The Five Second Rule
#5
Concillian,Feb 15 2005, 05:17 PM Wrote:I agree that Spirit is going to be an important class for raid bosses, and if you talk to those who do those things on a regular basis spirit is a definite part of their equipment. 

I think Spirit is part of the equipment because it's a marginally beneficial stat after INT and STA and is more useful than say STR for a caster.

Quote:However, if you look at the Conquest strategies that they shared, you'll see that
1) All their priests use flash heal exclusively
2) They get around the issue by 'brute force'  They have 9 healers on the main tank plus 4 for the off tanks?  That's a ton

With enough SPI you can see rapid mana regen. MOTW + BOK + Divine Spirit does give significant returns, however BOK is restricted to the Alliance side and you only need 1 Priest with DS to buff all the healers on the raid. It wouldn't surprise me if the Conquest guys do utilize SPI buffing for the downtime reduction, but again, more than 1 Priest with DS is overdoing it.

Quote:I don't know that I would build a full discipline build, but it seems like a flash heal-centric build is in order, with improved crit and armor bonus to help offset the lack of mana efficiency.  If you are getting 10-15 heals per second and you have priests that crit 15% of the time then ONE will crit on average 90-95% of the time within the 15 seconds.

If you want a FH centric build, you may want to consider using Spirit of Aquamentas + Choker of Enlightenment + MC Cloak which all offer a flat 25 mana discount to all spells cast. This gives you a total of 75 mana off each spell cast and makes FH more efficient than GH HPM wise.

I'm just curious how you can get a Priest's heals to crit 15% of the time? Mark of the Beast and Holy Spec only seem to work on damage spells and not healing spells, so AFAIK heals are still restricted to the 5% base crit.

Quote:So spirit almost always loses out when you're considering a 5 man because there aren't battles that last so long that actively pursuing +SPI items are worth it.  It's simple math to figure out why.  Raid bosses last long enough that you definitely run out of mana and need to regen.  In these cases the 5 second rule and crit% still make INT somewhat important, but spirit is important as well. 

Indeed. It's not so much the lack of longevity of 5 man fights but the burst healing it requires. SPI cannot be as important as INT as long battle regen is restricted and the group requires constant healing. If they wanted to tailor such events to give SPI some clout with the current mechanics, damage would need to happen in bursts with long periods imbetween so that healers could actually not have to cast for prolonged periods in order to regain mana. However, due to the general lack of predictability of damage and the constant needs for heals, dispels, disease cures, etc. it really isn't possible for significant regen to kick in between heals to make SPI an advantageous stat. In raid instances with healer rotations, this is actually possible, but with supplemental skills like Innervate, Mana Spring/Tide totems, etc. group dynamics play a greater role than SPI does as well.

Quote:Spirit might need a small boost to regen rate, but I think it needs something else.  Make the top tier disc talent more significant, or make the in-combat regen more significant, or make it the crit stat for priests, do something so that priests want spirit.  It should be the primary stat for priests, Blizzard needs to do something so that it is, because right now it's only a real consideration if you're fighting raid bosses.

Completely agree, and as mentioned before, even against raid bosses, skills from other classes can eclipse the need for SPI, which makes the stat even less desireable.

Then of course, being able to drink once combat is done makes SPI useless as a downtime reducer as well.

The only real use I got out of SPI was when soloing my Priest as a full shadow spec. SoA + high SPI gear + Spirit Tap made downtime pretty non-existant after level 56. I also happened to try out a Heavy Discipline build (with Divine Spirit), only to find out that the Shadow spec still outperformed it when soloing. When in groups, I may have ended up with more mana with the Disc spec, but I still needed to sit and drink afterwards, and it didn't make a significant difference during group combat. The return on investment just wasn't cutting it. However, now that I am tri-specced for instance/raid running, soloing has become rather painful compared to the old days.


Quote:What are mages going to do for mana?  Warlocks can pull mana from their pet as an affliction build (imps regen ~200 mana per 5 seconds), or they can life tap and get a renew for mana, but mages just have to wait out the regen.  I hope their wand skills are polished!  :)

Most mages I know get Evocation, which although on a 10 minute timer, I am very envious of. Getting a huge burst of mana at will, even during combat, even though it's on a timer, is a very nice talent to have. Then there's always the hope that some Shaman has specced Restoration high enough to have Mana Tide Totem, or a Druid has Innervate.
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Messages In This Thread
The Five Second Rule - by Bolty - 02-15-2005, 03:36 PM
The Five Second Rule - by Tal - 02-15-2005, 03:58 PM
The Five Second Rule - by Bun-Bun - 02-15-2005, 04:56 PM
The Five Second Rule - by Concillian - 02-15-2005, 05:17 PM
The Five Second Rule - by t0a5t - 02-15-2005, 06:01 PM
The Five Second Rule - by Skandranon - 02-15-2005, 07:22 PM
The Five Second Rule - by MongoJerry - 02-15-2005, 10:23 PM
The Five Second Rule - by Xanthix - 02-15-2005, 10:42 PM
The Five Second Rule - by Malakar - 02-15-2005, 11:10 PM
The Five Second Rule - by playingtokrush - 02-16-2005, 06:00 AM
The Five Second Rule - by MongoJerry - 02-16-2005, 06:34 AM
The Five Second Rule - by playingtokrush - 02-16-2005, 07:14 AM
The Five Second Rule - by MongoJerry - 02-16-2005, 08:16 AM
The Five Second Rule - by playingtokrush - 02-16-2005, 09:16 AM
The Five Second Rule - by Malakar - 02-16-2005, 12:34 PM
The Five Second Rule - by playingtokrush - 02-16-2005, 01:36 PM
The Five Second Rule - by Artega - 02-16-2005, 07:19 PM
The Five Second Rule - by Concillian - 02-16-2005, 09:50 PM
The Five Second Rule - by Bolty - 02-16-2005, 10:31 PM
The Five Second Rule - by Skandranon - 02-16-2005, 10:50 PM
The Five Second Rule - by savaughn - 02-16-2005, 11:11 PM
The Five Second Rule - by MongoJerry - 02-16-2005, 11:20 PM
The Five Second Rule - by playingtokrush - 02-17-2005, 12:07 AM
The Five Second Rule - by MongoJerry - 02-17-2005, 12:37 AM
The Five Second Rule - by MongoJerry - 02-17-2005, 12:59 AM
The Five Second Rule - by playingtokrush - 02-17-2005, 02:18 AM
The Five Second Rule - by Artega - 02-17-2005, 04:08 PM
The Five Second Rule - by LordJaeden - 02-17-2005, 07:37 PM
The Five Second Rule - by Malakar - 02-17-2005, 07:38 PM
The Five Second Rule - by Ruvanal - 02-17-2005, 10:15 PM
The Five Second Rule - by playingtokrush - 02-17-2005, 11:36 PM
The Five Second Rule - by acidjax - 02-20-2005, 04:12 AM

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