Exactly what's the deal with the new Ambush/Bstab?

[Cyath]

I seem to be making a lot of topics recently...

Ok I know that it's getting buffed and that Lethality doesn't affect it anymore (at least Ambush) but how exactly does it work? Is it a damage increase over the board? Or do you need Attack Power+ items for it to really shine? How exactly is the damage calculated?

[russ]

I seem to be making a lot of topics recently...

Ok I know that it's getting buffed and that Lethality doesn't affect it anymore (at least Ambush) but how exactly does it work? Is it a damage increase over the board? Or do you need Attack Power+ items for it to really shine? How exactly is the damage calculated?
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My understanding is that, before the patch, on a rank 6 ambush, you would do:

[(weapon_damage x 3) + 290] * (1 - enemy_dmg_reduction)

With the current test patch, you would:
[((weapon_damage + (attack_power / 14)) x 3) + 290] * (1 - enemy_dmg_reduction)

The difference is mostly significant for agility rogues, giving a massive boost to their opener damage. Anyone with significantly buffed agility will have a major boost from this change.

[Phoenix]

I seem to be making a lot of topics recently...

Ok I know that it's getting buffed and that Lethality doesn't affect it anymore (at least Ambush) but how exactly does it work? Is it a damage increase over the board? Or do you need Attack Power+ items for it to really shine? How exactly is the damage calculated?
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We talked about it here. The formula is not quite what russ says.

[stabby]

We talked about it here. The formula is not quite what russ says.
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To clean up the equations I posted in the other thread:

Assuming that our subject has fully invested in Lethality, for values of W being weapon damage, A being attack power, and E being enemy damage reduction, the formulas should look like this:

Old System Backstab crit
[((W * 3) + A/14 + 210) * 2.3] * (1 - E)

New System Backstab crit
[(((W + A/14) * 3) + 210) * 2.3] * (1 - E)

Old System Ambush crit
[((W * 3) + A/14 + 290) * 2.3] * (1 - E)

New System Ambush crit
[(((W + A/14) * 3) + 290) * 2.0] * (1 - E)

As far as I'm aware, these should be generally applicable. To generate numbers for non-critical hits, simply drop the 2.3/2.0 multiplier, which is also what you adjust for less points in Lethality.

Feel free to plug in some statistics and generate some examples.

[Cyath]

No problem with the numbers so far...

Hmm, so as I understand it, Attack Power for Rogues is calculated using Strength + Agiility / 2 right? In that case should I be going for +Aigility items or +Attack Power items to get the most bang for my buck?

[Phoenix]

No problem with the numbers so far...

Hmm, so as I understand it, Attack Power for Rogues is calculated using Strength + Agiility / 2 right? In that case should I be going for +Aigility items or +Attack Power items to get the most bang for my buck?
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No, Attack power is just Strength + Agility. Agility does more than just add attack power though, since it adds Dodge chance, a tiny bit of armor (and most importantly) a higher chance of making a critical strike.

Usually items of a similar level have a lot more Attack Power than it has Agility, but an item with Agility might also have Strength, which can even it out. In any case you'll then have to decide if the small dodge and crit chance increase is worth more than higher increased damage is.

For exact numbers, a Rogue requires 29 AGI for 1% more crit on level 60, and 14.5% AGI for 1% more dodge at level 60. 14 Attack Power is 1 more DPS.

[gifpaste]

To clean up the equations I posted in the other thread:

Assuming that our subject has fully invested in Lethality, for values of W being weapon damage, A being attack power, and E being enemy damage reduction, the formulas should look like this:

Old System Backstab crit
[((W * 3) + A/14 + 210) * 2.3] * (1 - E)

New System Backstab crit
[(((W + A/14) * 3) + 210) * 2.3] * (1 - E)

Old System Ambush crit
[((W * 3) + A/14 + 290) * 2.3] * (1 - E)

New System Ambush crit
[(((W + A/14) * 3) + 290) * 2.0] * (1 - E)

As far as I'm aware, these should be generally applicable.  To generate numbers for non-critical hits, simply drop the 2.3/2.0 multiplier, which is also what you adjust for less points in Lethality.

Feel free to plug in some statistics and generate some examples.
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stabby do you have a formula for SS?

Edit: Also how (if at all) does weapon speed play a factor? I have seen people do the following:

[(WeaponSpeed * AP/14) + AvgWeaponDmg * 3]