PW:Shield Rage Generation Test Report

[MongoJerry]

Olon97 and I did some tests today to verify whether the priest spell Power Word: Shield affected a warrior's rage generation. Other people had done some tests reported on the official forums that concluded that rage generation was not affected by PW: Shield. However, there was a problem with their tests in that they were fighting low level mobs that only generated one rage point per hit. Olon97 had a theory that one could only generate one point of rage per hit with the shield on. Basically, his theory was that if you got hit with 0-90 damage, you'd get 1 rage point, 90-180 damage, 2 rage points, and so on. So, we made sure to find a mob that could damage Olon97's level 55 warrior enough to consistently give her two rage points per hit to test on.



After trying out out a few mobs in Un'Goro Crater, we finally settled on using an elite Stegasaurus to test on. Most hits by the Stegasaurus caused roughly 150 damage, meaning that they caused about two rage per hit. Sometimes one, sometimes two, but most often two without PW:Shield. And what happened when PW:Shield was on?

*drumroll*

No perceptible change. We tested with PW:Shield both on and off for several minutes and the difference was negligible. Olon97 wanted to believe that there might have been a small reduction with the shield, but even he had to admit that it was less than the error bars/lag allotment of the experiment. There really just doesn't seem to be any difference in rage generation with the shield on.

[Xanthix]

Thank you for doing this test and reporting on the results!

[Olon97]

Aye, it was hard to concede the results, but standing around watching the #s carefully it was pretty clear that there was extremely little difference.

I still maintain I noticed a (not statistically significant) difference, but it was on the order of 1/15 hits that would have been a 1 rage hit unshielded being a 0 rage hit while shielded. I could not observe such a difference on the 2 rage hits - so it could easily be attributed to noise.

As far as the simple question of rage generation per hit, the rule of thumb of 1 rage for every 90 damage delt (before absorption step) seems ballpark, although I definitely saw a hit slightly over 180 provide only 2 rage. The true calculation may be a bit more fractional.

[lemekim]

How did you guys account for natural rage generation while in combat, the slow trickle of generated rage that is separate from rage generated upon hits or being hit?

[MongoJerry]

How did you guys account for natural rage generation while in combat, the slow trickle of generated rage that is separate from rage generated upon hits or being hit?

The results were pretty clear. You could see the stegasaurus hit and 2 rage points generated. Hit, 2 rage points. Hit, 2 rage points. Hit, 1 rage point. Hit, 2 rage points. When we fought a smaller mob. It was hit, 1 rage point. Hit, 1 rage point. Hit, 0 rage points. Hit, 1 rage point. I'm not sure how big the effect is that you're talking about, but it must be small compared to the rage generated by the mob hits. Either way, the rate of rage generation was very similar with and without the shield.

[lemekim]

You mean it was reflected in the log? "Mob hits you for 150. You generate 2 rage"? That would indeed make it pretty clear. Or was it more of an eye-balling thing? The natural rage generation is about 1 rage per tick, so how that plays into rage from hits is unknown to me.

If it wasn't recorded in the log, maybe it would be simpler to have you guys duel and check the rage per hit that way? You can smite for considerable damage, and you can more clearly figure out just how much damage is needed for 1 rage point, and any shield effects would also be more pronounced.

[Treesh]

How did you guys account for natural rage generation while in combat, the slow trickle of generated rage that is separate from rage generated upon hits or being hit?
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I didn't think there was a natural rage generation while in combat. I've never seen my warriors get any just by being in combat, but not being hit or hitting. Granted, my warriors are all tiny, but if it was an inherent ability, it should have been seen by now I would think. Or is it something you get from talents?

[Tal]

How did you guys account for natural rage generation while in combat, the slow trickle of generated rage that is separate from rage generated upon hits or being hit?
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I have never heard of or encountered this. And having trained a new weapon recently against low level mobs (lots of whiffs on both sides) I stayed at 0 rage for quite a bit.

[lemekim]

While I am not sure as to exact nature, but the natural rage generation in combat may only be applicable if you have Anger Management talent. I am going to go on a limb and produce some theorycraft here, but here is what I think happens.

Warriors always have rage decay, however in combat, they also get rage generation equal to rage decay so that you don't actually lose rage if they are not hitting anything. But with 30% reduced rage decay from Anger Management, and rage generation in combat remaining the same, the generated rage will be now higher then what you lose to decay, and you would actually gain rage in combat even if you are not hitting anything. This alone would make this skill as good as Unbridled Wrath, and with only 1 point.

[Olon97]

While I am not sure as to exact nature, but the natural rage generation in combat may only be applicable if you have Anger Management talent. I am going to go on a limb and produce some theorycraft here, but here is what I think happens.

Warriors always have rage decay, however in combat, they also get rage generation equal to rage decay so that you don't actually lose rage if they are not hitting anything. But with 30% reduced rage decay from Anger Management, and rage generation in combat remaining the same, the generated rage will be now higher then what you lose to decay, and you would actually gain rage in combat even if you are not hitting anything. This alone would make this skill as good as Unbridled Wrath, and with only 1 point.
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I do not have Anger Management on my Warrior, so there was no natural rage generation. I also wasn't attacking (obviously). The only thing that changed my rage value was being hit (and the occasional stance change to clear the bar).

Anger Management is indeed a handy talent for those who can afford it in their builds for the above reason, however.

As a side note, level 5 Unbridled wrath when dual wielding (1h+unarmed for me) generates 0.43 rage per second on average, or 8.6 additional rage in 20 seconds. That's caculated based on tested accuracy data. Anger management trickles roughly 3-4 extra rage in a 20 second period (bloodrage goes to 23-24 reportedly), so 1 point in Anger Management is not quite up to the standard of Unbridled Wrath with a complimentary setup, though for any setup Anger Management is a better value per talent point invested.

[lemekim]

I do not have Anger Management on my Warrior, so there was no natural rage generation. I also wasn't attacking (obviously). The only thing that changed my rage value was being hit (and the occasional stance change to clear the bar).

Anger Management is indeed a handy talent for those who can afford it in their builds for the above reason, however.

As a side note, level 5 Unbridled wrath when dual wielding (1h+unarmed for me) generates 0.43 rage per second on average, or 8.6 additional rage in 20 seconds. That's caculated based on tested accuracy data. Anger management trickles roughly 3-4 extra rage in a 20 second period (bloodrage goes to 23-24 reportedly), so 1 point in Anger Management is not quite up to the standard of Unbridled Wrath with a complimentary setup, though for any setup Anger Management is a better value per talent point invested.
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I shouldn't be the one pointing this out to you, but bloodrage now is 10 second duration. And from tests is also seems to be about 7 rage per 20 seconds, which is quite comparable with Unbridled Wrath even when duel-wielding, and better then that for any other setup (two-handed or with a shield).

But yes, since you don't have this talent, it makes the point moot, I was simlpy making sure you guys have all your variables in check.

[Olon97]

I shouldn't be the one pointing this out to you, but bloodrage now is 10 second duration. And from tests is also seems to be about 7 rage per 20 seconds, which is quite comparable with Unbridled Wrath even when duel-wielding, and better then that for any other setup (two-handed or with a shield).

But yes, since you don't have this talent, it makes the point moot, I was simlpy making sure you guys have all your variables in check.
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Thanks for correcting me. For a skill I use every day you'd think I would remember the correct duration. :blush: Wonder if in my next post I'll refer to imp. bloodrage still reducing the rage generation time instead of its much improved current effect. :P

If I decide to do a specialized re-spec for MC, I might use both talents. ;)

[Grimjack]

Here is a link to some more analysis that apparently was taken from Blizzards forums.
Seemed like a rather good test, with some surprising results for me at least.

http://www.theamazonbasin.com/wow/forums/i...?showtopic=3871

Grimjack

[Darian]

I have never heard of or encountered this. And having trained a new weapon recently against low level mobs (lots of whiffs on both sides) I stayed at 0 rage for quite a bit.
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Well... I'm not so sure it doesn't exist, although the situations I've seen that lead me to believe it does may be bugs, since they happen during buggy situations.

Every once in awhile, when I'm on the move and get hit but keep going, I will permanently stay in combat until such time as I engage another mob and kill it (and this situation has lasted as long as 10 minutes with me being two zones away from the initial aggro). During that time, I am certainly not hitting anything, nor am I being hit, and I have no DoTs or debuffs on me... but my rage just keeps rolling up to 100%. Now I'm going to have to remember to test this under "normal" circumstances.

(My Anger Management is maxed ATM, BTW.)

[Alram]

Here is a link to some more analysis that apparently was taken from Blizzards forums.
Seemed like a rather good test, with some surprising results for me at least.

http://www.theamazonbasin.com/wow/forums/i...?showtopic=3871

Grimjack
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Really nice link with interesting info. Thanks.

[Kevin]

Here is a link to some more analysis that apparently was taken from Blizzards forums.
Seemed like a rather good test, with some surprising results for me at least.

http://www.theamazonbasin.com/wow/forums/i...?showtopic=3871

Grimjack
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The stickied Advanced Topics in Priest Play already has some discussion on this and links to the original official forum thread (if it is still there).

[Olon97]

That Blizzard post inspired the test MJ and I did, as without information on methodology, I wasn't convinced by Remedy's PW:S & Rage findings.

On a slight tangent, I just read the following tidbit on the Blizzard forums here:

RageForHitting = damage / (0.5 * level)
RageForGettingHit = damage / (1.5 * level)

Seems to make sense. Every warrior certainly knows there is some scaling with level on damage done and rage. So at the time of the test for this thread, I would have been getting 1 rage for every 82.5 damage - I do recall seeing some 2's after hits between 83 and 90, so that would explain it. The 90 damage per rage would be for level 60s. What remains a question to me is whether the game keeps track of decimal/fractional amounts of rage. If so, the +0s (or +1s in >90 hits) could be cases where the fractions didn't add up to the next integer - the game very likely rounds up all rage totals for the UI display.