Is the US headed towards a socialist government?

[Occhidiangela]

I don't respect any religion,

That's OK, in an IQ contest, Jimmy Swaggart kicks your butt.

Not a problem.


Occhi

[Occhidiangela]

Kandrathe,

I dont know if you follow the case of Eluana Englaro in Italy.

Anyway, a 'good' example of how the catholic church and the right wing government shamelesly worked together in deciding about a persons life.

Hi.

The year is 2009. Please take your medeival context and go to Avignon with it.

Occhi

[Occhidiangela]

Bush within a few years of invading Iraq, toppled there regime and arrested Saddam Hussein. Yet this wasn't the guy we are after. In the 8 years of Bush's presidency he never found Bin Laden. Not because we couldn't, mind you, but because there is a far darker game of chess being played when it comes to the CIA funded Al-queda group and its chosen retard of a leader, Bin Laden (I apologize to all retards for the comparison).

Great: a Dylan Avery/Alex Jones fanboi.

You are welcomed to your delusions.

Occhi

[Occhidiangela]

The minority does not get to set the agenda for the majority.

Stop talking like an idiot.

Seriously.

That is exactly what happens in most republics, for better and worse.

In my own country, given voter turnout in the 60 to 65 percentile range, every four f*****ing years

a minority of the population (35-40% is a minority) sets the political agenda by virtue of whom they elect, or don't.

This isn't even math: it is arithmetic.

Occhi

[kandrathe]

Wow Jester and Kandrathe, you both seem well versed (better than most on a public gaming forum anyway) when it comes to these kinds of things. A well of general knowledge. The 2012 crap aside (which I brought up as a joke, but do actively continue to research because it does interest me) I wanted to say my piece when it comes to this socialist government noise. As you know the stimulus bill has been passed and now all of the states are awaiting there cut. Know who else gets a cut? The same guys that got us into this mess. Guess who is going to be held responsible: Noone.

That is business as usual in politics. For example, the Obama green revolution where they will put up power lines and wind mills simultaneously employing thousands and removing our dependence on foreign oil. It's was another big fat campaign lie, because the lawyers in Congress have so tied up the construction of anything, that it will be eight to ten years before any project of that magnitude could get through the land acquisition(or seizure by eminent domain), zoning battles and planning, let alone the environmental lawsuits. Same with the stimulus bill and all the "shovel ready jobs", its all crap.

Let's us compare Bush and his war on 'turrorists' to Obama and the Financial Crisis (as a euphamism).

Um, "Fear" is the common denominator. I think we are still at fear level Orange on the Terrorist-o-meter. And, as for "change" and Obama-dementia... Do you think there is a crisis? Be afraid, and only government can solve this crisis. I've said it before, when the government tries to convince you that they can spend their way out of a debt crisis, then they must also believe that they can screw their way out of a pregnancy.

Bush within a few years of invading Iraq, toppled there regime and arrested Saddam Hussein. Yet this wasn't the guy we are after. In the 8 years of Bush's presidency he never found Bin Laden. Not because we couldn't, mind you, but because there is a far darker game of chess being played when it comes to the CIA funded Al-queda group and its chosen retard of a leader, Bin Laden (I apologize to all retards for the comparison).

If he happens to get it the way of a bullet, so be it. But, I don't think the special forces groups in Afghanistan are going to tramp throughout the caves and villages in Pakistan to go hunt for the guy. The problem with Afghanistan is that Iraq got in the way.

Obama, on the other hand, upon making it into office has had a great many problems laid at his feet. Now this man doesn't have all the answers, so he is calling on all of the 'great minds' of America to help solve these issues.

Gee, its not like he's one of the least qualified guys to be Potus. Lawyer for democrat causes in Chicago, lawyered his way into a house seat by disqualifying all his competition, then ran unopposed for the Senate seat, served two years while launching his presidential campaign. He's a smart guy, and a compelling orator, but he's inexperienced in politics and he won't be the "leader" soon of even the democrats let alone the rest of us. So far from what I've seen, Pelosi and Reid are calling the plays (and badly as usual). He will get a crash course and OJT here, but he won't be a leader for a few years yet. What is a sad statement for the USA is that he was the best that we could conjure for Potus candidates.

Socialism can be used as a tool, but will not become our government. I am an independent, and I did vote for Obama... I'm really hoping I didn't make a mistake (not that'd matter anyway as the guy won via landslide).

First, you don't understand what winning by a landslide means. For example, Reagan won by a landslide against Mondale. 52% of the popular vote is not a landslide. It is a slim majority. Second, if you want to know what you voted for look up "Agenda 21" which is the same agenda of the progressives in power now. Here is Etzioni describing his meeting with Obama in the Huffington Post. I cite this, because Etzioni is the founder of the Communitarian movement and a darling of the progressives. In this article, Etzioni says "Since he launched his presidential campaign earlier this year, and even before that in both of his books, Senator Obama has stuck consistently to this communitarian message." So, you can judge for yourself where this nation will be going. The root of Communitarianism is the Hegelian dialectic of redefining freedom to be accepting your subservience to the State. In this way, Democrat or Republican is not a choice anymore since both parties have accepted that the power of the State is more important than the power of the individual.

So no, our country is not heading towards a socialist government. More or less an empowered Federal government, which isn't much better as I am a true believe in the States and there inherent power over the Federal government.

>sigh< An empowered Federal government that is taking ownership of banks, and talking about nationalizing industries. Which is offering companies the choice between bailouts with strings attached or bankruptcy. A government which has created the "crisis" in the first place by a) pumping money and incentives into the home buying market, and b) by not popping the bubbles (as Mr. Greenspan did continuously), and c) by allowing mortgages to be bundled and sold as derivatives (i.e. junk bonds). Now, the same idiots are digging a bigger hole (by trillions) each month thinking they can fix their mess. Or, as Lew Rockwell would say, "Americans are not free; we are slaves, ever toiling to feed the appetite of Leviathan." We've traded the Lockian ideals of freedom that this nation was founded upon, for the grim servitude of a Hobbsian nightmare.

I guess only time will tell!

And, you might want to hold your breath while you wait for your Nirvana to arrive.

[eppie]

That's OK, in an IQ contest, Jimmy Swaggart kicks your butt.

Not a problem.
Occhi

First I don't think so. And second, well it might be, but I do believe religion is a great way for individuals to make lots of money from poor easily impressable people. And I don't respect that at all.

ps no sorry I can't know this. If he is in the high 150s you might be right.

[eppie]

Hi.

The year is 2009. Please take your medeival context and go to Avignon with it.

Occhi

What do you mean with this?


edited. cant be bothered

[Occhidiangela]

What do you mean with this?
edited. cant be bothered

And would you grasp it were I to tell you?

Maybe.

the catholic church and the right wing government shamelesly worked together in deciding about a persons life.

Paranoid much?

You want an example that includes a right wing government. Sadly for your delusions, Italy's government isn't it. Italy is a liberal democracy with a parliamentary government. IIRC you lived there for a while.

Right wing government: try Pinochet's time in Chile.

That's a right wing government.

By the way: controlling her life? She was a vegetable. Are you going to chide me for controlling the life of broccoli, and torturing it, when I put it into boiling water before I eat it?

In the time between her vegetative condition's commencement, and the plug being pulled, Italy changed government's at least five times, to include twice putting Prodi into power.

Right wing?

Horsecrap.

Pure, eppie brand, horsecrap.

Occhi

[Jester]

Stop talking like an idiot.

Seriously.

That is exactly what happens in most republics, for better and worse.

In my own country, given voter turnout in the 60 to 65 percentile range, every four f*****ing years

a minority of the population (35-40% is a minority) sets the political agenda by virtue of whom they elect, or don't.

This isn't even math: it is arithmetic.

Occhi

Did it occur to you that I was talking about the majority of *representatives*, or even *voters*, not the majority of the *population*? Or are you just so very eager to find something to nitpick so you can pick yet another fight with me?

('round and 'round we go... I ask you to stop insulting me, you keep insulting me... whee!)

-Jester

[eppie]

And would you grasp it were I to tell you?

Maybe.

the catholic church and the right wing government shamelesly worked together in deciding about a persons life.

Paranoid much?

You want an example that includes a right wing government. Sadly for your delusions, Italy's government isn't it. Italy is a liberal democracy with a parliamentary government. IIRC you lived there for a while.

Right wing government: try Pinochet's time in Chile.

That's a right wing government.

By the way: controlling her life? She was a vegetable. Are you going to chide me for controlling the life of broccoli, and torturing it, when I put it into boiling water before I eat it?

In the time between her vegetative condition's commencement, and the plug being pulled, Italy changed government's at least five times, to include twice putting Prodi into power.

Right wing?

Horsecrap.

Pure, eppie brand, horsecrap.

Occhi

OK apart from your usual polite remarks I know see what you try to say.
First, I wasn't talking about the person that was in the coma but of course about her loved ones. And by the way, making the broccoli remark in a church in Italy will probably show you what I mean.
Also the left wing governments in Italy are being heavily influenced by the catholic church (supporting my opinion that for me organised religion is dictating our daily lives much more than the suposedly socialist governments of the US and the western european states. Anyway changing laws is not easy, especially these kinds of laws, and finally the father won a trial this year. If we had a lef wing government at this moment they wouldn't have reacted like berlusconi did.

Like his great remark about the woming still menstruating so being able to have kids. It was almost as nice as the remark he made about the desaparecidos in Argentina this week.

Ans yes right wing, right wing and junta are not the same but I guess you are aware of that. Although Berlusconi is getting close, he already is completely immune to prosecution, and the nice thing is, he actually uses this.
It is very bad that the other european countries' goverments don't comment on this. I guess we should, we in northern europe are paying the south so that they can profit and sell us their cars and fashion.

[eppie]

Did it occur to you that I was talking about the majority of *representatives*, or even *voters*, not the majority of the *population*? Or are you just so very eager to find something to nitpick so you can pick yet another fight with me?

('round and 'round we go... I ask you to stop insulting me, you keep insulting me... whee!)

-Jester

He is back, and now he is more frustrated then ever.:)

[Cryptic]

Wow. This place has become dominated by a select few personalities who despise one another, I see.

So two questions:
(1) Where is the moderation?
(2) When can we expect a forum devoted to Diablo 3?

Thanks.
:shuriken:

[eppie]

Wow. This place has become dominated by a select few personalities who despise one another, I see.

So two questions:
(1) Where is the moderation?
(2) When can we expect a forum devoted to Diablo 3?

Thanks.
:shuriken:

O come on, it's not that bad?

By the way, MEAT....you know how to pick your subjects for a new thread....the last three 100+ reaction thread were yours. Isn't there some kind of prize for that?

[kandrathe]

He is back, and now he is more frustrated then ever.:)

Heh, I knew that old salty dog would sober up some day. :) I'm glad he's back, thorny barbs and all. Although, being that you are a socialist, Castro hugging, piece of Euro-trash, you incur more wrath than I do. And, you know I say that with my tongue firmly implanted in my cheek.

[kandrathe]

Wow. This place has become dominated by a select few personalities who despise one another, I see.

So two questions:
(1) Where is the moderation?
(2) When can we expect a forum devoted to Diablo 3?

Thanks.
:shuriken:

Oh, no. I wouldn't say despise. Did you ever play the game of flinch on the playground? Here we play a verbal game of flinch, which is really a battle of wits and sometimes to the death.

[eppie]

Although, being that you are a socialist, Castro hugging, piece of Euro-trash, you incur more wrath than I do.

Yeah and especially on days that my shares go down I don't take any S**** from other people, so more chance of a full on battle. :)

[kandrathe]

Yeah and especially on days that my shares go down I don't take any S**** from other people, so more chance of a full on battle. :)

Oh, that explains it. I thought perhaps you were bi-polar. :)

[Jester]

Oh, that explains it. I thought perhaps you were bi-polar. :)

He is. He's a stock-owning socialist. ;)

-Jester

[Taem]

O come on, it's not that bad?

By the way, MEAT....you know how to pick your subjects for a new thread....the last three 100+ reaction thread were yours. Isn't there some kind of prize for that?

I see things happening around me that bother me, so I voice my opinion about them on these forums, but apparently (and thankfully), I am not the only one whom is bothered.

Here is another one for you. This little piece says that taxing people for the miles they drive instead of a flat tax on gas will help pay for bridges and roads and is inevitable. Here is a quote I found very interesting:

A tentative plan in Massachusetts to use GPS chips in vehicles to charge motorists by the mile has drawn complaints from drivers who say it's an Orwellian intrusion by government into the lives of citizens. Other motorists say it eliminates an incentive to drive more fuel-efficient cars since gas guzzlers will be taxed at the same rate as fuel sippers.

If Congress has indeed been toying with this idea for awhile, and it is "inevitable", then this is just another step toward what I've been talking about since the creation of this topic: Control. That is the real issue here, not neccessarily Republic vs Socialism, but who controls your life and how you live it. Do you really want a GPS notifying Congress where you are and have been at all times?

[Delc]

That pretty stupid, even for our government. Not only is it backwards to the normal goal of getting people to waste less gas, but it would also be impossible to implement. What stops me from taking the stupid tracking device and putting it in my garage until inspection time? I mean, unless they are going to mandate that we all buy new cars, it would have to be some after market thing, which means it would be trivial to remove. Or better yet, just take it out, drown it in a bucket of water, and put it back in. Ooops, drove through too many puddles.

Morons, all of them. This is why I favor small government, because idiots like this are running it.