Greek Life

[Baylan]

When reading one of the Christmas posts another member of this board mentioned being part of a fraternity, and I was kind of curious on what others on this board felt about the existance of social Greek Life on university campuses nowadays.

I'm personally part of a fraternity - and I love it. It is an interest experience that has greatly added to my collegiate experience thus far, and I'm making life-long friends with some of my experiences. Whether its a 4:30 am snowball fight, or making a beer pong table out of snow (link), I've only been active for a semester and I love everything about it.

I understand, though, the negative stereotypes. There is another forum that I visit on a regular basis that is based on the sports at my university, and fraternities are frowned upon greatly (sororities are okay though - they like the girls!). Obviously, hazing is an issue with many chapters on many campuses. The biggest complaint that I seem to hear though, is the fact that Greeks have a tendency to look down upon others, or that they're the "ex-jocks" who're trying to relive the glory days of high school. Its an interesting phenomenon...

So I was kind of curious - who participated in Greek life back in their college days? What houses? What did or do you perceive as the positives & negatives nowadays?

Personally, I'm a Psi Upsilon. Positives? I can't argue with meeting lots of cute girls. I'm looking forward to living with 20-25 of my best friends next year when I move into my house. Its a safe place to go, and I'm taking over as treasurer of my house right now - meaning that I'm handling a non-profit that turns over almost $200,000 a year. Its also an interesting experience in dealing with 35-40 other guys who have differeing opinions & ideals in terms of what would be best for the organization as a whole. Negatives? The stereotypes kill. Its tough to walk down the street and know that some people will hate you just because you are Greek, or the rivalries between houses. I like to think that my house is pretty level headed & cool, but some houses are filled with people who intentionally like to screw things up for others.

I'd say that the positives outweigh the negatives, though. I love my house, I love the guys in it, and I love the experiences I've had because of it. I've got 2.5 more years of it coming, and I'm gonna love every minute of it.

-Baylan

[Maitre]

So I was kind of curious - who participated in Greek life back in their college days? What houses? What did or do you perceive as the positives & negatives nowadays?

I have mixed feelings about my Greek experience. While at school I was an acive member of Kappa Kappa Psi, national honorary fraternity for college band members. Not a traditional social Greek fraternity, but we incorporated many elements of the social houses on campus into our membership process, and our operations, though our mission was the advancement of music and musical participation, and their contribution to campus and community life.

Our chapter was all male, which has become less common for chapters of KKPsi on campuses across the country (while the organization began as all male, and a sister sorority [Tau Beta Sigma] of common purpose was founded decades ago, both organizations are co-ed nationally, and many campuses have chapters of only one of the groups with co-ed membership).

We did not have a "house," as the majority of social fraternities do. Instead we had four 4-6 bedroom houses off campus that had been rented continuously by members of the fraternity for a number of years. Three of these houses were owned by the same landlord, who liked us as tenants because we always paid our rent on time, found new tenants to sign next year's lease, and never complained about the condition of the houses.

Enough background. I was fortunate to make a number of friends with whom I have kept in contact; but these friends were people that I knew through other activities anyway. There were some very enjoyable experiences that I had with my fraternity brothers, but I don't think there was anything that was truly irreplaceable (of course my view on that has radically changed now that my son has started asking if we can go "ou-schide" for a "wok"). I also had a few very negative experiences with some of my fraternity brothers, one of which completely ended my relationship with my "big-brother" (the mentor who assisted me through the pledging process).

To me, rather than comparing the positives of membership to the negatives, it would be more relevant to compare the positives and negatives of membership to a college experience without membership in a Greek organization. In my case, I would have made some of the same friends, and could have had the same negative experiences without joining a fraternity, though YMMV, especially in looking at a true social fraternity.

[Griselda]

I would think that it would depend upon the fraternity, as well as how fraternities in general operate at your particular school. I live in a university town, blocks from frat row, and the school social scene here is pretty much dominated by the Greek system.

Unfortunately, the frats here don't seem to be making a very good name for themselves in our town. Last year, a homeless man got shot in an alley behind a frat house- it turns out that several members of that frat had been making a sport of shooting at the homeless from their frat's window for some time, but this time somebody finally hit. The punishment? A slap on the wrist. Boys will be boys, you know.

You really don't want to walk near any frat houses at night, either, if you don't want to get beer bottles thrown at you. This kind of defeats the purpose of living within walking distance of town. The broken glass and garbage is pretty bad, too. I'm sure that many frat members are fine people individually, but sometimes they will do things in a group that they never would do on their own.

Of course, I'm sure that I hear about the "bad apples" more often than the other examples, but that's just the impression I have as a "townie".

I only know a little bit about sororities, because I've had a few student teachers who have been sorority members who have invited me to events at their house. In my experience, while I'm sure that members make lifelong friendships, it didn't seem like it did anything to foster independence or self-sufficiency in its members. It seemed like most girls went from their parents' house to the sorority to marriage without getting time to support themselves or learn how to be independent first. Some people probably prefer that approach, but it certainly was not for me!

[ima_nerd]

I would think that it would depend upon the fraternity, as well as how fraternities in general operate at your particular school.

That's exactly what it comes down to. I'm at Georgia Tech and haven't looked back since rushing my fraternity last fall. However, if I was at, say, Georgia Southern, not only would I not want to rush any of the fraternities there, I would likely be laughed at if I tried. This is why my friends from high school at Southern or UGA were so shocked that I joined a fraternity. The thought of me as a "frat boy" just didn't work for them and for good reason - I nor my fraternity fill that stereotype. We have our beer pong, we have our drunken parties and we have our tailgating for football but we also have a 36 hour video game marathon for Chiildren's Miracle Network, a reward given to the person dubbed the "Most Likely to Survive a Zombie Attack" and laundry room shelves full of a dozen variations on the board game Risk. Basically, we're a bunch of computer dorks minus the dork and plus good social skills.

Personally, I'm a Psi Upsilon.

Ha, going by GaTech standards, I am not surprised to see a Psi U on the LL. At Tech Psi U is one of the only houses thought of as "nerdier" (for lack of a better word) than my house. Although, I might have my Greek alphabet on backwards because I think it's co-ed. Is that done on a by-chapter basis?

[eppie]

Using my 'experience' with the dutch versions of frats I can only be negative.

Some people that go to university very much need others to show that they are going to university; best way to do that? join a frat.

Can't make friends on your own? ; join a frat.

Want to be sure you get a job using nepotism?; join a frat.

I also noticed that most people that continue for a PhD were not the ones in fraternities.

I mean, it will all be good fun, gives you a nice sense of 'home', but I just don't like the whole idea behind it.
If you go to university you are supposed to finish it yourself; it is not school. So why have your personal life 'being lived' in an organized way?

Of course I don't want to comment on people personally, not everybody is the same, and I know enough people that joined frats who are perfectly respectable people (and my idea of the lurkerlounge is that all of you are intelligent and respectable people). I just don't like the idea of forming societies that are there for, and to show that, you are able to go to uni.

[TheDragoon]

I would tend to agree that the experience of a fraternity will depend quite a bit depending upon the fraternity and university. At the UW, there were a number of pretty rowdy fraternities and sororities available for the people who enjoy that sort of thing. However, there were also a few more respectable groups that put much more focus on being civilized and giving back to the community. I have known people who have gone to both types of groups and I think most of them have had what they would call good experiences. I would note that several of the people that I knew who joined more rowdy fraternities didn't do as well in school after they joined, but I also knew people from them who did pretty well. I think it all comes down to where you put your priorities and what you put in/take out of the experience. If you can maintain your focus on your work while having fun with people and that is where your priorities lie, then it will probably turn out well for you. If you're easily distracted but don't care about your work as much, then you'll probably be happy, too. If, however, you want to put your work as the priority and you are easily distracted by what is going on, then things probably won't turn out quite as well unless you can find a group of like-minded people who provide you support rather than distractions.

Personally, I would never have had time or interest to join a social fraternity while I was in school. I was taking a full load of classes the whole way through (and fairly difficult ones, I might add) and my free time was usually tied up with band-related stuff, so the social fraternities were certainly not for me.

I am, however, a member of Kappa Kappa Psi (the college band service fraternity) and Tau Beta Pi (the engineering honor fraternity). KKY took up a fair amount of time, but it allowed me to do things like organize/participate in performances for charities (things like tutoring trombone at local elementary schools, going to play at retirement homes or helping to drum up support for floundering band programs) and it generally fit into my schedule. I got to know a number of friends much more than I would have, otherwise, and those are the people who I am still in close contact with now that we have all entered "the real world." The UW chapter of TBP didn't do very much but still gave me a few opportunities for moving into the business world and I was able to help jump-start the chapter (it had been down to a low of 1 active member the year before I joined). I think it is now going strong, so I was glad to help get that rolling again.

[Baylan]

Ha, going by GaTech standards, I am not surprised to see a Psi U on the LL. At Tech Psi U is one of the only houses thought of as "nerdier" (for lack of a better word) than my house. Although, I might have my Greek alphabet on backwards because I think it's co-ed. Is that done on a by-chapter basis?

There are some chapters of Psi U that are co-ed, which I think would be very interesting if that particular chapter had a house.

And we aren't exactly the "nerdy" ones on campus (that usually goes to Triangle...) but we aren't the biggest or most popular house on campus. Our nationals, and we, by association, are personally fans of smaller houses maxing at about 40-50 members (the largest chapter of Psi U sits at about 65 members). All in all, its an experience - we're actually starting to build up from a pretty rough time (we were down to about 15 actives in the mid to late 90s) and rebuilding our reputation on campus with all the sororities.

We're probably best known as being the gentlemen... We're very traditional. Formal meetings, formal dinners on Sundays. We also have some rules that many might see at archaic. We are not allowed to curse or kiss on the first floor of our house. Additionally, we stand whenever a girl walks through the front door. Drives us nuts, sometimes, but we maintain our rules because we are so traditional.



In any case, I agree with the whole idea that Greek life is very much dependent on the house that is joined - on some campuses it is much rowdier than others. And some houses are much rowdier than other houses. Personally, we live on the corner of a residential neighborhood, and we typically have pretty good relations with our neighbors. I just hope that we can keep that up and spread the love. There are some great things that fraternities and sororities do. Last year, the Greek Community here raised about $175,000 during Greek Week for cancer research in addition to each individual house's philanthropy events.

Just gotta keep working at that reputation, thing, right?

[LemmingofGlory]

When reading one of the Christmas posts another member of this board mentioned being part of a fraternity, and I was kind of curious on what others on this board felt about the existance of social Greek Life on university campuses nowadays.

I intentionally avoided Greek stuff in undergrad. The stereotypes were enough to keep me away. I was also significantly antisocial, so that wouldn't have worked well. That said, the Greek organizations were barely noticed. Every so often there'd be a flier for a Greek event, but that's about all I knew about them. I don't remember any scandals.

After I graduated, I dated a guy who was still rather active with his old frat. He really loved it, mostly as a social outlet, and most of his close friends were automotive nuts from his frat. My impression is they partied fairly heavily, which is how he developed a bit of a drinking problem for awhile in college, but I don't know if the parties were official frat events. I don't know what kinds of community outreach they did.

Right now I'm at a much larger campus. Greek organizations are extremely visible. There was a scandal this past semester where one frat's social events were cancelled for allegedly hazing members. But for the most part, when I see Greek stuff it's large signs rooting for the football team or the occasional table outside asking donations for a charity. I don't know anyone here who's in one, but there's a sort of homogenous style of dress that can flag when someone is likely in a fraternity or sorority. They look like drones.

-Lemmy

[kandrathe]

I intentionally avoided Greek stuff in undergrad. The stereotypes were enough to keep me away. I was also significantly antisocial, so that wouldn't have worked well. That said, the Greek organizations were barely noticed. Every so often there'd be a flier for a Greek event, but that's about all I knew about them. I don't remember any scandals.

After I graduated, I dated a guy who was still rather active with his old frat. He really loved it, mostly as a social outlet, and most of his close friends were automotive nuts from his frat. My impression is they partied fairly heavily, which is how he developed a bit of a drinking problem for awhile in college, but I don't know if the parties were official frat events. I don't know what kinds of community outreach they did.

Right now I'm at a much larger campus. Greek organizations are extremely visible. There was a scandal this past semester where one frat's social events were canceled for allegedly hazing members. But for the most part, when I see Greek stuff it's large signs rooting for the football team or the occasional table outside asking donations for a charity. I don't know anyone here who's in one, but there's a sort of homogeneous style of dress that can flag when someone is likely in a fraternity or sorority. They look like drones.

-Lemmy

One of my college girlfriends was in a Fraternity.

[Vandiablo]

One of my college girlfriends was in a Fraternity.

You cannot imagine how many possible responses I have had to that statement. It is hard, really hard, just feel how hard it is, to not use any of them. Even the ones that are somewhat witty are so puerile that even I, Vandiablo The Sophomoronic, could not bear to be associated with them. So maybe I'll whip up a new account.... bah, too much trouble.

-V
Improprietor
The Forsaken Inn
"Serving The Fraternity of Bigs and Littles"

[Vandiablo]

I'd like to spend half an hour responding to your post, but I don't have the time yet.

However, since the responses you've gotten so far are mostly lukewarm or negative, I just wanted to post here that I was in a social fraternity many moons ago, and it was a big positive.

My school had many fraternities and many of them were "drones" -- but the house I joined had about 40 members who were all unique each in our own way. I can't speak for being in a big house, but this size house, you know everyone, and in ours you usually got to know them quite well.

It's been 20 years, and there's still a group of about 30 of us plus about 30 wives that still party together 3 or 4 times a year. Funny thing is, it's mostly the wives keeping us all together.

-V

p.s. It's "about" 30 wives because of a couple single guys on one side, and a 2nd wife on the other. We've kept the first wife, but we don't see her as much, especially after she remarried and had kids.

[LemmingofGlory]

You cannot imagine how many possible responses I have had to that statement. It is hard, really hard, just feel how hard it is, to not use any of them. Even the ones that are somewhat witty are so puerile that even I, Vandiablo The Sophomoronic, could not bear to be associated with them. So maybe I'll whip up a new account.... bah, too much trouble.

-V
Improprietor
The Forsaken Inn
"Serving The Fraternity of Bigs and Littles"

I'm figuring it was a co-ed organization, but when somebody says "So my girlfriend used to be in a Fraternity." the first thing I think is "Was that when she could still pee standing up?"

-Lem