Quark,Aug 4 2005, 03:37 AM Wrote:Garrote's already weaker than the other openings, and it still doesn't get all it's ticks in most of the time. The talent makes it worse - not better. If I use Garrote anymore, even on a super-armored boss, it's just to laugh. It's just never worth it, especially considering how often it gets kicked off to the debuff limit (yay, that's changing!).
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OK, let's take this statement:
Quote:It's just never worth it
One of the problems with any discussions of this game is that there is a fair amount of jockeying for position that takes place where posters claim their class, skills and playing enjoyment is utterly hopeless in the (realistic) expectation that if enough people complain then they will get a boost
That then permeates through to more serious discussions when intelligent people who should know better repeat spurious arguments which are made for the purpose of influencing developers
Here's the maths for level 60, untalented:
Garotte: 438 damage (can't crit, not reduced by armour), 1 combo point
Ambush: 290 damage + 250% weapon damage (can crit, reduced by armour), 1 combo point
Cheap shot: 4 sec stun, 2 combo points
Now some things are immune to stun so cheap shot is a useless opener on them
So it's a simple question of whether Ambush is ever surpassed by Garotte.
Let's say that the 250% damage component of Ambush is approximately enough to bring it close to the 438 Garotte damage
The maths is very simply does chance to crit outweigh armour reduction? With some bosses that's clearly not going to be so, especially on any Rogue without Improved Ambush. When a boss's armour reaches 50% reduction then 438 unreduced damage will beat 438 halved damage (doubled on crit) whenever it doesn't crit. When a boss's armour surpasses 50% reduction a 438 Garotte always beats a 438 base damage Crit Ambush
There are significant enough advantages with Garotte (low initial aggro, not reduced by armour) that it clearly is worth using sometimes. If you personally never use it, you are playing sub-optimally
As for the Improved Garotte talent it improves damage from 438 to 525.6 damage if the target lasts for 24 seconds or more - something that is reasonably easy to predict
Saying Garotte is never worth using is a disappointing post from you, Quark, your maths is better than that. Sure it may not be worth using if you have pressure for debuff slots or lightly armoured creatures or short fights or talents that boost Ambush but that's situationally, not never. Saying wrong statements just because all the other whiney Rogues on the Rogue forum say them too is beneath you. It makes you sound as if the maths of 438/18 *0.9 * 24 was too difficult for you to work out
There seem to have been too many posts which are rehashes of dumb, over-dramatised attitudes recently: "paladins are noobs because they beat me", "omg I'm gonna quit WoW cos Hunters are getting 2% more life".
This isn't the Blizzard official forums. The etiquette here is still
1. Think
2. Post
isn't it?