Patch Notes for "The Burning Crusade"?

[Roland]

I too wanted to play Alliance PvE at first, but having found myself thrust in a Horde PvP server playing a sup-par PvP class no less. . . first impressions rapidly changed.

Too often people associate 'pretty' with 'good'. You trick yourself when you immerse yourself in that illusion. In story terms, the Alliance factions hold together by no greater thread  than the Horde ones do. Gnomes? Unreliable, to the point of complete disappearance from WC3. Dwarves? They help, when pushed. Elves are notoriously arrogant, and Humans are the easiest to corrupt of all (Human Medivh, and Prince Arthas being the worst offenders). Alliance was good in WCI and II because they were the ones struggling in defense against a frightening enemy. Well, that enemy was cooped up, mistreated and escaped to become its own nation overseas as the alliance faltered in its 'noble' values when their lives were no longer threatened.

Mayhap NOW the Alliance holds together no better than Horde, especially after the events of WC3, but before that they held fast in the face of a common enemy. The Horde only enlisted forces to help them annihilate everything in their path (in WC1 and 2, as you noted). In WC3, if you ask me, EVERYONE was the bad guy. Hardly anyone could arise over the petty fighting of the past in order to band together for the greater good. So, in that respect, I don't see anyone as "good" in these days, especially given the atrocious actions of Admiral Proudmoore.

And yes, the Alliance did falter. No denying that. But I like to believe that there was, and still is, much good within the Alliance - something I've yet to be convinced of in the Horde. They've proven they are just as susceptible to corruption as Humans, having warred within their own bands due to corruption. I have no qualms with the Horde breaking free of their chains and sailing off to form a new home for themselves. Azeroth is more than big enough to accommodate everyone. I don't see them as evil for doing this. However, that doesn't mean they're automatically "good" now just because they wanted to strike out on their own. Far too many, on both sides, still cling to the old ways of hate and war. But I find it much easier (and perhaps THIS is shallow, or merely too easy) to strike out as a "good" guy, who doesn't hold to the old ways, under the flag of the Alliance, who have shown to be capable of far more than just mindless bloodlust. The Orcs have not proven to me, and I doubt even to themselves, that they are fully beyond their old ways, and as such have a LONG way to go before they truly return to their original, noble roots.

Note also, there is no state of war between horde and alliance. Current story wise, Horde are not the bad guys, and neither are Alliance. Warlocks seem to be the bad guys  B)

Officially, there is no war. But that does not change the fact that you are at war with one another within the game. And current storyline, it is true that there are no "true" bad guys. Still, the Horde has not, as a WHOLE, given me enough reason to trust them to make "good" decisions. The Alliance, as a whole, has in the past, despite all their falters and failures. At worst, I can be a "freelance" Alliance member, choosing my own path rather than following mindless orders that are neither virtuous nor noble. I would find it much harder to do that under the flag of the Horde, mostly because only the Taurens have truly proven to be noble, while the Orcs are still trying to reclaim that for themselves (although that, in itself, is noble), and the Trolls... just seem along for the ride. Undead, as I've said already, have proven their intentions - kill everything and everyone as punishment for their existence and their exilement. Being on the same side as that is a doomed existence from the start, begging for internal strife. The only thing holding them in check is a lack of strong numbers.

Looks and first impressions color your opinion more than lore does. I sympathize a bit for wanting to 'look good', but it is false to think Alliance are the good guys. World PvP-wise, the players make who's good and evil and there are a lot of bullies around on both sides

Precisely. Lore colors my opinion much more than looks, believe me. Perhaps what I have said above will give you a greater understanding to that. I do not hate the Horde, nor do I feel they are necessarily inherently evil. The Orcs, however noble they once were and are trying to become again, are still fighting the old curse, on top of fighting to make a place for themselves in this world. (Truth be told, I would love to try and Orc simply to experience this - it's why I once took my Alliance Rogue right into the heart of Orgrimmar, so that I could see what it's like.) They have not, IMHO, reached that state yet, although I will cheer the day they do. The Tauren are brothers in arms to the Orcs, following a very similar tribal and shamanistic existence. And due to their debt, they will probably forever be their allies. They are not in the least bit evil, in my mind. Despite their strong, warrior-like presence, I don't even see them as very war-mongering - more, I see them as having evolved in a very harsh environment that forced war upon them at all times, and they responded within themselves only so far as to allow survival. Take away the constant threat of extinction, and I think their peoples would take up a far more peaceful way of life, though I doubt they'll ever give up their warriors. More, I think they would focus more on a peaceful existence, becoming even more shamanistic (or druidic). The Trolls have proven themselves, at least in recent centuries, to be little more than warmongering tribes of savages. Once, I believe they held a stronger, better society, but that seems to have vanished aeons ago, long before the Orcs ever set foot on Azeroth. And remember, it is only a single tribe that bands behind the Horde (or is it a small coalition of tribes?). Not nearly all of them banded behind the banner of the Horde, perhaps most notably because of this great splintering of ages past. Still, I don't forsee them banding together, as a whole, anytime in the next century or more. And as for the Undead, as I've said, I see them as the only truly evil race. Though I have no qualms with them breaking free of the chains of the Lich King (indeed, it is this that may actually help to save Azeroth from his sway one day), their very existence IS a threat to all other races, if only because they choose to make it so. In their secret hearts and minds, they are only biding their time until they are strong enough to wipe out all the other races. Were that to change, I suppose they would cease to be the only true evil race left in Azeroth (playable races, mind you), but I don't ever see that happening.

Horde Soul
You've taken notice of the native american quality of Tauren, the noble savagery of the warrior race of Orcs. Trolls? Granted, not much about them at all, but they have a wholeheartedly amusing west-indies accent which makes them on par for all 'witch-doctor' juju fans. Undead led by Sylvannas... These are 'freed' undead, with minds of their own. Is it not better to free those bound by slavery? While they're by no means good in the traditional sense, I see our undead as antiheroes, carving a niche out of an insane world.

A part of me is truly drawn to the Orcs and Tauren, and to a lesser extent the Trolls, but overall I have always found my home more comfortable within the Alliance. That is not to say that I have not played a Horde character, nor that I won't ever, but generally, when I take up a side, I tend to stick to it (in Planetside, I chose the Terran Republic, and never really looked back, even when they made it possible to fight for two factions on the same server). Mayhap when I've had my fill of Alliance, I shall strike out under the flag of the Horde, but for now, I still have far too much to see under my current banner, and far too little time to do both at the same time.

There is one unifying theme among the Horde factions. Freedom is new and precious. Orcs, from demonic bloodlust, Undead from the Scourge and Lich King, Tauren from annihilation on another world. Each faction's freedom is constantly under doubt. The lich king and demons of the twisting nether still loom over the horizon, and Tauren are inexorably tied to the Orcs ability to protect their own. The thirst and protection of newfound freedom resounds greatly as one interacts with Thrall, Cairn and Sylvannas. That feeling of freedom as a displaced people in a new land feels much more enriching than the Alliance who seem to have no great noble goals right now.

You are entirely right here, and I have always felt and agreed with this. You certainly hit the nail on the head, and I completely agree. However, see my thoughts above. There are certain elements (NOT the Horde as a whole; I've never felt that, not since the events of Warcraft III) that give me pause when considering the Horde, and it is that which truly holds me back from them. Believe it or not, my ties to Alliance are not nearly as strong as I would like them, precisely because of how you put it: "...the Alliance who seem to have no great noble goals right now." I guess you could say it's my old, romantic side that keeps me with them, hoping to be one of those who DOES have noble goals, and fights for them, and to restore them to the Alliance as a whole, one small step at a time (although, ultimately, this is up to Blizzard to decide). Believe me, I have my qualms with the Alliance, and so do many of its members, given the early quests found in the Human lands.

I've also become very enamoured with Robert E Howard's original Conan stories, and the disgust toward civilized nations. Horde is a much better option for all you noble barbarians out there who are in love with all things wild.

Then mayhap sometime I will give them another, more serious try in the future. But for now, I haven't the time, sadly.

The belief that Alliance is good is purely aesthetic. Good looking must be good, and parts of the story support it. That first impression is made, and never explored deeper. If I had not taken an unexpected plunge, I too might've settled at just that.  I've leaped into the Horde side and found the world was not so dark from the 'bad' guys. There is a savage beauty in being Orc, and nobility in Tauren when idling through their cities, running to the beat of drums in Orgrimmar, or carried forward by wind flutes in Thunder Bluff.

You chalk me up just as Concilian has, never bothering to read deeper into my thoughts. I have explained them as best I can, but if you cannot delve into them to see how I truly feel, then there is nothing I can do to convince you otherwise. I do not see the "pretty" races as "good" - quite the opposite, I find the Elves in particular, in ALL their breeds, to be far too haughty and vain to be anything even remotely "noble" or "good", but I have hope that, after WC3's events, the Night Elves will have seen enough to change that (although, again, much as with Humans there are problems within the Night Elves that are evident from the very get-go; perhaps due to all this internal corruption I may be driven to Horde sooner than I would have originally thought starting out in this game, but time will tell). ANd contrary to what you might think, I HAVE taken a plunge into the Horde, on the LL's chosen server, no less. I played for some time, but I just didn't find that "magic". Perhaps here I AM guilty of falling for the pretty things, as the ENVIRONMENTS of Azeroth are one of the biggest things that keep me coming back, and that of the Orcs (Undead I could deal with) is just too drab and desolate to really make me want to stay. The Alliance side has such splendorous beauty in its lands, especially within the Night Elves' home, that the magic from that ALONE is enough to keep me on their side. I've spent almost as much time simply exploring, fishing (not to actually catch anything, but as a mimicry of an old favored pasttime), and just standing around gazing at the scenery as I have actually advancing my main (who, BTW, is only 38 or so - just goes to show you my pace). The Horde lands have their beauty and charm, too, but I find the mystical and magical lands of the Night Elves too alluring to pass up so easily.

If you desire to go beyond first impressions, you'll discover a beauty in being Horde that goes beyond aesthetics and into the soul of the character.

I know this; don't ever think I don't. But my place, my feelings, my gut currently place me under Alliance. I take enjoyment out of ALL the game has to offer, not just bits and pieces. Do not underestimate me in this regard, as you and others have so seemed to have done. My time with the Horde is inevitable, but for now, it is not on the horizon (especially since I have not had an active account for several months now).

For the Horde!
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And for the game.