However, when my character crafts, say, 20 boots and 15 of them are only useful for demon hunters and monks, they go up on the auction house so that some hardcore DH's and monks can get some good use out of them rather than have them take room in my stash. My character could salvage those boots, of course, but I feel that that would be a waste, depriving those DH's and monks of gear they could use. The same thing goes for emeralds, which my character will never use, some of my excess Pages of Jewelcrafting, etc.

Now, let's turn it around using a real example from yesterday. My character has sold a bunch of items on the auction house that other players are getting good use out of. Then, I see a wand up for sale for a decent price (50k). I'm feeling quite a bit underpowered at my level, since my character hasn't found a decent weapon in 15 levels, despite plenty of farming. That wand would increase my character's dps by about 30% and allow her to progress to the next tier of content. Now, Swirly made a comment over Mumble about how he would never buy something off the auction house, because he would feel that his character hadn't earned it. (Feel free to correct me, Swirly, if I didn't express that well).

However, in my view, my character farmed that gold, found those emeralds, and crafted those DH and monk boots. These are things that she did. In the meantime, another player says, "Hi! I found this wand that I can't use. I hope someone can get some good use out of it. If you have 50k to spare, I could make good use of that gold for my character." So, I take the wand that the other player doesn't need, and he gets 50k (minus the 15% transaction fee) from my character that he'll make good use out of, too.

Now, I don't know the player who found the wand. All I know is that he or she is a hardcore player like me trying to progress as well as he or she can. If this transaction had happened in a game session, I don't think that Frag or anyone else here would complain at all about it. But that's my point. The Auction House is a mechanism that facilitates these kinds of transactions -- matching those who have a need with those who have a useful item that they can't use themselves. This is a good thing.

Trading has been an integral part of Diablo for a long time. I know from my own experiences that trading in trade chat was a painful but crucial aspect of Diablo II to help people get the right items for their builds that they were making. (I didn't do much trading in DII, but I found it useful a couple of times). Unfortunately, in the past, dupers created too many fake items, scammers scammed people too often, and since gold was mostly useless in DII, the economy used a painful bartering system rather than a smooth currency system. Now, however, the items are legitimate, the transactions are safe, and gold (at least for now) has value as a currency. There is no reason not to use the gold auction house in game.

[MongoJerry]

Epilogue: About five hours after I bought the wand, I ended up crafting a sword that just blew the wand to smitherines in terms of dps. Still, I got some good use out of the wand and it will be available for twinking when my current wizard dies, so I'm still content with the purchase.

[Kevin]

This has been a motif that has been expressed by several Lurkers, and I have to say that I disagree. I think that this revulsion for the Auction House comes from the bad experiences with Diablo I and II with dupers, where you couldn't determine if an item you're trading for was a fake or legitimate item. But that's not the case for the moment in Diablo 3. All items up for bid on the auction house are legitimate items found by players during their adventures.

While this is true it's not what makes me hesitant to use the AH. I didn't even twink much in D2, even with an easy way to mule stuff of. If my barb found something that would be good for my little amazon, I rarely bothered to pass it on. I liked to only use what was generated in the games my character was playing in. Same with D1 and I didn't even really reset Gris/Wirt/Adria all that often.

Part of this was to add extra challenge to games that were relatively easy. Part of it was reward for effort just not being that for me. Sure getting that perfect item is a big reward but I got no reward from the time spent walking to wirt or resetting or muling or whatever when I could be getting reward from killing a mob right now. In real life I'm fine and often strive for delayed gratification. If I'm playing a game I'm generally looking for instant gratification. This is where the whole "MMO's are work" thing comes in for many people. At a point the instant reward isn't enough even if you know a HUGE reward might be at the end. Or at least I think that is a clearer definition of what most people just call burn out.

In D3 many of the tedium barriers are lowered. I enjoy the act of crafting in it's own right even if I don't get anything and turning that around to get some gold back on the AH is something I've done from time to time. I haven't purchased anything yet though even when I've been feeling a little behind the curve. I also haven't farmed much either as I've tended to end up content progressing most play sessions.

Another worry I have is that if I do buy something on the AH, the time between crafted or drop upgrades is going to get even longer. While the frustration of that will be mitigated by the fact that I'm likely not feeling underpowered in the game, I know that was a killer for me in WoW and was part of the reason I rarely targeted gear and just went with what I got. My skill was generally enough that I was still better in groups that most other folks so I didn't feel I was impacting others. In D3 if I feel my gear is too weak for those I play with I'll go farm.

The final reason I'm not buying on it at the moment is because I want the additional challenge of "beating" the game the first time through without much "extra assistance" I debated imposing Ironman type rules on myself for a first go through just to see how far I could get like that cold but didn't want to just play solo that much or try and find other folks to do that. So I made some compromises. Once I get to 60 or beat Hell (I consider Inferno 'bonus') then my chances of use the AH will go up.

Really to me I see the AH more as a way to twink my biggest character than anything else and that was something, as mentioned I rarely did. Some characters I would others, they didn't get any twinked gear. I realize I might be losing out on some of the potential in the game by limiting myself but again it's a personal choice.

Just some more thoughts on the subject.

[swirly]

I've been wondering if it is a disservice to play with people who are experiencing Normal for the first time.

Let the other person make their own decisions about their feelings.

My worry is that they might not be able to make an informed decision. When I was first in Act 2 Normal and somebody asked if I wanted company with one of the characters they have in that level range, I'd have had no clue that those characters can be so overpowered due to gems being passed down. (I still did decide to play through solo anyway though) I don't mind the gear part too much cause that has level requirements. You can be amazingly strong with just good gear, but I feel like gems really are what make the difference so huge. I suppose you are right though in that I should let them decide. I just have to make sure to inform them that despite being the same level as them, the character is over twinked and so they might want to consider that in their decision. Yeah... I think that is the right option. Let them decide their own feelings, but be sure they doing it from an informed position.

I think that this revulsion for the Auction House comes from the bad experiences with Diablo I and II with dupers, where you couldn't determine if an item you're trading for was a fake or legitimate item.

Now, Swirly made a comment over Mumble about how he would never buy something off the auction house, because he would feel that his character hadn't earned it. (Feel free to correct me, Swirly, if I didn't express that well).

There are many issues that play into this for me, but the fake/dupe issue isn't one of them. It would have never crossed my mind to even worry about if an item came about because of dupes or not in D2. I just didn't play multiplayer or deal with others enough for that even to be a consideration for me. In D2 the issue for me was simply that I have very strong anti-social tendencies. I didn't play with a single Lurker back then. It was strictly a couple of real life friends. I lurked on here and read things like TD's Werewolf guide and gradually started posting a bit. Then WoW came out and I again only played with people I already knew for a while. I was aware of Treesh and GG playing on Terenas, but I didn't actively know them and it took a good length of time before I worked up the nerve to make a character there and contact them about a guild invite. It was probably only in the most recent expansion that I even bothered to start buying mats off the AH cause to me that was still social in my mind and so to be avoided. Even with somebody like GG who I've known for many years now I still have turned down meeting in life cause I have these anti-social tendencies. That is actually a decision I've regretted and am currently more open to, but I can't even promise that won't swing back the other way based on mood. My point with all of this is to show how strong my anti-social tendencies are. So in terms of D3 I can't see me ever joining a public game. MAYBE if it me and 2 others so it is just one random person, but even then only if the other 2 really push me into it. I'd really rather just play with 3 than bother with that extra person. If I'm on my own I will enjoy the game much much more just playing solo than I will with 3 other people that I don't already know. Even if they are great players and friendly... I still will simply not enjoy it because of how I am. Which I'm not saying is a good thing btw, but just saying it is how it is. So the AH in D3 feels like the same sort of thing. There is a socialness to it that makes me step back and go "no way!" I'm sure I'll eventually break down and use it, but it will take quite a while for things to chip away at that gut reaction I have just based on how my personality is.

So the socialness of it is one big issue with it for me. You didn't misquote me though. I do feel that buying an item off the AH would feel unearned to me. I think that exchanging gems seems fine, but buying an upgrade somehow doesn't. When I say that I do want to clarify that it doesn't bother me in the slightest that other people do it or that I would even be playing with them with them using that gear. It is purely a person thing. I'm just going to feel much better about an item that I killed a mob for than one I've bought. This is actually true for given items too. I feel much better about an item I found myself rather than one that somebody else found and gave to me. Even if it happens while we are grouped together. It isn't enough of a difference to make me not use the item and my memory is bad enough that in an hour or two I'll probably even forget where the item came from and so it'll be like any other. There is still that slight lowering of the feeling associated with the item though. The more removed it gets the stronger that feeling gets. So an item found by somebody else while grouped with me is a very slight lowering of the feeling. An item found by somebody else I know while not grouped with me is an even further lowering. An item found by somebody I don't know is even further. Then an item found by somebody else that I actually have to pay for is even worse. The simple act of having to pay for it actually lowers it for me. If the item is given then there is a value in that act of giving. So the act of paying is a negative for me.

So then once you reach that paying stage there enters in other factors too. For instance, the value of gold. If I am low on gold like I currently am and decide to spend it on an item then that item might have a decent value/feeling to me because I felt like I had to really work to gain that gold and so I gave up something of value to get the item. On the other hand if I am overflowing in gold from selling other items then any item I buy with that gold is going to have a very low value to me cause I didn't give anything of value for it.

There is just a scale to it all. Where each option is a step down and different people are going to draw different lines as to what is acceptable to them. Heck different people are going to even draw different placements for where the bits of the scale are. Like you said, you feel that selling your existing stuff and using the results to buy other stuff is an accomplishment for you since you earned the original stuff. So you weigh that differently than I do.

For me the line is likely at the people I know point. I don't care how they got it really. If it was in another game or even if it was something they bought. I'm fine as long as it comes from them. Coming from somebody I don't know would be alright if we were in the same game, but that won't happen often with my anti-socialness. So thus the cut off for me is around that people I don't know that aren't in my game level. An interesting point for me to consider is if it was a person I know who wanted to sell me an item. I think I would likely decline. If somebody had an item that dropped and offered it for me at half the gold they would put it up on the AH for I think I would tell them to just go ahead and Ah it. For me the act of having to pay for it pushes it under that acceptable line. If giving to me is worth less to them than the gold they would gain from the AH then I don't really want the item. Maybe this will change nearer to end game if there is some really good item I've been craving for a long time, but as a general policy this is how I feel.

Yet another aspect to the AH decision for me is the hassle part. The first time I found a rare I couldn't use I debated trying to AH it. I even got as far as opening the screen. Then I just froze. I didn't know what to list it for. To figure that out I'd have to either see what it vendered for, what others were selling it for, or just some sort of thing like that. That extra hassle combined with my general anti-social not wanting to deal with other people thing just made me decide to salvage the item and move on. At that point I wasn't even playing with you guys so I didn't even hold it for others. Now I realize that the more you do it the more of an idea you have for the cost of things and so that hassle goes away. It is a barrier to entry though and enough of one that combined with all my other quirks makes me turn away.

Moving on to the issue of passing gear down. GG mentioned challenge and along those lines I'm really starting to question if I want to be keeping gear for other characters I might play. It overpowers them so much that in some ways it actually trivializes the act of playing the game. Do I want to rush new characters I make through a bunch of content to get to later bits or do I want to really experience the content as I go and feel like each character is earning their path. I'm really starting to debate this. I feel like for an existing high level character like my Witch Doctor that I would want to rush through the content if he died. I'd be fine with making a new Witch Doctor, twinking it, and getting back to where I was as quick as possible. Making a new character though? I'm not so sure. I'm seriously debating deleting my existing Barbarian just because I have such twinked gear on him that he destroys things and I don't feel like I'm really earning his level. So there is the possibility that I might offer up all the twinked gear I have to people and remake new lower characters with only using what they find. Keeping an eye out for what type of gems are dropping and only using that quality. So that I feel like I am really earning the level they get to. It just is starting to feel like a cheat to me to get a Barb to nightmare purely based off the strength of handed down stuff instead of off of my play and what he finds.

So yeah... I have a lot going through my mind right now about all of these type of topics.

[MonTy]

The Auction House is certainly an interesting subject. I'm hitting a brick wall in Inferno and could easily go on the AH right now and within ten minutes have a twice as powerful hero. Simply put, I prefer the challenge of finding everything on my own, and the satisfaction of using my own gear gear to earn all of his accomplishments.

[Frag]

Still don't have a ton of time to post (hence why I've been missing in other threads I should be involved with), but your point about us finding Dex gear we can't make use of, and someone else finding Int gear they can't make use of and trading them bring up a good point. I feel that I'm not part of the Hardcore group. I'm part of the Lurker+ group. I don't need to keep up with them, or worry about their enjoyment, just ours. Hence why I pass out everything I can to our group and have avoided the AH, as it's about us to me. The general B.net crowd has been toxic since the beginning and things haven't improved overmuch with time. That being said, if you feel you're part of a larger community, I get it and can see that as a perspective rather than a absolute point.

The other reason I don't like it is the gear you're gaining in an average game is -5-9 levels behind you, whereas the gear we're buying is likely to be at or slightly behind our level, hence powering you up as the game isn't designed for you to be in the gear for your level, at least not yet.

[Treesh]

Speaking of the AH, a buddy of mine at work has completely trivialized the entire game because he played the gem market and bought of all his gear. He's convinced that the way to get the good gear isn't by MF gear, but extra gold gear instead because instead of hoping for the perfect rare, you can just buy it. He's just blowing through things because his gear has made it too easy so now he's saying nothing is a challenge in the game, although I forgot to ask him if he was inferno mode yet.

[LochnarITB]

[cynical] Reading this discussion of using the AH planted a thought in my mind. Perhaps it has been brought up before and discussed to death and I missed it, but it actually ties in with another annoyance I've been having.

The AH does not exist because it facilitates trading of unused gear. It does do that, but that is not Blizzard's motive for creating it. In reality, the AH is the only part of the game that allows D3 to be labeled an MMO. Otherwise, the partying is nothing more than what existed in its predecessors. Applying the label MMO gives Blizzard justification in requiring all players to be online. I have no desire to use the AH. I haven't even looked at it. Let me play offline or, at least, do not time out my obviously solo game and take away my clearing progress because life requires an AFK. [/cynical]

[Treesh]

Let me play offline or, at least, do not time out my obviously solo game and take away my clearing progress because life requires an AFK.

I think you got kicked by a server hiccup and not a time out. I've gone and showered and not been kicked out of my game before. I was pleasantly surprised to not have been timed out. Although, I wasn't away from the keyboard for over a half hour, but longer than it took to get kicked out in WoW.

[LochnarITB]

Let me play offline or, at least, do not time out my obviously solo game and take away my clearing progress because life requires an AFK.

I think you got kicked by a server hiccup and not a time out. I've gone and showered and not been kicked out of my game before. I was pleasantly surprised to not have been timed out. Although, I wasn't away from the keyboard for over a half hour, but longer than it took to get kicked out in WoW.

I had hoped that the case, but it has been pretty consistent. I have not lost connection while playing in at least 4-5 days, but I've "lost connection" at least 3-4 times, during AFKs, in the last couple days.

[Mavfin]

Let me play offline or, at least, do not time out my obviously solo game and take away my clearing progress because life requires an AFK.

I think you got kicked by a server hiccup and not a time out. I've gone and showered and not been kicked out of my game before. I was pleasantly surprised to not have been timed out. Although, I wasn't away from the keyboard for over a half hour, but longer than it took to get kicked out in WoW.

I had hoped that the case, but it has been pretty consistent. I have not lost connection while playing in at least 4-5 days, but I've "lost connection" at least 3-4 times, during AFKs, in the last couple days.

I'm not seeing this. I've had AFKs of 30-45 minutes three or four times lately, and not gotten kicked. My connection's almost perfect (DSLAM is about 100m away from my house), I admit, so that does help, but, there doesn't seem to be a short timer on AFK.

[Kevin]

Question for both you and Loch. Are either or both of you doing something to pause the game before you AFK? Since bringing up a window or menu will actually pause the game if you are the only one in a non public game, I'm just curious if that has an effect one way or the other. I've not really tested I generally haven't AFK'd for more than about 5-10 minutes and that was usually in a multi game.

[Kylearan]

Normally I don't get kicked out of games when I actively play, but when I had parked my character in town and went to eat and bring the kids to bed, I had a "connection lost" message when I returned. Quite frustrating, as I also wanted to do a full clear.

That could have been one-time coincidence of course, and I never thought to "pause" the game. I will try that next time.

[Mavfin]

Question for both you and Loch. Are either or both of you doing something to pause the game before you AFK? Since bringing up a window or menu will actually pause the game if you are the only one in a non public game, I'm just curious if that has an effect one way or the other. I've not really tested I generally haven't AFK'd for more than about 5-10 minutes and that was usually in a multi game.

No, I usually just TP to town so I don't get surprised, and AFK there.

I have yet to get disconnected doing that. I've been disconnected a total of twice, other than server reboots.

Keep in mind I'm playing on the Mac client, so the IP stack may handle idling differently, haven't really looked at it.

[Treesh]

Question for both you and Loch. Are either or both of you doing something to pause the game before you AFK? Since bringing up a window or menu will actually pause the game if you are the only one in a non public game, I'm just curious if that has an effect one way or the other. I've not really tested I generally haven't AFK'd for more than about 5-10 minutes and that was usually in a multi game.

No, I usually just TP to town so I don't get surprised, and AFK there.

I have yet to get disconnected doing that. I've been disconnected a total of twice, other than server reboots.

Keep in mind I'm playing on the Mac client, so the IP stack may handle idling differently, haven't really looked at it.

I'm on XP and just TP to town and don't have any game windows open before I go AFK. I haven't timed how long I've been AFK though so maybe I'm not that long of a time away?

[RTM]

Speaking of the AH, a buddy of mine at work has completely trivialized the entire game because he played the gem market and bought of all his gear. He's convinced that the way to get the good gear isn't by MF gear, but extra gold gear instead because instead of hoping for the perfect rare, you can just buy it. He's just blowing through things because his gear has made it too easy so now he's saying nothing is a challenge in the game, although I forgot to ask him if he was inferno mode yet.

I enjoyed trading in D2, where the only way to do it (that I was aware of- I didn't learn about D2JSP until after I quit) was to monitor the trade spam chat channels. I went bug-eyed looking for deals and avoiding scammers. I tend to have anti-social tendencies like Swirly, so actually interacting with someone was a thrill in and of itself, aside from the whole 'getting a good deal' thing. So anyway, I was definitely interested in the AH since it provided a safe easy way of buying & selling.

I have sold a few pieces of old & unwanted gear on the AH, but nothing serious until two nights ago. My little witch doctor was 27 and just about to start Act 3, which destroyed my barb. I decided that it was time to upgrade the level 10 gear I had been wearing, so for the princely sum of about $10k I outfitted myself in all rares with +Int. I think my DPS went from 300ish to over 800 (I could hit 1500 fully buffed from my spells/passives) and I was sitting pretty at 2200+ health.

I promptly proceeded to destroy all of Act 3, setting new records of monsters killed in one hit (48, I believe) and killing the bosses in less than 30 seconds each. It was exciting for a bit- walk into a room, fire off a few spells and watch everything melt in a blaze of fireballs and locusts. But then it got boring. There was no challenge, which is exactly what your friend was complaining about, Treesh. PapaSmurf joined me for a bit last night and I don't think he had much to do since things would be dead before he could get a few spells off. I felt kind of bad, really. (Sorry PS!)

I don't know if I will do it again. I will still use the AH to sell stuff and maybe keep my weapons current, but the wholesale upgrade of my entire gearset just makes the game trivial, which subsequently removes a lot of the fun. I enjoy making huge mobs of stuff disintegrate as much as the next guy, but there has to be some challenge to it. Granted, this was in normal mode, so maybe (hopefully?) I'll change my tune as the difficulty progresses. I doubt I'll be upgrading all my gear for 10k once I hit Inferno, though...

[Roland]

I promptly proceeded to destroy all of Act 3, setting new records of monsters killed in one hit (48, I believe) and killing the bosses in less than 30 seconds each. It was exciting for a bit- walk into a room, fire off a few spells and watch everything melt in a blaze of fireballs and locusts. But then it got boring. There was no challenge, which is exactly what your friend was complaining about, Treesh. PapaSmurf joined me for a bit last night and I don't think he had much to do since things would be dead before he could get a few spells off. I felt kind of bad, really. (Sorry PS!)

I don't know if I will do it again. I will still use the AH to sell stuff and maybe keep my weapons current, but the wholesale upgrade of my entire gearset just makes the game trivial, which subsequently removes a lot of the fun. I enjoy making huge mobs of stuff disintegrate as much as the next guy, but there has to be some challenge to it. Granted, this was in normal mode, so maybe (hopefully?) I'll change my tune as the difficulty progresses. I doubt I'll be upgrading all my gear for 10k once I hit Inferno, though...

Normal difficulty is trivial, period. Nightmare will challenge you, and if it won't force you to use the AH it will force you to progress much slower unless your drops have been very good up to that point. Hell will stomp you into the ground and slow you to a crawl without incredible drops and/or AH purchases. Simply put, I have had to upgrade almost every piece of gear on my level 58 Demon Hunter, and I'm stuck at Belial. I simply can't beat him. If not for the two lag deaths last night I MIGHT have done it, but he was only at about 55% health so there's no guarantee I would have survived long enough not to get one-shotted by him (again). I have over 5.5k DPS (might be 5.8k), and over 33k life. My resistances are poor, but my dodge is just over 30% and my armor is just over 38% reduction (something like that). In other words, I'm not a complete glass cannon. His normal arm attacks dish out about 15k damage, while his dual arm attack doubles that (I can usually survive that if I'm at full health). His bombs, though? 30k - 35k damage. Instant one-shot kill. I have not figured out how to dodge long enough to beat him, and my damage is practically for naught because the only thing hitting him is my Sentry.

The AH is somewhat self-leveling anyway. At my level I'm vendoring all blues and yellows because they're simply not "good enough" to sell on the AH. Blues are virtually worthless, and yellows aren't much better unless you get something pretty godly. Every so often I'll keep a piece for a future character, but even then most of the time I know I can buy something decent for a trivial amount of money (~30k for most of my buys, although I dropped 100k each on two pieces of gear last night). Last night I got an awesome rare helm from a Zoltan Kulle run. Solid +stats to all four, a single elemental resistance, and trivial +experience / +life regen. What didn't it have? A socket. Thus, it's useless to sell on the AH. I'd say gems are the most broken thing in the game right now. I can buy Flawless Square gems for a fraction of what it costs to craft them. I have piles of Radiant and Square gems taking up inventory space because I can't get past the idea that they're "worthless" and yet it's pointless for me to sink the cash into crafting them up. I'd say that's my biggest problem with the (softcore) AH - 95% of the items in the game are worthless, not just for selling but for using. It's times like these I miss EVE Online. That game has a real economy. I think the hardcore AH will be the only true economy in D3. The softcore one is just as bad as D2 was, even without the duping.

Anyway, I personally don't worry about over-leveling myself via the AH. I've only hit it when I felt I needed an upgrade, and that's usually because my gear is ~20 - 30 levels behind my character. Some of my drops have been "that good," but by Hell difficulty 1k+ Vitality / offensive stat becomes almost a necessity, as does armor. My level 20-something requirement armor pieces just aren't cutting it, even if their +stats are decent.

Believe me, when you hit Hell Act 1 and get one-shotted by a Vortex / Molten / (unknown) zombie mother pack from almost offscreen, you'll realize just how trivial your character is - no matter how strong you thought you were in NM.

(Short story: I was roaming Act 1 in the first fields area after dealing with Rumford when I spotted a champ pack in the upper right corner of my screen. It was a zombie mother pack, with full zombie complement. I turned to run away when I was vortexed right into the middle of the pack from across the entire screen and instantly killed. I was dead so fast I didn't even get to see all the modifiers. This was after I died 6 or 7 times trying to escape the Den of the Fallen, where I ran across an elite Scavenger pack that was Extra Fast / Immune Minions / something. They were so fast they would trip my Caltrops and be out the other side before the slow kicked in. Eventually I was dying just trying to run out of the exit. After about the second death trying to beat the mob, I decided I would just leave the Den, but it took about 4 more deaths before I was successful. So, yeah... my first foray into Hell Act 1 was slow, and brutally painful.)

[Mavfin]

Simply put, IMO, the AH is a choice you can make. You can use it, or not. Any consequences to your gameplay or satisfaction are then solely yours. Just like what difficulty you play in or how fast you get there, or whether you're an altoholic or not.

Taking a feature away because you can't keep yourself from using it doesn't make sense. That's your issue, not the game's.

(Not aimed at anyone in particular here.)