Alas, Auberdine

[Concillian]

Oh, my God. The guild level bonuses must be amazing, because I keep getting spammed non-stop from people inviting me to play in their guild, even though they have no idea who I am. As far as they know, I could be a noob 10-year old playing for the first time.

They don't get too much experience from questing lowbies, but there is a guild perk that whenever you pickup gold it generates an additional 5% and dumps that in the guild bank. A later perk ups that to 10%. They could be after that.

Also if you run a 5-man with at least 3 guild members, the guild bank gets 250 gold on completion (for a maximum of 7 runs per week).

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10 person raids at normal difficulty are challenging enough to engage the general playerbase. People who were doing Naxx-40 will likely not have too much issues with the relatively low gear checks and coordination required in normal mode and will complete normal and move on to the heroic versions within a few weeks of a new instance being released. These are more in line with the AQ40 to Sunwell raids back in the day.

Rosters are a big challenge in 10 man raiding at high progression levels. Getting the raid buffs requires diversity, but certain mechanics favor certain classes or specs for fights. Also, some fights are best done 2T / 3H and others 1T / 2H... this leads to needing more than 10 people and doing some swapping of people around for different fights.

25 mans are often less extreme in this regard, but of course you still see some class stacking in people pushing for first kills in the top 100. In general, it's a lot better than the pretty retarded amount of class stacking that was happening in TBC, though.

[shoju]

Yeah, there has only been a few massive class stacking, with it culminating on the H:Nefarian Kill in Blackwing Descent. I want to say there was 12-14 druids in a 25m raid?

[MongoJerry]

Well, Neriad finished Thousand Needles, and that was a lot of fun. I loved everything they did with the zone. I have a feeling that I'm supposed to know who the crone was that Neriad unwittingly helped, but since I don't know enough WoW lore, I didn't. I assume that she shows up in a later raid dungeon or something, though. I really really wanted to keep the 12 flying pridelings. They were so cute!

Afterward, Neriad went on a bunch of dungeon runs, which significantly improved her gear. Her experience was similar to the first set of runs -- a few bad experiences (including one where a druid tried to "tank" in cat form) followed by some amazingly wonderful experiences. One pug group flowed so well in the Sunken Temple that we decided to queue together into another random dungeon, got Blackrock Depths, and decided to do the entire BRD from start to finish. That was great.

Neriad also almost has enough love tokens to buy the Love Bird mount -- just in time for when she qualifies to get a flying mount. Oh, well. I'm sure it'll be fun while it lasts.

[Shamago]

Well, Neriad finished Thousand Needles, and that was a lot of fun. I loved everything they did with the zone. I have a feeling that I'm supposed to know who the crone was that Neriad unwittingly helped, but since I don't know enough WoW lore, I didn't. I assume that she shows up in a later raid dungeon or something, though. I really really wanted to keep the 12 flying pridelings. They were so cute!

Magatha? It's a horde thing. If you've ever quested horde side before you'd probably notice that the only tauren hostile to the horde are all from the Grimtotem clan... and the name might be familiar from Dustwallow Marsh. The Grimtotem clan of the tauren are a similar concept to the dark iron dwarves, and Magatha is their leader. Magatha used to be a questgiver in TB... I believe she's the one who poisoned Garrosh's weapon in his duel with Cairne, the former leader of Thunder Bluff.

[Ruvanal]

I really really wanted to keep the 12 flying pridelings. They were so cute!

http://us.blizzard.com/store/details.xml?id=1100000863
A bullet point on the page is "Ridiculously cute!"

Also for alliance minded players is this:
http://us.blizzard.com/store/details.xml?id=1100000862

[MongoJerry]

http://us.blizzard.com/store/details.xml?id=1100000863
A bullet point on the page is "Ridiculously cute!"

Also for alliance minded players is this:
http://us.blizzard.com/store/details.xml?id=1100000862

I see Blizzard's tactic here. The first sample of flying pridelings is free, but then you have to pay for the real thing. Very shrewd.

After a number of runs in random dungeons, Neriad got herself buffed out in almost all blues again. By that time she was level 53, so I decided to take her to the Swamp of Sorrows, which I enjoyed. Most of the quests were pretty straightforward, but it was nice to see the changes they made to the zone. I was a bit surprised at the end with the questline into the non-instanced part of the Sunken Temple. I liked it a lot.

Then it was off to the Blasted Lands. I guess after being told that it had been one of the most made over zoned, I actually felt a bit disappointed by the changes. The quest lines were pretty straight forward "kill X / gather Y" variety. However, the murloc quests were a surprise, and the quest to rescue the baby murlocs was cute to say the least. I think a baby murloc pet should have been a reward for that quest (he loves you so much that he decides to stay!). However, I'm not sure how I feel about helping murlocs escape to potentially restart their people, because I *hate* murlocs. Finally, Neriad went down to the Worgen town in the forest in the southwest part of the zone. The area was pretty, and the story idea was great, but unfortunately the quests were all again of the straight-forward "kill X / gather Y" variety.

Neriad then went on some more dungeon runs -- this time in BC dungeons -- to buff up her equipment. BC equipment is just so sick compared to classic WoW equipment (and I'm sure later zones will made BC equipment pale in comparison). I just figured I'd skip a step and jump right to BC blues. However, I might jump through the portal at some point and do quests for reputation some point soon.

In the meantime, I want to give a big thank-you to those who sent Neriad ink to power up her inscription. That was very helpful!

[LavCat]

My scribe has lots of ink taking up bag space. Are you on Stormrage?

[Bolty]

Yeah, there has only been a few massive class stacking, with it culminating on the H:Nefarian Kill in Blackwing Descent. I want to say there was 12-14 druids in a 25m raid?

To be fair, this was due to a heroic-mode fight mechanic that Druids were able to get around. The fight mechanic was changed not long after that first kill, closing that loophole.

World-first guilds are always using such methods to get their kills. It's not wrong that they do it - Blizzard presents them with fight mechanics as-is, and they find a way to beat those mechanics before anyone else does. The hardest encounter in Dragon Soul is Spine of Deathwing, and the world first guilds stacked Rogues and Mages to beat the insane DPS requirements set forth by Blizzard to kill off the tendons in time.

Unfortunately, class stacking is a reality of the game at the super high end. It also doesn't really affect 99.999% of the player base, however.

[MongoJerry]

I'm sure the class stacking you're describing was more pronounced than what I saw. However, just to let you know what The Core did: We had a few very dedicated players who had approved alts. In the newly released raid dungeons (e.g. Naxxramus), most people would play their mains and most of the equipment would go to mains. However, we would still run the older raid dungeons to equip people who didn't quite have all their equipment yet plus give those with approved alts a chance to equip those out. (The people with alts would also often play them in the 20-man raid dungeons). Then, if there was a boss encounter in the new raid dungeon needing some extra class stacking -- or maybe the composition of the raid that night wasn't quite right -- then the guild have a pool of alts they could switch to. This was a way of being able to "class stack" without making the guild bigger and have people sitting outside just for an encounter or two.

I realized that I forgot to mention something else that I really like about the new WoW, which is coming into play a lot more with the better BC equipment: critical strike and haste actually matter for priests. I like how even dot's are affected by them. It sure gives a priest a lot more equipment options than before.

Neriad ran dungeons up to level 65 and built up her reputation with Honor Hold, Cenarian Circle, and Sporegarr (she kept getting put in the Underbog dungeon). I decided on a lark to then start her questing in the Hellfire Penninsula to see how high she could build her reputation with Honor Hold. At first, it was kind of fun. The quests hadn't changed (at least they seemed very similar to the ones I remember on the Horde side), but some of the early quests involving the war against the demons were fun. The quest involving throwing bombs off a gryphon was a nice change of pace.

However, after a while, I started remembering why I *hated* the outdoor part of the Burning Crusade. It seemed like every zone was just one more reputation grind. And, in particular, the Hellfire Penninsula, whose theme started off so well, had its story splinter in so many directions that nothing got developed. There's the fight against the demons, there's the fight against the native orcs, there's the fight with the Horde, but we're also supposed to save the Horde from destruction. There're the two random goblins who need help. There's the armory where everybody got turned into ghosts. There's the Cenarian Circle stuff out west. There're the slimes. There's the egg gathering. Etc, etc. Too much stuff that's unrelated to one another and almost all of it follows the "kill X monsters / gather Y items / kill the boss" formula. The more I played, the more I remembered, and when I flew around to the other zones after giving up on the Hellfire Penninsula, I said "forget this!"

So, I did the one thing I did enjoy in Burning Crusade -- ran dungeons. The Mana Tombs and the Caverns of Time dungeons were especially fun for me. So Neriad is now 68 based mostly on running dungeons, and she just appeared in Northrend. However, she'll probably run a few more dungeons before she starts questing there in earnest.

[Sir_Die_alot]

I'm not sure what you found fault in outlands lore, besides draeni and their butchered lore. Random goblins come to exploit a new land? Pretty logical. And the storyline with the fel orcs, mag'ar, ect. progressed through the other zones it didn't just stop in HFP. Some of them even moved into the dungeons and raids and incorporated into attunements.

The sort of general truce called during BC did make world pvp kind of confusing storywise so I'll give you that. Even in wrath where they did a better job of trying to make the 2 factions at war with the LK and each other was kind of fuzzy. Besides the molten front, this expansion has been better about that. Especially in vashj'ir and TH which have openly competing quest lines.

[Bolty]

I suppose with Neriad reaching 68, I should bring this up because you'll be 80 in no time.

When you hit level 80, you have two options for your Cataclysm starting zone: Vashj'ir and Mount Hyjal. I'd highly recommend going to Vashj'ir for the starting zone on your first playthrough. Do Mount Hyjal later - either after you've dinged 85, or when you're 82 after Vashj'ir and just want to see the content.

Vashj'ir is a highly unique zone unlike any other in the game. I'll just stop there and say that it's an interesting experience, even if it's one you may eventually decide you'd rather not repeat on other characters.

Cataclysm has five zones:
Levels 80-82: Vashj'ir and Mount Hyjal
Levels 82-83: Deepholm
Levels 83-84: Uldum
Levels 84-85: Twilight Highlands

Each of these zones are accessed via the Heroes' Call Board in major cities, although they truly start in Stormwind.

Have fun in Northrend! My favorite zone there is the Grizzly Hills - don't forget to turn music on.

[shoju]

And while Bolty would recommend Vash'jir, I would tell you that unless you are a tank planning to tank something important before Mists drops, to run away from it. Never do it. It is the one zone in the game that I hate more than any other.

While the story is... interesting, the zone is huge, poorly laid out, frustrating, annoying, and goes on forever. I don't know, maybe it doesn't suck as bad for alliance. But man... I did that zone once, and since then, I've only done enough to be able to get 'prepped' to get to the Earthen Ring Quartermaster.

In Northrend, I loved Borean Tundra, Zul'drak, and Icecrown. great quests, Great Lore, and there are some parts of icecrown, that even at 80 could get you killed.

[vor_lord]

And while Bolty would recommend Vash'jir, I would tell you that unless you are a tank planning to tank something important before Mists drops, to run away from it. Never do it. It is the one zone in the game that I hate more than any other.

How much of this is because you ran it with a melee toon? MJ is playing a priest after all, and the unique nature of the zone won't be as irritating.

Vash'jir was my favorite zone of the game. When I took my second toon through, I went to Hyjal instead. It was very boring in comparison, and offered nothing new to the single player experience from what Wrath offered.

[shoju]

That's true, and something I didn't think about. That place is probably far better as a Ranged Class. As Melee, the "effect" of the zone was just... BLECH. Not enjoyable for me at all.

[Klaus]

And while Bolty would recommend Vash'jir, I would tell you that unless you are a tank planning to tank something important before Mists drops, to run away from it. Never do it. It is the one zone in the game that I hate more than any other.

How much of this is because you ran it with a melee toon? MJ is playing a priest after all, and the unique nature of the zone won't be as irritating.

Vash'jir was my favorite zone of the game. When I took my second toon through, I went to Hyjal instead. It was very boring in comparison, and offered nothing new to the single player experience from what Wrath offered.

I found Vash'jir to be annoying because:

- I couldn't find anything (there was always a seaweed frond in my face or I was trying to navigate over and under and around stuff)
- The travel was annoying. You get used to a +280 or +310 flying mount in other zones, then you're stuck with a +100 mount in Vash'jir
- Like Shoju, I found it to be disjoint and scattered all over.

So, it was unique and apparently appeals to some people, but I didn't care for it (even as ranged) and I skipped it entirely on my 2nd toon. I'll end up doing the start of it on my tank just to gain access to the ER vendor.

[LavCat]

That's true, and something I didn't think about. That place is probably far better as a Ranged Class. As Melee, the "effect" of the zone was just... BLECH. Not enjoyable for me at all.

Turtles All the Way down.


Edit: Actually I enjoyed it most as a rogue.

[shoju]

Actually, You don't need to on an alt tank, as the head enchants are BoA.

The Shoulder Enchants.... Well.... Those you still have to grind fro.

[Sir_Die_alot]

I was trying to stay away from recommending zones because I probably couldn't help but give spoilers. That said, I love vashj'ir as well. It is a little large at times but that is my biggest complaint. Well that and they never did that raid instance or continued the neptulon storyline after what happened in the dungeon.

[Ruvanal]

- The travel was annoying. You get used to a +280 or +310 flying mount in other zones, then you're stuck with a +100 mount in Vash'jir

Its a +280 speed mount, check your facts. Vash'jir is a very big area composed of several sub-zones. Most of those sub-zones are as large as any of the zones you would now find on land in Kalimdor or the Eastern Kingdoms, which would make for some long travel times to get around from point to point.

I had no issues with doing that Vash'jir on my warrior when I did the first time. Not so sure I would enjoy it so well on some of the other 'non-ranged' classes like rogues or enhanced shaman though. Ranged classes should fair well. The issue for most is going to be how well they can adapt to being in an almost constant 3D operating environment. Most players have a lot issues when asked to move out a 2D (feet on the ground) situation.

Edit: a quick check of speed in game using the character info panel shows the mount swim speed as 371 (or a boost of +271 over standard run speed).

[Klaus]

- The travel was annoying. You get used to a +280 or +310 flying mount in other zones, then you're stuck with a +100 mount in Vash'jir

Its a +280 speed mount, check your facts. Vash'jir is a very big area composed of several sub-zones. Most of those sub-zones are as large as any of the zones you would now find on land in Kalimdor or the Eastern Kingdoms, which would make for some long travel times to get around from point to point.

I had no issues with doing that Vash'jir on my warrior when I did the first time. Not so sure I would enjoy it so well on some of the other 'non-ranged' classes like rogues or enhanced shaman though. Ranged classes should fair well. The issue for most is going to be how well they can adapt to being in an almost constant 3D operating environment. Most players have a lot issues when asked to move out a 2D (feet on the ground) situation.

Edit: a quick check of speed in game using the character info panel shows the mount swim speed as 371 (or a boost of +271 over standard run speed).

Hmm. It sure felt slow. The 371 number is strange. A +280 will show as 380 speed on the character sheet, plus the guild bonus. If the Vash'jir mount is showing as less than 380, then it's not a +280 mount. I'll grant that it's faster than the +100 I recall.