patch 2.0.10 notes on the PTR

[Tal]

That's insulting.

I haven't insulted you yet. You either hadn't been reading my posts or making blanket assumptions based on what I haven't said.

Holding a mob's attention with no DPS on it isn't tanking; a Restoration druid cannot deal enough aggro to tank anything as soon as DPS opens up (and I strongly doubt they can hold aggro well enough to keep it away from healers). A Holy paladin cannot either. Retribution paladins are currently a joke for raid purposes, although they can do enough threat (just as Balance druids).

Except...I've seen a resto druid and a retribution paladin tank and hold aggro in both five mans, heroics and most recently ot'd in a raid environment. Granted I've not seen a balance or a holy paladin tank in those situations but given how a well played hybrid has surprised me in the past I'm not going to dismiss them as easily as you. I've also seen retribution paladins keep up with me on the DPS meters in the 40 mans (have not raided with him in the new content yet).

Warriors were brought more regularly than druids.

Does that prove that warriors were needed and or required as you asserted?

You're the one assuming that Arms/Fury warriors wouldn't be brought along if Protection paladins and Feral druids are better tanks. Fair's fair.

I'm not assuming anything - I'm asking why a raid leader would voluntarily choose to bring a dps warrior over a protection specc'd paladin or a feral druid in a raid environment. I'm countering your arguments that feral druids/protection specc'd paladins should be better tank choices than a warrior.

A Feral druid does not bring DPS equal to an Arms/Fury warrior. He brings healing, DPS and tanking, yes, but his DPS can be replaced favorably by any DPS class in the game (including the warrior), his tanking is apparently equal to the Arms/Fury warrior (who deals more DPS), and his healing would be better as a Restoration druid. Arms/Fury warriors bring consistant high DPS to a raid. They ALSO bring tanking when necessary.

I make no claims that I'm the best arms/warrior around. I've been in the end game instances such as BWL/AQ40 and Naxx and have seen cat druids keep pace with me. As to a feral druids healing being better as a restoration druid thats not really a valid comparsion is it? I'd tank better as a protection specc'd warrior wouldn't I? We're talking about what a feral druid brings to the raid not what he COULD bring if he was a different spec. Its extremely powerful to have a hybrid that can change gear between fights and assist the healing corps on tough fights. If you think I'm joking I only have to introduce you to Arshes, Mathom and Liska who have done a outstanding job of tanking, healing and DPS in raids.

Stop it with the joke-buff; Mark of the Wild is the least notable buff of the class-specific buffs, as it provides only a small bonus (though to almost everything). In other words, it's negligible. Disregarding that, you only need one druid to cast Gift of the Wild five times.

I don't agree with you about Wild and also don't feel like its even remotely useful to slow down buffing by limiting my raid to one druid buffer. YMMV.

Reread my previous post--I updated it a few minutes after posting, and it seems you missed the update. It's right there.

I'll do so.

Except as soon as they are "on par", it's more beneficial to bring a healer and a DPSer instead of the others.

Only if you're short sighted and small minded enough to not realize the extraordinary power and flexibility that the true hybrids bring to a raid bringing us full circle back to my original argument. Please drive through.