$315 USD... for a broken sword.

[Nicodemus Phaulkon]

That will teach me to go past the first page of a provided link, neh?

Thanks, Rhydd.

[Occhidiangela]

Forged Japanese Blades

Euro Blades

From a friend. :)

[Rhydderch Hael]

Alas, the high price of a functioning sword today would come from the rarity of the craftsman, if not because the rarity of the material. Steel's cheap. Finding a guy who knows how to shape it into a working sword certainly is not. Bit of a swing of the pendulum for demand and cost of manufacture. A medieval smith would decree it the work of angels (or devils) to create steels of the purity and strength that industry gives it giving easy and consistent manufacture of a fine blade from the hand of a skilled smith, but the number of craftsmen worth their salt wanes in the modern day.

As such, now that I'm rightfully employed at a real job, I can now begin looking for a real sword. Got a manufactured reitschwert in mind.

[--Pete]

Hi,

The limitations in the material available to the original sword smiths of whatever age is a large part of what those swords were. Most good modern swords will take a blow delivered by the side of the blade in stride, at most requiring a straightening. But a sword of the past would typically be destroyed by such a blow, cracking along the laminations or even breaking completely. Thus the grip with one or two fingers over the crossbar to keep the sword from twisting. Which leads to rings, to a ricasso, to the bars of the swept hilt rapier, and finally to the full basket. Which, of course, degenerated to the little shell hilt and other "court" swords. And gives us the full bell of the modern epee.

So, yes, the angels (or devils) of modern steel production gives us materials that the smiths of old could only fantasize about. And so give us swords that they could never produce. Swords that do not have the limitations of the originals, that do not require the care or the knowledge to use.

I have little desire to have any sword that is not original, and not enough disposable income to afford the rare original when it does come up for sale. But if I were to get a replica, I'd want one made, as much as possible, from original materials using original techniques. Then, what I had would indeed be a replica of what was instead of a dream of what might have been. The desire to have a sword just for the sake of having a sword has not bit me.

Good luck on your search for yours. May you find one that is a pleasure to both the eye and wrist. And not too much of a shock to the wallet :)

--Pete

[Rhydderch Hael]

Aye, we have come to different perspectives on the matter. Authenticity is a definite plus, if one wants to glean knowledge of what was an authentic sword.

But I'm in it for aesthetics and performance. To be the most sturdy, reliable blade technically possible in this day and age, and remain stylish while doing so. The Gus Trim AT1548 blade sold by All Saints, fitted to the reitschwert hilt offered by reproduction armourer Christian Fletcher, is an example of 20th-21st century technology and metallurgy (being made from 5160 steel, geometry determined from a CNC machine, and a Mar quenched heat treatment) that merely looks like a 16th century sword. It's akin to a Bugati racer from the 1920's being fitted with a modern Ford Cosworth supercharged racing motor. I am no fool and know that it such a sword is quite real, but not really authentic, but that's something I'm content to settle for. I demand the strength and reliability of modern steel, the "Old World" sensibility to the weapon being more cosmetic than anything else. A modern and reliable touch-tone phone wrapped in an antique wall-mounted phone cabinet, so to speak.

After all, if I ever meet the wrong end of a spanner being swung by an angry fellow named Hercules, I want to be carrying a sword that's going to wow the rabble when I wake up to find myself in the Middle Ages... ;)

[Xiuhcoatl]

This site has not been updated in over a year and I do not know if they are still in business, but Salamander Armory does make nice combat ready weapons. They mainly specialize in swords but they did have a few warhammers available.

http://www.atar.com/F-catalog-frames.htm

Xi

[Walkiry]

http://www.armasdondiego.com/antiquesswords.html

I guess this is what Pete has in mind when he talks about buying a sword ;)

Check out some of the links in that page, there are some astonishing pieces:

http://www.armasdondiego.com/fulfunswedme.html ^_^

[edit] And I forgot: the closest I have to that are two sabers, one found by my grandfather years ago that seems to be from the Spain-France war with Napoleon, and another that belonged to my great-grandfather, who was a colonel in the Republican army during the Spanish civil war. They seem nice enough to me :D [/edit]

[Nicodemus Phaulkon]

I guess this is what Pete has in mind when he talks about buying a sword

Don't think so. ;) Pete seems to lean his preferences a bit further along the "historic" than even this merchant is mongering.

Even so; that Hindu axe on your first link is VERY interesting...

*tips helm*

[--Pete]

Hi,

The link that Walkiry gave is to a page on that site that seems to have original works. Other pages on that site offer reproductions. Of course I'd want the authenticity verified by an independent expert before shelling out that kind of money, but a few of those pieces are appealing. I liked both the Antique German Cup Sword - 1660-70 and the Antique Italian Sword to the " Pappenheim " - 1656. The Antique Spanish Knot Sword - Middle S.XIX is also nice, however it lakes authenticity being a nineteenth century reproduction of what looks to be a seventeenth century sword.

Back when I was still playing the game, I discovered that there are many of these reproductions around. Apparently there has been a market for antique swords (and other weapons and armor) for quite some time. Forgeries were common, and many of them are still out there. Many are good enough to fool most traders and auction house "experts". Which is why, if one wants a real antique, the cost of an appraisal and authentication by a true expert (mostly found working at museums) needs to be added to the price.

Nice site, though.

--Pete

[Rhydderch Hael]

I daresay there's another SFI forumite around these parts, methinks.

One note: the turnaround on Arm Art would be closer to 12 months nowadays than to 3, since word of mouth has gotten out and they have become quite busy filling orders along. Lovely craftsmanship for compartively low price, that's the word around town is. Angus Trim remarked once on a shamshir of theirs that it was somewhat underpriced and that they should be charging more money for the level of work they've put out. Their backlog reflects that: a lot of folks want in on the deal.

[Haider]

I daresay there's another SFI forumite around these parts, methinks.

One note: the turnaround on Arm Art would be closer to 12 months nowadays than to 3, since word of mouth has gotten out and they have become quite busy filling orders along.

Yes, ArmArt makes fantastic swords. I've got my sword after four months, even faster than Pavel stated, and another Bronze-sword should be ready next week, after three weeks of making (casting is a bit faster after all ;)). They quote for each category another delivery time - a month for Bronze pieces, 3 month for Civalric swords, 9-12 for sabre, Rapier and Baskethilts - of course without customization like engravings or changes in the blade. I'll post a review of my S5A Viking as soon as I have some time and access to my digital camera again. I can only say I am very, very impressed with their work, and that I surely will order another sword from them, as soon as I have money again. ;)

[Roland]

I'll post a review of my S5A Viking as soon as I have some time and access to my digital camera again.

Being part Norwegian (and thus Viking) myself, I have a great affinity for those blades. I would be VERY anxious to hear of your opinions on that blade. I'll await it with great eagerness.

[Rhydderch Hael]

In June of this year, I submitted the order for a sword at All Saints Blades of Washington State. Knowing that a manufacturing run of Angus Trim blades was just beginning, I was fully expecting to wait some 8-10 weeks for my particular blade to be shoe-horned into the next cycle after this one. To my surprise, they got the particular blade I wanted, a model AT1548, fabbed in this run. The blade was made within two weeks of my order.

I still don't have it yet, but that is to be expected: the sword was then shipped to Idaho to become an item of attention of one Christian Fletcher (that be his name, not what he literally is ;) ) so that he may modify the hilt into a reitschwert (a 16th Century ancestor to the rapier) and create a scabbard for the sword. The sword sits there still: its wooden grip being wrapped in leather; arms-of-the-hilt and side rings being forged and welded into the guard; a scabbard cut and wrapped to mate it.

So, I'm still waiting. And waiting. Something akin to Homer Simpson lounging on the front lawn for a week, waiting sullenly for the day that he can get his fancy new weapon (something to turn off and on the TV set, mind you. Nothin' more).


A picture, from All Saints Blade's website, of the model AT1548 in its base form. Mine'll be purtier, of course. ;)

(And yes, I know: there's a typo in the picture's header. The guys sell swords— they don't win spelling bees)

[--Pete]

Hi,

That looks like it will make an excellent reitschwert with that pronounced ricasso and straight taper. Will you be keeping the quillions straight or will they have a sideways curve as many forms of reitschwert do? I see that, true to your preference, you've avoided a fuller. :)

Mine'll be purtier...

I expect it will. Hope you'll post a follow on picture when you finally get it.

--Pete

[Rhydderch Hael]

Indeed, the crossguard will be re-made (or probably replaced) with an S-curve. I paid for the full hilt package, and had no reason to go for an color other than black. So, the sword will look much like the catalog shot of a finished sword seen here:

All the little flairs that will distinguish the sword as mine will be added by myself. I've got some linen-weave rough silk that I'll tie and wrap onto the scabbard that will add a punch of dark green. And I'm trying to contact some metalsmiths that offer to create custom reproductions of antique coins (defaced, of course).

I'm trying to get a reproduction of a German 16th century silver taler to integrate into the scabbard or a sword knot.

A faux 16th century German sword. A faux 16th century German coin. At least I'll be consistent in my delusion. ;)

[Jugalator]

MedievalWeaponry.com seem to sell some LotR swords too (and have a lot of other swords and armor too). See also here.

[Rhydderch Hael]

Here is a page giving visual comparisons of various reproduction swords, cataloged by manufacturer or vendor. It is a little out of date, and by no means a complete listing, but it still serves a useful means of comparing both profile forms, the overall look, and compared sizes between various swords now offered in this day and age.

As I said, the comparison tool is a bit out of date. All Saints Blades is not listed here (hence neglecting my beloved AT1548), I know that the Museum Store's Trigon Leaf was never more than a prototype to the Fantasy Leaf Blade that they now offer (the Fantasy Leaf looking a whole lot better than that Trigon Leaf), and the Dancing Giant Swedish Bastard is no more, replaced by Museum Store's Swedish Bastard Mk.II sword.

[--Pete]

Hi,

That site will devour many hours of my life :)

--Pete

[Drasca]

If anyone has recommendations for shops to buy a practice foil from, I'd like them. Googling is good, but I'd also enjoy advice from anyone currently practicing or purchasing/repairing. There is a fencing club here at State College, Penn State University Park where I attend (Go PSU Engineers!) which I enjoy, and would like to get some of my own equipment (and clothing).

CAS Iberia had a Practical Fencing Foil which looks like the fencing club house equipment I've been using. It looks like a french grip from here.

http://www.casiberia.com/cas_website/produ...asp?id=SHFCFL02

I would have bought from CAS Iberia on the spot as an impulse buy, but I had difficulty with their online system. It requires some dealer membership? or some features aren't working? Or does it require orders to be phoned in? I do not know. It is not pointing me to local dealers (this feature is not functional yet) nor accepting "add to cart" without requiring dealer membership login information (and also restating this feature is not functional yet).

Additional Question, with backround I am having some trouble with the french grip. Apparently I've been using a left handed grip club equipment in my right hand that further complicates matters. Should my palm be facing mostly up, sideways, or some diagonal in-between?

[--Pete]

Hi,

I am having some trouble with the french grip.

Everybody has trouble with the French grip, that's why no one except beginners uses it. The only advantages to the French are that it is cheap and one-size-fits-all -- making it perfect for club owned gear.

Look for any of the "pistol" grips for better control with a looser hand. I personally prefer the Belgian, though many others like the Visconti and all grips have their supporters. Until you've had a chance to actually try them out, you can not buy grips online or by mail order and have them "fit" since too much depends on hand length, width, and configuration. If at all possible, buy a glove and then go somewhere where you can try the grips out. Or get people at the club to let you at least handle their foils and epees, preferably letting you fence with them a while. A third choice (that I used years ago but is a bit nasty to the suppliers) is to order a few different grips on-line or by mail and when they arrive mount them one at a time. Then try them out, keep the one you like and return the rest for a refund. I did that with the American Fencing Supply Co. in San Francisco years ago. I sorta made up for that by buying all my gear over the years from them (probably a few thousand bucks all told).

Should my palm be facing mostly up, sideways, or some diagonal in-between?

Depends on how traditional you want to be and what tradition you want to follow. Italian school would have you hold your hand palm up with the crossbar (yes, the Italian school uses an old fashioned grip with crossbar and ricasso) parallel to the ground. That is full "supination". Since the blade is held almost at chin level with the arm only slightly bent at the wrist, this is not too awkward a position. Traditional French school with the elbow about a fist from the hip would make full supination uncomfortable. So the hand is rotated *slightly* away from supination, just enough to remove the tension from the forearm.

Both those traditional forms went away in the first half of the twentieth century, giving way to "modern" fencing. This is a blend of Italian and French with more effort concentrated on results than style. In the early 20th century, if you wanted to be a certified fencing instructor, you had to pass a style test that had nothing to do with ability -- one word champion (who's name I cannot remember) was denied the right to teach because he didn't look good enough while winning!

Some of the result of this more modern style are that the knees are not bent as much allowing more vertical movement, the body isn't quite as much in profile allowing "cross leg" movements such as the fleche, and the hand is held in a more "natural" position (about half way between horizontal and vertical) allowing parries of fourth and sixth to be equally powerful.

However, fencing is not learned with the eyes. It must develop through the muscles. And starting at a club with no formal instruction is a great way to learn and practice mistakes. If at all possible, take a class, join a club with a good master, or at least get a committed mentor to teach you. You'll appreciate it in the long run.

--Pete