Gearing up for release

[FireIceTalon]

Ahem, I dont think it...I know it! No offense, but I literally laughed out loud upon reading your statement that I haven't seen a great skilled rogue in action, that's akin to saying something like Michael Jordan hasn't seen a good basketball player dunk before . I suggest you go to www.youtube.com/fireicetalon - watch a few of the vids, and take some notes before making such preposterous notions. As one of the best and most experienced Rogue players to ever play D1 - someone who has lvled multiple rogues to clvl 50 and found all the best gear in the game, mastered playing the low-ac healing rogue variant in hell/hell, and was one of the players to revolutionize the dynamics of D1 PvP with a Bow Rogue using auto-aim skill (along with Shade, Anti-Hero, Hariel, BadWarrior, and a few other exceptional rogues), I can assure you that I would almost certainly make anyone you played with look like a total amateur in comparison (both in terms of items, game mechanics/actual skill). As would the other players I mentioned above. There is absolutely no trick or skill with a bow rogue that anyone you have played with knows, that I don't. By the time I master D3, I will probably have forgotten more about Rogue gaming on D1 than most people will ever know. Anyways...

Yes, Rogues have the fastest attack rate, and ability to stun do to their massive dexterity, but they also do the smallest dmg overall (both actual dmg, and dps), and they are a rather fragile class - less hp than a warrior, and less mana than a sorc. While they have the highest AC, they are still more prone to get hit compared to a Warrior or Sorc using shield who also have have overall high AC. Warrior and Sorc on the contrary, are POWER HOUSE classes, that are capable of taking more dmg and dealing out more as well, in both PvM and PvP. The rogue is a great class in terms of the skill required to use it as well as its versatility, and it is really my fav class for these reasons to begin with - it is a true gamers class, but in general, they are doing the smallest dmg of the 3 classes, and are more fragile overall. A rogue with perfect gear and playing with high ac in certain PvM situations CAN be over powered, but certainly no more so than a well geared char of the other classes, and in PvP....just no. Bow Rogue is by far the hardest class to master in dueling and even when you DO master it, they are suffering the most from desync issues compared to Warrior or Sorc who are less fragile. Windforce and Needler btw, are two of the worst bows in the game for a high lvl rogue. Massive Bow of Swiftness ftw! But a high lvl Rogue doesn't even need swiftness in PvM, Emerald Heavens is probably an even better choice overall, unless you play low ac healer and need the dps for crowd control.

As far as D2 goes, I cant really comment here as I never got heavily into that game since I thought it was a disappointment in comparison to the original. But almost everyone I talk to says the Amazon was a fragile, low dmg class, and was basically a glass cannon class even more than the D1 Rogue was. Granted I am just taking their word for it, but this is what almost every serious d2 player has said that i have discoursed with. And almost every PvP video ive watched of them, they were getting eaten alive by Barbs, much in the same way that Warrior usually beats Rogue on D1 - though that isnt saying a whole lot since D1 PvP is clearly more balanced in general.

All I have to say is...

BAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Which translates to: FIT has more knowledge and experience of rogue gaming than I do, and I was clearly talking out of my ass - but instead of swallowing my pride and admitting that I was perhaps wrong, ill just give him the good ol' teenage rebellion classic retort: "bahahahahahahaa" . *smooches*

P.S. Unless you actually have something intelligent to say, and put aside the trolling, please don't bother with a reply.

No, the reason I said what I said is because you really don't understand. You give all these reasons and then make the counter arguement for why the Rogue is better or leave it out entirely. A properly played rogue will never get hit, ever. Who cares about fragility when you can kill things off screen? Who cares if you can't one shot kill something if it can never actually hit you? This is why you got the "BAHAHAHA" commment. You say you know much, but your commentary shows you know little.

Now, I may not be the best Rogue that ever lived, but I'm sure a fair number of people on these forums that have played with me back in the day know I know the class. So again, I reiterate,

BAHAHAHAHAHAHA

More like you WISH my commentary showed I know little But who cares about commentary anyway, I have vids as well as tons of gaming partners that will vouch for my abilities and skill - whom are also fine players in their own right.

Define a "properly" played rogue. Because unless you creep lvls inch by inch and take an hour just to clear one section, YOU WILL get hit, just for the fact monsters have a 5% auto-hit to begin with REGARDLESS of how high how your armor class is, not to mention that even with maximum beneficial high ac, you are wrong - it is NOT a guarantee that you will never be hit. I play with almost 300 ac on my Bow Rogue in hell/hell, and even I still get hit occasionally, especially in the presence of Lava Maws or Maelstroms. Most people I know like to play high end chars in hell/hell at a brisk pace, whether soloing or co-op. If I want to play without trying to even get so much as a scratch, I easily could, but why do so, when fast paced action is not only far less time consuming, but also way more fun? I don't play hell/hell like an Ironman, cause I would be bored to tears. And unless you play in such a way, you WILL be hit on occasion. There is no avoiding it unless you game like a snail. But to say I have never seen a high lvl rogue in action before, when I have cleared countless hell/hell's in under 15 mins in blitz co-op action, as well as help to set the standard for bow rogue PvP tactics, is just a foolish statement, to put it lightly. The point is, there isn't a single thing that anyone you know, could teach me about playing a bow rogue, or either of the other classes for that matter. More than likely, it would be the reverse.

I never made any argument that Rogue was the best class, just my personal favorite. There is no best class really because all of them are quite efficient in the right hands, and at high lvls with top notch gear, all 3 are OP. But if we are making comparisons between the classes regarding dps, and the ability to withstand big dmg, the rogue is the lowest of the 3 classes on both accounts. If there is any class that defines the term "over powered" on Diablo 1, it is the Sorcerer - so much to the point that people play this class with cursed items because a high end Sorc with uber gear just destroys everything in his path with ease - minus the 2-3 monster types that are triple immune. Any class you can play naked or with cursed items is OP. Rogue and Warrior on the other hand, are not capable of this as they are much more item dependent with a lower mana economy, especially warriors.

Plus you didn't even address the PvP aspect of D1, where Rogue is by far the hardest class to both learn and play, as evidenced by the fact there have always been a handy supply excellent PvP warriors and sorcs, but a rather low population of competitive PvP bow rogues. Also, in the various international tournaments with high level playing fields, the overall results for bow Rogues has been uneven at best, even for the top ones....warrs and sorcs have typically dominated, which doesn't really come a surprise: bow rogues are fragile and very difficult to play, even if you an exceptional player. It is that simple.