U.S. Government shuts down.
#79
(10-08-2013, 03:24 PM)kandrathe Wrote: I mean let's call it what it is, right? Obamacare is primarily a law that targets those who cannot afford insurance, and forces them to go onto State run exchanges where the are forced to buy an insurance product from a private insurance company, or face penalties. It forces companies to provide an approved health care plan, whether they can afford it or not, or face fines. This is only a great idea if you are a) wealthy enough to not care about insurance premiums, b) an insurance company c) a health care facility who had to write off the unpaid health care of the uninsured d) so poor that had you looked into it, you'd have been on Medicaid anyway.

It is not a single payer system. It is not nationalized health care. It targets the symptom of expensive health care, and solves it by trying to eliminate the symptom. We could probably eliminate headaches the same way. If you report a headache, you are fined $50. Worse, the abuses are not rampant yet, but... the system rewards individuals that skip insurance until they need it, then only get it while they need it. It rewards companies to keep employees below half time, and also to not provide health insurance to their employees. Due to these factors, I would predict the costs of health insurance only increasing.

For me personally; My health care will get worse, less convenient, and more expensive because of Obamacare. The organization where I work really takes care of it's employees and used to have "a Cadillac plan", which they paid the bulk of, and I paid about 30%. Threatened with a 40 percent excise tax, we're now only offered a high deductible ($5000 family, $3000 individual) HSA plan resulting in "no insurance" for about half the year until we hit the deductible. It means that I need to save the last half the year for my out of pocket costs for the first half of the year. In a word, it really sucks.

Most of this is pretty true. This is a handout to insurance companies more than it is a social benefit or public good for people, and the best feature it has really (other than that more people will able to get healthcare) is that you can no longer be denied for having pre-existing conditions. Probably, I will benefit from this since I haven't seen a doctor in probably almost 10 years or so. And perhaps my mom whose health has plummeted rapidly and has no insurance will finally get some relief without having to worry so much about out of pocket costs and potential financial ruin. Overall, the bill doesn't go nearly far enough and has more negatives than positives, but I will grudgingly take it for now, since A.) I don't really have much choice in the matter, and B.) Because I probably need to by now.

Indeed, it is not nationalized healthcare. But there is a catch to all this: it was YOUR party, the GOP, who shot down the public option to serve their corporate insurance company masters! Using their standard fear-mongering, anti-socialist jargon to pander to their most extreme reactionary constituents. Now, the bill has been gutted, is no longer sufficient, will likely leave a sour taste in peoples mouths....and more fundamentally, it will now be even more difficult if not impossible to ever get a universal healthcare system in this country. Thanks a lot, republicans. You guys suck. And the Dems suck too, since they have the spinal properties of a jellyfish, and all they do is negotiate to reform policy further to the right towards capital.
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"Your very ideas are but the outgrowth of conditions of your bourgeois production and bourgeois property, just as your jurisprudence is but the will of your class, made into law for all, a will whose essential character and direction are determined by the economic conditions of the existence of your class." - Marx (on capitalist laws and institutions)
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Messages In This Thread
U.S. Government shuts down. - by FireIceTalon - 10-01-2013, 04:23 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by FireIceTalon - 10-01-2013, 04:46 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by Taem - 10-01-2013, 07:54 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by Jester - 10-01-2013, 08:01 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by FireIceTalon - 10-01-2013, 09:31 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by Kevin - 10-01-2013, 08:06 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by Archon_Wing - 10-01-2013, 10:20 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by kandrathe - 10-01-2013, 10:48 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by Archon_Wing - 10-01-2013, 11:03 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by FireIceTalon - 10-01-2013, 11:27 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by Archon_Wing - 10-02-2013, 12:10 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by DeeBye - 10-02-2013, 03:32 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by FireIceTalon - 10-02-2013, 03:48 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by DeeBye - 10-02-2013, 04:58 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by Archon_Wing - 10-02-2013, 05:21 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by eppie - 10-02-2013, 08:58 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by Jester - 10-02-2013, 10:15 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by Lissa - 10-03-2013, 05:31 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by FireIceTalon - 10-01-2013, 10:49 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by FireIceTalon - 10-02-2013, 01:12 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by FireIceTalon - 10-02-2013, 02:19 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by FireIceTalon - 10-02-2013, 05:34 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by Taem - 10-02-2013, 07:36 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by Jester - 10-02-2013, 09:53 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by FireIceTalon - 10-02-2013, 09:25 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by Taem - 10-03-2013, 01:28 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by FireIceTalon - 10-03-2013, 03:54 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by Taem - 10-03-2013, 06:01 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by FireIceTalon - 10-03-2013, 06:55 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by Nystul - 10-03-2013, 07:40 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by Taem - 10-03-2013, 01:38 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by Jester - 10-03-2013, 08:22 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by kandrathe - 10-03-2013, 12:41 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by FireIceTalon - 10-04-2013, 03:46 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by eppie - 10-04-2013, 07:25 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by Jester - 10-04-2013, 11:11 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by eppie - 10-04-2013, 11:22 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by Jester - 10-04-2013, 11:41 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by DeeBye - 10-04-2013, 03:50 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by shoju - 10-04-2013, 04:19 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by eppie - 10-04-2013, 04:36 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by Jester - 10-04-2013, 05:08 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by shoju - 10-04-2013, 05:20 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by eppie - 10-05-2013, 07:39 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by FireIceTalon - 10-05-2013, 05:11 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by FireIceTalon - 10-04-2013, 05:24 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by shoju - 10-04-2013, 05:27 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by FireIceTalon - 10-04-2013, 05:42 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by Jester - 10-04-2013, 06:05 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by FireIceTalon - 10-04-2013, 06:32 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by shoju - 10-04-2013, 07:40 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by Jester - 10-04-2013, 08:06 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by kandrathe - 10-04-2013, 09:11 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by FireIceTalon - 10-04-2013, 08:10 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by DeeBye - 10-05-2013, 03:39 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by kandrathe - 10-05-2013, 05:52 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by DeeBye - 10-05-2013, 06:40 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by kandrathe - 10-06-2013, 01:37 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by eppie - 10-06-2013, 04:35 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by Jester - 10-06-2013, 09:35 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by kandrathe - 10-08-2013, 03:24 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by FireIceTalon - 10-08-2013, 05:07 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by LochnarITB - 10-08-2013, 05:11 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by kandrathe - 10-08-2013, 07:37 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by LochnarITB - 10-08-2013, 10:38 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by Taem - 10-09-2013, 01:33 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by Hammerskjold - 10-09-2013, 02:02 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by Jester - 10-08-2013, 11:51 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by kandrathe - 10-09-2013, 01:22 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by Taem - 10-09-2013, 01:47 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by Jester - 10-09-2013, 06:41 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by eppie - 10-09-2013, 07:12 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by Jester - 10-09-2013, 09:42 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by eppie - 10-09-2013, 11:14 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by Jester - 10-09-2013, 11:43 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by kandrathe - 10-09-2013, 10:58 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by DeeBye - 10-10-2013, 03:28 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by kandrathe - 10-10-2013, 07:56 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by Jester - 10-10-2013, 08:39 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by kandrathe - 10-10-2013, 07:25 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by FireIceTalon - 10-10-2013, 09:29 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by Jester - 10-10-2013, 11:45 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by kandrathe - 10-11-2013, 01:44 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by Jester - 10-11-2013, 02:38 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by kandrathe - 10-11-2013, 04:37 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by Jester - 10-12-2013, 12:22 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by FireIceTalon - 10-12-2013, 01:59 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by Jester - 10-12-2013, 11:32 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by kandrathe - 10-14-2013, 06:04 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by DeeBye - 10-15-2013, 04:54 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by kandrathe - 10-15-2013, 12:57 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by FireIceTalon - 10-17-2013, 03:46 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by Hammerskjold - 10-11-2013, 03:39 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by kandrathe - 10-11-2013, 01:05 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by Jester - 10-05-2013, 10:04 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by FireIceTalon - 10-05-2013, 04:20 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by shoju - 10-06-2013, 01:29 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by FireIceTalon - 10-07-2013, 01:16 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by DeeBye - 10-07-2013, 04:39 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by eppie - 10-07-2013, 12:17 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by LochnarITB - 10-07-2013, 05:24 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by eppie - 10-07-2013, 06:11 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by FireIceTalon - 10-07-2013, 06:36 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by Jester - 10-07-2013, 10:24 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by FireIceTalon - 10-07-2013, 11:16 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by Jester - 10-08-2013, 12:01 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by FireIceTalon - 10-08-2013, 12:31 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by Jester - 10-08-2013, 01:17 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by FireIceTalon - 10-08-2013, 01:47 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by FireIceTalon - 10-09-2013, 02:44 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by FireIceTalon - 10-09-2013, 11:56 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by FireIceTalon - 10-10-2013, 06:05 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by DeeBye - 10-11-2013, 03:05 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by FireIceTalon - 10-11-2013, 03:19 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by DeeBye - 10-11-2013, 05:30 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by Jester - 10-11-2013, 10:13 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by FireIceTalon - 10-11-2013, 01:45 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by Jester - 10-11-2013, 02:52 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by FireIceTalon - 10-11-2013, 05:42 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by kandrathe - 10-11-2013, 06:39 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by FireIceTalon - 10-11-2013, 10:24 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by Jester - 10-12-2013, 12:36 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by DeeBye - 10-12-2013, 03:37 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by shoju - 10-11-2013, 03:13 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by kandrathe - 10-11-2013, 04:26 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by FireIceTalon - 10-12-2013, 06:02 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by Jester - 10-12-2013, 06:24 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by FireIceTalon - 10-12-2013, 07:42 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by Jester - 10-12-2013, 11:00 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by FireIceTalon - 10-14-2013, 05:35 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by FireIceTalon - 10-15-2013, 05:00 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by kandrathe - 10-17-2013, 04:48 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by Jester - 10-17-2013, 10:04 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by kandrathe - 10-18-2013, 12:15 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by Jester - 10-19-2013, 11:44 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by kandrathe - 10-20-2013, 01:23 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by Jester - 10-20-2013, 04:08 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by DeeBye - 10-21-2013, 04:18 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by kandrathe - 10-21-2013, 08:49 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by Jester - 10-21-2013, 10:48 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by kandrathe - 10-23-2013, 07:28 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by Jester - 10-23-2013, 10:30 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by kandrathe - 10-24-2013, 12:13 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by DeeBye - 10-18-2013, 03:43 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by Nystul - 10-19-2013, 09:13 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by Archon_Wing - 10-18-2013, 05:18 PM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by FireIceTalon - 10-19-2013, 05:38 AM
RE: U.S. Government shuts down. - by Jester - 10-27-2013, 11:36 AM

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