03-25-2009, 01:20 AM
Heiho,
this position becomes fatal at the moment when a relative/friend of yours, or in general terms a member of your society, is captured there for crime. You'll demand justice in your terms, they'll do justice in theirs. What then?
In fact I think societies have to commingle. It is surely a slow and painful process, but it is inevitable.
Establishing the ideas of basic human rights worldwide, so they're as common as the seven days week, is one step. Denying them even in your own country is stasis.
Pete mentioned that the idea of 'rights' is always made up by some men regarding power.
The idea of human rights should have evolved in succession of Enlightenment. Especially because the ancient greeks also had only their oligarchical little village in mind, not the 'Barbarians' far away. And not, for that matter, women, the poor, the mental ill, the slaves. So citing them as source without the latter re-thinking of Enlightenment is citing another archaic society's thinking. And Enlightenment itself is pretty old by now, given the progress made in natural sciences we should indeed all be bleeding heart liberals by now, if human society would have evolved with same velocity.
Quote:I find middle eastern justice barbaric, but then I have little to say about it unless they want to lead the human rights commission at the UN. It matters very little, unless our societies must commingle.
this position becomes fatal at the moment when a relative/friend of yours, or in general terms a member of your society, is captured there for crime. You'll demand justice in your terms, they'll do justice in theirs. What then?
In fact I think societies have to commingle. It is surely a slow and painful process, but it is inevitable.
Establishing the ideas of basic human rights worldwide, so they're as common as the seven days week, is one step. Denying them even in your own country is stasis.
Quote:You've stated you believe you have the right to live. Why? Are you alive by the good graces of your nations leaders? Natural law, and rights are a mechanism of thought brought to us by ancient Greek philosophy (Socrates, Aristotle). Natural law and natural rights follow from the nature of man and the world. We have the right to defend ourselves and our property, because of the kind of animals we are. The true basis of law is derived from this right, not from the arbitrary power of the omnipotent state.
Pete mentioned that the idea of 'rights' is always made up by some men regarding power.
The idea of human rights should have evolved in succession of Enlightenment. Especially because the ancient greeks also had only their oligarchical little village in mind, not the 'Barbarians' far away. And not, for that matter, women, the poor, the mental ill, the slaves. So citing them as source without the latter re-thinking of Enlightenment is citing another archaic society's thinking. And Enlightenment itself is pretty old by now, given the progress made in natural sciences we should indeed all be bleeding heart liberals by now, if human society would have evolved with same velocity.