02-21-2003, 10:02 AM
Well, I think lvl 20 is generous: I would say all (not majorly twinked) sorcerors go through the normal game as 'arty' mages. It's only afterwards, say above clvl 25, that the distinction between the heavy-plate-wearing tanks and the rag-wearing artys becomes meaningful.
I'd generally agree. Developing Tank Mages isn't really my area of expertise anyway :)
I was always convinced -- and still am -- that in D1 tanks are overall "better" ("faster", "easier", "more-uber", "more-uberly-uber", or whatever) than artys, just because you *can* have it all in D1 -- high AC, max resists, and super-destructive spells. Trading a couple of lvls of fb for the possibility (however remote) of lava maws chewing on your bones was never an even trade.
I would suggest that anyone who thinks lava maws are more dangerous than soulburners is not really an arty mage, regardless of what setup they use. We start with the low level scenario where playing like a tank doesn't work very well at all, and we move towards the Dream Gear scenario where one can argue that the mana and spell level differences between an arty and tank are almost meaningless. Somewhere in between those two scenarios, I tend to quit the character and start a new one... so perhaps that is why I don't see tanks as being more powerful. But I do think that in the Dream Gear scenario, a skillful arty can usually still clear levels as fast as a skillful tank. A skillful Geezer is another story!
It's the same with rogues: high ac rogues are just "better" ("faster", "easier", "more-uber", or whatever) than their low ac counterparts (even though I loved to play the low ac archer-rogues).
In my experience, it can be very costly in terms of life/mana and/or resistances to try to fit a rogue for high AC by level 30. Once the right gear can be found though, it's probably the way to go.
And, speaking of rogues, as the long lamented Sorceror (wonder what he's up to now?) used to say, the best weapon for a rogue (and possibly even a warrior) is a dreamflange. The key for an effective all-around high-lvl rogue was to get your magic stat close to 160. Then I think they did compare very well with mages, or anyone else, in hell/hell. But, even though they have the easiest time vs triple immunes, they can never get the fast cast speed of mages.
In addition to the casting speed issue, the mana pool is a lot smaller, and item recoveries more tedious. Still, it is amazing how well a rogue can do simply by imitating a mage (with the proper gear, at least). I think Sourceror's minimage even switched to the Cudgel against soulburners and advocates, although I would probably prefer to use a bow in those situations. I think Sourceror's minimage was also about 15 levels higher than any rogue I've ever built...
I'd generally agree. Developing Tank Mages isn't really my area of expertise anyway :)
I was always convinced -- and still am -- that in D1 tanks are overall "better" ("faster", "easier", "more-uber", "more-uberly-uber", or whatever) than artys, just because you *can* have it all in D1 -- high AC, max resists, and super-destructive spells. Trading a couple of lvls of fb for the possibility (however remote) of lava maws chewing on your bones was never an even trade.
I would suggest that anyone who thinks lava maws are more dangerous than soulburners is not really an arty mage, regardless of what setup they use. We start with the low level scenario where playing like a tank doesn't work very well at all, and we move towards the Dream Gear scenario where one can argue that the mana and spell level differences between an arty and tank are almost meaningless. Somewhere in between those two scenarios, I tend to quit the character and start a new one... so perhaps that is why I don't see tanks as being more powerful. But I do think that in the Dream Gear scenario, a skillful arty can usually still clear levels as fast as a skillful tank. A skillful Geezer is another story!
It's the same with rogues: high ac rogues are just "better" ("faster", "easier", "more-uber", or whatever) than their low ac counterparts (even though I loved to play the low ac archer-rogues).
In my experience, it can be very costly in terms of life/mana and/or resistances to try to fit a rogue for high AC by level 30. Once the right gear can be found though, it's probably the way to go.
And, speaking of rogues, as the long lamented Sorceror (wonder what he's up to now?) used to say, the best weapon for a rogue (and possibly even a warrior) is a dreamflange. The key for an effective all-around high-lvl rogue was to get your magic stat close to 160. Then I think they did compare very well with mages, or anyone else, in hell/hell. But, even though they have the easiest time vs triple immunes, they can never get the fast cast speed of mages.
In addition to the casting speed issue, the mana pool is a lot smaller, and item recoveries more tedious. Still, it is amazing how well a rogue can do simply by imitating a mage (with the proper gear, at least). I think Sourceror's minimage even switched to the Cudgel against soulburners and advocates, although I would probably prefer to use a bow in those situations. I think Sourceror's minimage was also about 15 levels higher than any rogue I've ever built...