A Hacker's Plight

[Artega]

This has already brought a legion of flames for the author over at the D2.net thread, so flaming him here won't matter. Email him for that :)

Just thought I'd share the article. You can find the article here, and you can find the thread relating to the article here. Be sure to read that first reply by Kollsvein; it's a doozie! :blink:

EDIT:

I've been reading a couple of posts here and there throughout said thread, and Iz-GOod mentions a psychoanalyst-type by the name of Kohlberg, and that he has a sort of chart that defines how people come to what they believe is right and wrong. Or something along those lines. I found an article on Kohlberg's chart/principle/whatever at Notre Dame's site. You can find the article here.

[Archon_Wing]

My Response to this article :

Wow, if you can get so worked up about what people think about you in a video game, that's pretty sad

You cheat in a game. Nobody cares. Just admit it and get on with life. You don't need to answer to anyone else. You wasted a whole minute of my life.

[FoxBat]

Is this a D2.net tactic to push down cheaters in their forum by bringing the legits out of the woodwork? Anyway, it's interesting to see some subtly flawed anti-cheat arguments proposed as well. E.G. EULA violations, open/closed distinction, relativity of who is ruining whose game, etc. It seems that it's nearly inevitable that people develop their logic only so far as they need it. Exposes it more as a justification after the fact, rather than one's judgements actually deriving from the logic.

He actually had the semblance of a point about many of the inaccurate associations legits will make with cheaters. Unfortunately, he shoots himself in the foot by doing the same thing back to legits, and coming up with some real shoddy arguments. But then, if he actually had a good article, I doubt D2.net would've published it.

[Elric of Grans]

Hail Artega,

Nice link: thanks for that :) Now down to my point of view (read: mindless blather)...

I love his discussion on how he uses bugged dupes, while people with dupes that are not `hacked' are legit. Hey, if there's anyone here up for it, I have a Cracked Sash that my friend, The Smith, hacked down to 0 durability: shall we start the bidding at $100? ;)

I don't much like his interpretation of what a hacker is, and he came off as a bit of a whinger to me. `Boo hoo, people look down on me because I need to pay money to cheat, but at least I'm not one of the people making these items, or causing Blizzard troubles. Just leave me alone, boo hoo.' Pfft, my Desert Amazon would like to introduce him to the sharp end of her Pike!

[gekko]

`Boo hoo, people look down on me because I need to pay money to cheat, but at least I'm not one of the people making these items, or causing Blizzard troubles. Just leave me alone, boo hoo.'

You nailed it right on the head there. I generally purposely ignore this kind of thing, since flaming them really doesn't accomplish anything. But sheesh. Does he honestly expect to get sympathy because he doesn't make the hacks, he just uses them?

gekko

p.s. 1 scroll of tp for the cracked sash -- early close plz

[Artega]

Just thought I'd show you to what lengths D2.net will go to bring attention to themselves :)

Actually, I thought it was pretty representative of what the average cheater's mindset is.

With all due respect, FoxBat, your view comes off as a bit hostile. Perhaps you're one of those who is tired of the endless arguing and whining about cheating vs. not cheating, but whatever. Not everyone has as perfected logical abilities as you, so forgive them if their arguments come off as uncouth. Perhaps you could tell me what they're doing wrong by arguing their point?

[CelticHound]

I have a Cracked Sash that my friend, The Smith, hacked down to 0 durability:

I still haven't found a writeup of the Cracked Set!

Pfft, my Desert Amazon would like to introduce him to the sharp end of her Pike!

I've found Charis' True Amazon, but he only gives passing mention to the Desert flavour. Are they detailed somewhere?

(edit: Note to Foxbat: maybe getting more page hits - regardless of why - brings a reward. And if you want an argument developed fully, you need someone like Sirian around. ;) )

(edit2: note to Atega: I believe Foxbat objects - and if so I agree - because the article is sensationalist tripe. I think they hosted it just to stir things up and get more page hits. Surely, someone must be able to come up with a better rationalization for cheating than that clown did. At least don't make the flaws quite so painfully obvious.)

-- CH

[FenrisWulf]

Originally posted by CelticHound
(edit2: note to Atega: I believe Foxbat objects - and if so I agree - because the article is sensationalist tripe. I think they hosted it just to stir things up and get more page hits. Surely, someone must be able to come up with a better rationalization for cheating than that clown did. At least don't make the flaws quite so painfully obvious.)

I believe that Artega was referring to Foxbat's comments about the people arguing against the pro-cheating argument presented in the article, not those concerning the argument of the article itself.

[Elric of Grans]

Hail Celtic Hound,

"I still haven't found a writeup of the Cracked Set!"

I wore the Cracked Set on my Lemming - is that what you are referring to? Or do you mean more along the lines of the LL facination with the Cracked Sash?

"I've found Charis' True Amazon, but he only gives passing mention to the Desert flavour. Are they detailed somewhere?"

All other classes of Amazon go through more or less the same training as the True Amazon: there's just a few, smaller changes. Here's a post Charis made when I asked about the other kinds of Amazonian:

Excellent!! Congratulations to Grand Matron Hippolyta, Champion of Hell

Looks like you caught a key point, that a True Amazon should be able to take out ANY creature, by herself, there should be nothing that sends her home packing or moaning.

I had two Amazons in D2, but was sad by the tediousness of melee combat. Compare thunk thunk with an axe or sword(/shield) with blasts of multishot or lightning fury. Part of my 'problem' was trying to recreate these personalities from D1, where they just tore things up in melee combat, and killing speed was almost equal between melee, bow and magic - it was truly a choice of situation and preference which you went with. Going into it without such emotional baggage or with an expectation for slower going at high lvls would help for D2. Here's the rub... the Amazon was designed to be very tough at low lvl, and progressively less shackled until at the highest lvl she was a killing machine. The D2 system meant that she had no particular problems at all before lvl 30, got tough in NM, and became tedious in Hell, just the opposite!

For the Amazon variants, let me first describe their D1 intent:
- Jungle amazon had to be low armor. This took away the 'invulnerability' that a high AC fast block rogue had. Also, many D1 AMZ's abandoned the bow at high lvls, the Jungle Amazon favors the bow.
- Desert Amazon - descendents of Valkyrie and Amazon alike, masters of the spear
- Mountain amazons had no D1 counterpart. They were envisioned as an amz tribe that loved to use height to their advantage by using javelins and boulders(!)
- Barbaric Amazon - those who eschew juju, cousins to the Barbarian
- Amazonian Spellbinder - Amazon tradition in the Sorceress class


How does this translate to intent for D2?
- Jungle Amazon - low AC, at most breastplate and probably lighter. They use *bow*, not javelin, as their main attack.
- Desert Amazon starts to look more like a typical Spearazon build at higher lvls, but still packs a bow and s/s and knows how to use them)
- Mountain Amazon
> Other than the training and role, what would be the
> difference between them and the next Javelin Amazon?
By 'rule', nothing in gear and skills, but hopefully by the higher lvls you've build up a style and role that does differentiate. What I would likely do is to choose a skill other than the uber Ltning Fury for my main attack, and bring that out only when fighting 'mortal enemies' like succubus and their friends. Sadly, LtFury only became uber with one of the patches, when I build mine up, painstakingly, it was a very so-so skill. Poor girl also maxed the clvl 30 melee lightning skill, a TRUE dog. One stylistic point to keep in mind with playing a mountain AMZ would be to always STRIVE to get on high ground for your attack. (Even if it's just a few feet above your foe, like in-pit vs top-of-pit in the bloody foothills). Lure things back to stairs on the Plains of Despair, etc. (dangerous ;P)
- BAR-AMZ:
> It sounds like this one is mostly Axe, Sword Shield,
> whatever...is that right?
Pretty much, except not 'whatever'! Axe and Sword are by far preferred as traditional Amazonian wpns. There is a slight unwritten preference for Crossbow over Bow for Bar-Amz's (all other AMZ types have a tendency to prefer the Bow over the Crossbow, although that's not a hard-n-fast thing)
- Amazon Spellbinder: > this one I am most interested
> it! Any spell restrictions? Should there be a
> balance between melee and magic? Anything else?
Absolutely! There must be a balance, and ability to handle a melee situation if you had to without running away. Given the class-specific nature of D2 spells
(opposite from D1) this leaves two very distinct options for the spellbinder:
1) Magezon (AMZ class) - a total focus on elemental bow attacks (perhaps with pois from javelin, and lightning from jav only for cold/fire immunes) She specializes in a special breed of magic where the spell 'component' is the arrow itself, imbueing her attacks with elemental power. Sadly the timer system gutted the Magezon, but it's still playable in a variant sense.
2) Sorcazon (Sorc class) - a Sorc with the mindset and attitude of an Amazon. She'll likely pump strength at least partially, have a decent lvl cold armor and strive to have non-useless AC, and a decent skil in EACH of the three trees - again, striving for balance and having NO creature that is immune to her arts! She would not wield an orb unless it have great combat stats, viewing these as wienie juju sticks that sissy ladies use. Thus combat orb, combat staff, sword and shield, or a bow, would be her choice. Like many other amazons, she'll give strong consideration to Goblin Toes. Even here, there are two strong sub-routes: melee focus with max cold armor, high lvl static field, thunderstorm, firewall dropped on a foe she's meleeing to keep it there... or more of a ranged attacker, with a knockback bow and blizzard, or something like a wicked fast sword and chain lightning. You're right, the spellbinder has a LOT of very interesting possibilities. I was playing one, planning to max cold armor, wield Khalim's flail and Golbin toes, have good Tstorm, near max Chain lightning and a little firewall. Alas she had slogged through about lvl 30 before I retired from D2.

Good luck!
Charis

I hope that helps. I've made all the forms of Amazonian: you can find them on my website. I've only got my Desert Amazon to III/Nightmare; the others in I/Nightmare. I am sick to death of Act I, and hate the first half of Act III, hence why they have not progressed - I'm waiting for 1.10, and hoping that makes significant enough changes for me to get the urge to progress again.

If you have more questions, I can possably answer them; else, try Charis at RBD - who would know the variant better than its creator?

[CelticHound]

Well, I was wondering what the other pieces of the Cracked Set were - other than the Sash, of course. Also what special bonuses does it give? I've been speculating that equipping the complete set doubles the strength of a Hamster.

Was in a game with Charis tonight and asked - said he'd see about finding his notes.

Thanks,

-- CH

[Elric of Grans]

Hail Celtic Hound,

The boni of the Cracked Set are a secret guarded almost as closely by Lemmings as the TFOS itself - though not even remotely so values as The Great and Illustrius TFOS! - however, I shall share a few details about it...

It makes you more powerful than any non-Rodent can comprehend! As for helping you to die, I do not think anything compares to it. LemmingOfGrans spend many weeks collecting it, but it was worth the hunt...

Cracked Leather Gloves
Cracked Boots
Cracked Quilted Armour
Cracked Skull Cap (Cracked Cap is like fools gold; it's not really a part of the set)
Cracked Buckler
and...

CRACKED SASH

*ahem*

By wearing the Cracked Sash, the Lemming is able to die to fight again, rather than live to fail in dieing again - imagine wearing the kind of garbage most people do...Arkane's Valour? Hahahaha!

[Brista]

I have to say what an utterly utterly brilliant piece of sensationalist journalism by Flux!

Especially when paired with his almost simultaneously published article on The Most Annoying People on Battle.net here:
http://www.diabloii.net/columnists/flux16.shtml

(You'll find the writer in question fits into a good 50% of the categories)

My first reaction to A Hacker's Plight was to be quite cross, then I decided it was almost parodic, then I read Flux' new column and practically feel out of my chair :D

I think the worthy CanisMortifer has had a rather large "Kick Me" sticker attached to his rump by a certain devious website administrator


As for the Diinet thread that followed this one stood out to me:

Seluku: As others have said, if you're bored; There's tons of Mods you can play on

Does this mean we might expect Canismortified in Seven Lances soon trying to buy our YIN runes through Paypal? No wonder Foxbat is cringing

Great entertainment!

Incidentally back before D2 there was an urban myth about a "secret cow level" that many of us fell for. In D2 it came true. I'm just wondering if the playful Blizzard D3 team get their hands on this thread if there might be a cracked set Easter Egg in D3....

[FoxBat]

Once everyone starts agreeing one thing, I have to argue for the opposite. Usually doesen't matter what it is. :P

Seems that most people fail to recognize their arbitrariness in deciding what is cheating and what isn't, and treat it like some sort of absolute. For instance, some of their arguments are hostile to other things I value, such as modding, bnetd, and D1 Legitness. If their arguments crystalize and they then encounter such things, they won't respond well to them.

But basically, not only the article but the response it generates are sensationalized. It's mostly just legits bashing cheaters, cheaters bashing legits. (there are a few notable exceptions in the thread, but I doubt D2.net was trying to set up an actual discussion of the issue.) I don't find much point in the constant bashing, maybe communities need to demonize people to confirm their own values, but I don't.

[gekko]

I don't find much point in the constant bashing, maybe communities need to demonize people to confirm their own values, but I don't.

Actually, that's one of the main reasons I eventually DID switch to LoD, despite my previous refusal to do so. I think the reason "cheaters" get flamed so badly at a couple web sites is that many "legit" players think like I do -- they tend to congregate. Personally, I don't much care about the bugged or hacked stuff on the net, because I don't play HC and I don't duel. However, that doesn't mean I approve of it, and I do enjoy ridiculing those who not only break the rules, but think they're justafied in doing so.

To me, it's similar to Sirian's old bit about the hostility factor. Although I basically agreed with him, the system has never really bothered me. But then I thought about HC play. And that finished the argument for me.

The point is that constant bashing may not be a good thing, but hopefully it keeps the trolls out. And that's always a good thing (although the occasional sighting keeps things interesting).

gekko

[Archon_Wing]

I have to say what an utterly utterly brilliant piece of sensationalist journalism by Flux!

Especially when paired with his almost simultaneously published article on The Most Annoying People on Battle.net here:
http://www.diabloii.net/columnists/flux16.shtml

(You'll find the writer in question fits into a good 50% of the categories)

My first reaction to A Hacker's Plight was to be quite cross, then I decided it was almost parodic, then I read Flux' new column and practically feel out of my chair :D

I think the worthy CanisMortifer has had a rather large "Kick Me" sticker attached to his rump by a certain devious website administrator


As for the Diinet thread that followed this one stood out to me:

Does this mean we might expect Canismortified in Seven Lances soon trying to buy our YIN runes through Paypal? No wonder Foxbat is cringing

Great entertainment!

Incidentally back before D2 there was an urban myth about a "secret cow level" that many of us fell for. In D2 it came true. I'm just wondering if the playful Blizzard D3 team get their hands on this thread if there might be a cracked set Easter Egg in D3....

I was waiting for someone to point out Flux's ploy. Yea, he likes stirring up people. :P

[ManaCraft]

Despite of the fact that I avidly disagree with the auther, I actually enjoyed reading the article - right up to the point where he shot it all to pieces with the usual "I'd own you anyway, so I might as well cheat" and "exceeding the limitations" arguments. There are plenty of ways to renew the game without resorting to cheating.

The thread at D2.Net makes for great entertainment though. :P


ManaCraft

[CelticHound]

Okay, I think I'm getting the picture. So the Cracked Set is like an improved version of Sigon's. It's the sash (as opposed to the shield) that's the highlight of the set. And it's so powerful, that instead of having green or gold bonuses for being (partially) equipped, it has transparent bonuses...

I can see why it's an impressive set for Lemmings, but are there any Hamster-specific bonuses? (I guess I'll just have to collect the set with a Hamster and find out!)

-- CH

[Occhidiangela]

1) Magezon (AMZ class) - a total focus on elemental bow attacks (perhaps with pois from javelin, and lightning from jav only for cold/fire immunes) She specializes in a special breed of magic where the spell 'component' is the arrow itself, imbueing her attacks with elemental power. Sadly the timer system gutted the Magezon, but it's still playable in a variant sense.

I had must started an Amazon who might sort of fit into this class. Guess I need to flesh out the idea.

1. She only uses Elemental Attacks: no GA, no Jab, no Fend, No Impale.

2. She has to max, or try to

LF or Charged Strike
Plague Javelin
A cold arrow skill
A fire Arrow Skill

And, she needs to use them.

Valkyrie: have not decided whether or not this summonable fits. Decoy for sure is valid skill, as it is a 'magical' skill.

Her problem will be how to acquire a big enough mana pool to constantly use her Mana intensive skills. :)

QUests: OK, I suppose we can work that out.

Armor: Needs to be sort of light, as she is more of a sorceress than a warrior: Mage Plate maybe, but mostly leatherish stuff. (That rules out Frosties! :) )

Crafting? Caster Crafts sound like part of the answer.

Weapons: Must have either a gemmed elemental effect, or an elemental affix in order to use once the quests are done (quest issues to be developed later.)

So, if she is a sorceress Amazonian, do I need to modify her for Desert, or can she be from most anywhere?

[Occhidiangela]

I've been reading a couple of posts here and there throughout said thread, and Iz-GOod mentions a psychoanalyst-type by the name of Kohlberg, and that he has a sort of chart that defines how people come to what they believe is right and wrong. Or something along those lines. I found an article on Kohlberg's chart/principle/whatever at Notre Dame's site. You can find the article here.

Thanks for the link. :)

[Elric of Grans]

Hail Occhi,

I've not yet made an Amazon-class Spellbinder (though, I do have a lovely Sorceress-class Spellbinder - very fun :D ), however I would imagine you'd play her pretty similar to a True Amazon. Go through the early weapon-training (which means little to no magic before Act III), and later on increase the magic focus. Where would she be from? She could be from anywhere, though I would be tempted to say she's from the Jungles of Kehjistan if she primarilly used a bow, and from the Mountains of Khanduras/The Runding (or just about anywhere else) if she primarilly used Javelins - in the end though, it would only be for back-story, as her style of play is different to the others.