01-15-2009, 04:42 AM
(This post was last modified: 01-15-2009, 05:03 AM by Hammerskjold.)
Why are you using D1 as an example for D2's situation and structure? This is the shaky analogy thing again IMO. So to the casual observer of D1 public games, there seems to be a lot of cheaters. For people who knows people who don't cheat in D1, they know not everyone cheats, BUT, they have to know those people already.
Therefore, to them, the perception is inflated. Therefore, -D2'-s perception of amount of cheating is inflated. But they might not be, because you then go on saying in D2 cheaters are more open about it.
I'm going to say you might need a coffee break on this one. If you're just going to do a game of 'is so- is not', I'm too old and tired for that. I've seen you display a solid grasp of logic before, but I can't say I see it in that example you gave.
As to your specific D2's example, it seems to me you're basically agreeing to the basic points that has already been brought up by others and myself. So...yeah? D2 online has more cheaters in public realm, and their voices are louder. And you still maintain that perception is inflated by citing the examples of, D1? We're talking about D2 yes?
Now if it's a case of arguing if the sky is blue today, I say it's maybe 90% blue and you claim no it's not blue at all! It's actually 89%-89.999% Cyan. Again, excuse me, but my laundry is piling up.
And? We're talking about bliz here, not other companies. Bliz may look at other models of success, their own and others. Judging by their reputation of highly polishing a concept until it shines they most likely do. But I'd safely bet they do that at the creation stage, not after the product has reached the completion stage.
Bluntness time again, D2 has probably reached that stage of 'done', product wise. The fork was stuck in ver. 1.10, and it will be final and official when or if D3 hits the shelves.
You're still mostly in the gamer's perspective, throwing around 'cheaters running rampant'. While it does come into play in a business sense, in that if the reputation is so bad and trumpets "all online cheaters welcome!", sales and customer relations will suffer.*
Sales and customer relations could also suffer if the punishment gets in the way of the game, too uneven, or deemed too severe. You might say well chaps, let's take it on the chin like a man and suffer for the greater good if you're a true legit player etc etc. I say bawl-locks, your priorities or mine are not necessarily shared by bliz. For practical and cost reasons in a business context, too many false positives and too agressive methods can just as easily backfire. For those reason I can see bliz deciding they can't afford to have an overly aggresive policy.
To your standard bliz might be too lax. As a gamer, I'd mostly agree. From a business POV, they probably looked at who is the majority of their customer base, looked at their options and -finite- resources, and for both practical and cost reasons I wouldn't be surprised if their current policy is deemed 'working as intended'.
*(During D2's impending release, IIRC one of the big concern was whether or not bliz learned the lessons of D1 online cheating. Wanna bet if the same question pops re: D3 compared to D2? If it hasn't already? Wanna bet that bliz probably did learn, with some lessons from WoW too, but there probably will be new problems that D2\D1 didn't see? All this has happened before, and will again.)
And that, is probably the best line that came out of our jawing so far. That's probably the only meaningful vote you or I have as a consumer. If we're talking strictly business.
Of course it's possible that many people's mindset may change and decide that no, seeking and using a questionable advantage in an online near anonymous environment, even if there's nothing that substantial at stake, well that's just not very sporting or fair no sir! "Holy crap, if I don't cheat in D2 online, hell I just have to pay for a CD key once. So not only do I learn more about the game, it might make economic sense for me not to cheat in b.net!"
When that day come, well let's just say the whole world might be better and not just B.net. I'm not exactly holding my breath on that one though. Cause again, laundry, piling up. (I'd love to be proven wrong with that whole mindset change though. If that happens, we might really advance as a species and I can have my flying car and meal in a pill.)
Feel free to reply, I'll certainly read it. But this is my stop at this train ride before it becomes a merry go round.
Therefore, to them, the perception is inflated. Therefore, -D2'-s perception of amount of cheating is inflated. But they might not be, because you then go on saying in D2 cheaters are more open about it.
I'm going to say you might need a coffee break on this one. If you're just going to do a game of 'is so- is not', I'm too old and tired for that. I've seen you display a solid grasp of logic before, but I can't say I see it in that example you gave.
As to your specific D2's example, it seems to me you're basically agreeing to the basic points that has already been brought up by others and myself. So...yeah? D2 online has more cheaters in public realm, and their voices are louder. And you still maintain that perception is inflated by citing the examples of, D1? We're talking about D2 yes?
Now if it's a case of arguing if the sky is blue today, I say it's maybe 90% blue and you claim no it's not blue at all! It's actually 89%-89.999% Cyan. Again, excuse me, but my laundry is piling up.
Quote: My major point of contention was that other companies are using other models successfully.
And? We're talking about bliz here, not other companies. Bliz may look at other models of success, their own and others. Judging by their reputation of highly polishing a concept until it shines they most likely do. But I'd safely bet they do that at the creation stage, not after the product has reached the completion stage.
Bluntness time again, D2 has probably reached that stage of 'done', product wise. The fork was stuck in ver. 1.10, and it will be final and official when or if D3 hits the shelves.
Quote:I'm sure Blizzard has researched the subject on levels deeper than I can fathom without a marketing background, but letting cheaters run rampant is not the only successful way to run a business.
You're still mostly in the gamer's perspective, throwing around 'cheaters running rampant'. While it does come into play in a business sense, in that if the reputation is so bad and trumpets "all online cheaters welcome!", sales and customer relations will suffer.*
Sales and customer relations could also suffer if the punishment gets in the way of the game, too uneven, or deemed too severe. You might say well chaps, let's take it on the chin like a man and suffer for the greater good if you're a true legit player etc etc. I say bawl-locks, your priorities or mine are not necessarily shared by bliz. For practical and cost reasons in a business context, too many false positives and too agressive methods can just as easily backfire. For those reason I can see bliz deciding they can't afford to have an overly aggresive policy.
To your standard bliz might be too lax. As a gamer, I'd mostly agree. From a business POV, they probably looked at who is the majority of their customer base, looked at their options and -finite- resources, and for both practical and cost reasons I wouldn't be surprised if their current policy is deemed 'working as intended'.
*(During D2's impending release, IIRC one of the big concern was whether or not bliz learned the lessons of D1 online cheating. Wanna bet if the same question pops re: D3 compared to D2? If it hasn't already? Wanna bet that bliz probably did learn, with some lessons from WoW too, but there probably will be new problems that D2\D1 didn't see? All this has happened before, and will again.)
Quote:...that will get my future business.
And that, is probably the best line that came out of our jawing so far. That's probably the only meaningful vote you or I have as a consumer. If we're talking strictly business.
Of course it's possible that many people's mindset may change and decide that no, seeking and using a questionable advantage in an online near anonymous environment, even if there's nothing that substantial at stake, well that's just not very sporting or fair no sir! "Holy crap, if I don't cheat in D2 online, hell I just have to pay for a CD key once. So not only do I learn more about the game, it might make economic sense for me not to cheat in b.net!"
When that day come, well let's just say the whole world might be better and not just B.net. I'm not exactly holding my breath on that one though. Cause again, laundry, piling up. (I'd love to be proven wrong with that whole mindset change though. If that happens, we might really advance as a species and I can have my flying car and meal in a pill.)
Feel free to reply, I'll certainly read it. But this is my stop at this train ride before it becomes a merry go round.