Game-Changing New Powers

[Monkey]

Wonderful to hear that Monkey

We're just in the process of setting up the guild this week. Rather than full-on Healer only we've decided to stick to a ratio of 60% heal-capable classes with a month on, month off system for healing duties

We also will be sticking to 5 mans at first as we want slow quality growth rather than a rush to get enough level 70s to do the 25 mans.

Excellent! Please let me know how it goes. We finally lost our online "healer" majority last night with the return of several inactive "non-healer" members (although many of them have "healer" alts!). Completely unsubstantiated reports from our membership indicates that more traditional warrior-priest-dps groups are actually running worse than our healer-majority runs. Even when we have a healing-healer, the splash healing from iVE or iLoTP is a significant boon to keep everyone at full health. And in my experience, our non-healing healers are better at managing threat (or maybe just surviving the inevitable aggro-pull).

[Artega]

Don't underestimate Spell Reflection in grinding. You know when I was soloing those Hederine Initiates seeing if an Eye of Shadow would drop? Kick was the main reason it was possible. The cost might be prohibitive, but if you build your attack around the reflect, and having the rage available for it, I'm sure it can be quite powerful.

As for myself ... I'll get back to you at 66. Envenom has been a mild disappointment, just barely clawing over Eviscerate in certain scenarios -> even with 0/3 Imp Eviscerate and 5/5 Deadly Poison. Deadly Throw seems like a nice addition to have, but I haven't used it yet, as I haven't seen a single decent throwing weapon.

If all you're talking about is needing a spell interrupt, wouldn't Shield Bash or even Pummel be better than Spell Reflect?

[WimpySmurf]

Doesn't Mind Flay instantly tag a mob? I suppose SW:D has a longer range.

You don't tag a mob until you've damaged it. The 1st tick of damage from Mind Flay occurs after 1 second of casting. So you've got a 1 sec time delay from cast to tag, during which time others who've got instant cast spells that cause damage can beat you to the punch.

-WimpySmurf

[Frag]

Cloak. Of. Shadows. :wub: :w00t:

~Frag

[Icebird]

From a warlock point of view, I'd have to echo what Lissa said about Fel Armor and Incinerate.

The extra damage from Fel Armor is nice, but what you *really* notice is the extra 20% healing. You get some quite ridiculous numbers when large heals crit.

With a full Destruction spec, Incinerate essentially does the same damage as Shadowbolt for less mana. Since Destruction is probably the most mana inefficient warlock spec (compared to say Affliction locks who barely have to eat or drink at all), I really like. The casting graphic is cool too. It's just nice to have a spammable fire spell that isn't the low damage-high threat Searing Pain (a winning combination if ever there was one).

I could see the spell being very popular with Warlocks who put zero points in Destruction because of the base 2.5 second cast time.

Two of our warlocks have hit 70 already (nutters...), and I did a Blood Furnace run with one yesterday and got to see Ritual of Souls in action.

Three word summary: Lightwell for warlocks

It's a ritual like Summoning, but once cast you have a clickable gem with 10 Master Healthstone charges. Clicking the gem puts the Healthstone in your inventory instantly - no loot box or anything. Vorix would cast it before boss fights; we could then use the Healthstone in battle, run back to the gem and restrock mid-fight. I think I used one Soulwell about 3 times.

I officially declare it "Best warlock spell *ever*". (Once more mages see it, they'll be demanding "Fountain of Vending" - just wait!).

Chris

[Monkey]

If all you're talking about is needing a spell interrupt, wouldn't Shield Bash or even Pummel be better than Spell Reflect?

I haven't started on my warrior past 60, yet, but in theory Spell Reflect is better than Shield Bash because it returns the damage to the target, helping you kill faster. Given the rage cost, it's probably the case that it's better when one spell cast from the target would do more damage to the target than one shield bash plus one heroic strike. That's just theory, though.

[Quark]

If all you're talking about is needing a spell interrupt, wouldn't Shield Bash or even Pummel be better than Spell Reflect?

It's not about one interrupt. It's about a group of them used to completely neuter a caster. For a Rogue, that means Kidney Shot, Kick, and Gouge. Having just one, or even two, isn't enough to stop NPCs from spellcasting. Having three, most of the time, is.

[Artega]

It's not about one interrupt. It's about a group of them used to completely neuter a caster. For a Rogue, that means Kidney Shot, Kick, and Gouge. Having just one, or even two, isn't enough to stop NPCs from spellcasting. Having three, most of the time, is.

Yes. Through Improved Shield Bash (3 second silence on top of a 6 second lockout) and Concussion Blow, I can generally shut down casters long enough for them to die. In the case of Paladins, I can shut them down indefinitely:)

It's even easier for my Shaman, assuming we're talking about them casting at me, and not at themselves or others. Earth Shock is on such a short cooldown, I can usually substitute Grounding Totem or War Stomp to buy time for another shock:)

[Artega]

I haven't started on my warrior past 60, yet, but in theory Spell Reflect is better than Shield Bash because it returns the damage to the target, helping you kill faster. Given the rage cost, it's probably the case that it's better when one spell cast from the target would do more damage to the target than one shield bash plus one heroic strike. That's just theory, though.

Spell Reflect only reflects the base damage of the spell being cast at you. So while that Fireball would normally hit you for 1,000 or more (well, maybe 900 or 800ish now that they've made Improved Fireball lower the spellpower coefficient), reflecting it back would hit them for 500 or so (wowhead and thottbot are both lagged to hell and back right now, so I can't get an exact number for max rank Fireball.) Even worse, it can be burned on a very weak rank1 instant (Rank1 Fireblast comes to mind), which means you just wasted 25 Rage to do very little or no damage (if they've got Fire Ward up), when that same Rage could be used for a Shield Bash + Heroic Strike combo with Rage left over (remember, any Protection Warrior worth his salt will have Focused Rage, and Arms and Fury specs would much rather just burn down the mob or player than try to tank it.)

In PvE, I think it would only be useful in very specific situations, since you'd expect raid bosses would be either immune to their own spells or even benefit from having them reflected back at them.

[Frag]

In PvE, I think it would only be useful in very specific situations, since you'd expect raid bosses would be either immune to their own spells or even benefit from having them reflected back at them.

Not quite... :D

Cheers,
~Frag :whistling:

[Artega]

Not quite... :D

Cheers,
~Frag :whistling:

So you're saying bouncing a fireball back at Ragnaros, the big fire dude, would actually hurt him?:P

[bonemage]

So you're saying bouncing a fireball back at Ragnaros, the big fire dude, would actually hurt him?:P

I believe what he is saying is that there are likely some encounters in TBC that spell reflection works really well, that people should try it and not just rule it out.

(This is my speculation) It is possible that even some encounters are designed around it, such as reflecting a debuff on a boss, similar to using Hakkar's life drain against him.

[bonemage]

So, my question to you others out there: is there a new spell/talent available that you feel changes the role/power of your class as significantly (or more)?

-Bolty

I have cast Victory Rush once. Part of this is my fault, as I often settle into a routine or rythmn, and Victory Rush isn't something I watch out for. After toying with it last night in Blood Furnace, I don't see it being a staple. It's an awesome ability, rage free instant attack with good damage (for a Prot warrior at least). It does seem very limited. I haven't toyed with it much, but it appears that you have to get the killing blow, and you have to be in battle or berserker stance while getting the killing blow in order for it to trigger. Not getting the killing blow or being in defensive stance means that it will not activate, even if you switch out of defensive stance.

What this boils down to for me, is this: It's a nice solo grinding ability, with lots of use in group PvP. Nearly useless for 5 man tanking, which for me, sadly, is the bulk of where my time is spent.

I'm looking forward to spell reflection and intvervention much more.

[Tuftears]

Lifebloom has been a definite help, but... Maim makes a big impact on the kitty-grinding! There are a lot of ways I can use these skills, alone or together:

* A 5-combo point Maim buys me enough time to do a full Healing Touch, Rejuvenation, and Lifebloom, after which I can go back to killing them
* Lifebloom in such a case will usually heal their first big hit when they wake up
* I can use Maim to reposition myself behind them and get off another Shred
* I can use Maim to interrupt their spells, i.e. self-heals or debuffs

[Artega]

Lifebloom has been a definite help, but... Maim makes a big impact on the kitty-grinding! There are a lot of ways I can use these skills, alone or together:

* A 5-combo point Maim buys me enough time to do a full Healing Touch, Rejuvenation, and Lifebloom, after which I can go back to killing them
* Lifebloom in such a case will usually heal their first big hit when they wake up
* I can use Maim to reposition myself behind them and get off another Shred
* I can use Maim to interrupt their spells, i.e. self-heals or debuffs

Maim should probably buy you enough time to clear combat and restealth, shouldn't it?

[oldmandennis]

Maim should probably buy you enough time to clear combat and restealth, shouldn't it?

PvE (kitty grinding) if you clear combat and restealth, the mob will regain all its health.

[Tuftears]

Maim should probably buy you enough time to clear combat and restealth, shouldn't it?

That would be PVP! Not something I spend a great deal of time thinking about or pursuing. Horde on my server is wary of world PVP because of the 2-1 Alliance proportion.

[Artega]

That would be PVP! Not something I spend a great deal of time thinking about or pursuing. Horde on my server is wary of world PVP because of the 2-1 Alliance proportion.

Last I checked, Cho'gall was 2:1 or worse (WoWCensus is down, of course, so I can't get a recent check), yet that doesn't stop us from winning most of the time. Quality over quantity, IMO:)

EDIT: You should give PvP a try, even if it's not your forte. It's a much more fast-paced and unpredictable variety of WoW, and can be a lot of fun when you're grouped with friends. The ubar lewtz that you can get through it aren't bad, either:)

[Drasca]

Last I checked, Cho'gall was 2:1 or worse (WoWCensus is down, of course, so I can't get a recent check), yet that doesn't stop us from winning most of the time. Quality over quantity, IMO:)

More fun when you lines are shorter too!

[Bolty]

That would be PVP! Not something I spend a great deal of time thinking about or pursuing. Horde on my server is wary of world PVP because of the 2-1 Alliance proportion.

I think it's more like 4:1 on Stormrage, maybe even 5:1, although with the Expansion out many retired Horde players have come back. It was a hoot to see Holydeathray in Zangarmarsh the other day; we /hi'd each other. Many fun hours in Warsong Gulch before it went cross-server...

What irritates me (oh noes, Bolty's irritated at something? That never happens) is how stupid some of the Alliance players are. Idiots who don't let Horde cap objectives in Hellfire Peninsula don't realize that they're driving the Horde away so that they give up and stop bothering...which means you get nothing because Alliance will control all three points all the time. Yes, it's dumb of Blizzard to design encounters which require you to "lose" so that you can "win" (a.k.a. gain honor marks), but it's equally dumb of Alliance players on Stormrage to not realize this and wafflestomp any Horde 5 on 1 who attempts to do any kind of world PvP.

Same thing happens at Halaa. Alliance players should let the Horde take the city, so they can gain honor marks taking it back and do bombing runs. I doubt I'll ever get the chance, though, since the moment any Horde attempts any kind of assult, 18 zillion Alliance players flood the city and ultragank any Horde around.

Then of course there are the kiddies on Alliance side who somehow think they're badass because they own the Horde so hard. Doesn't stop them from ganking a Horde 5 on 1 all the time; they're badass!

Thankfully there are battlegrounds to set the story straight. At least before cross-server BGs, Horde pugs beat Alliance pugs on Stormrage about 90% of the time in WSG and AB, despite a significant gear disadvantage due to far less raid progression. Horde always lost in AV though because Alliance had a constant stream of replacement players while Horde would get bored and /afk. Can't blame them.

If I were Blizzard, I'd put some kind of mechanic into the system where if one faction owns objectives for too long (say, 24 straight hours), it would be zerged by a flood of the other faction's NPCs. That way cities like Halaa that are constantly under Alliance control would at least fall to the Horde every once in a while and give the grossly overpopulated faction a shot at some marks.

-Bolty