About those Level 70 AV items

[Monkey]

...but your current reputation won't get you there. Quotes from Tseric on the /general forums:

...The reputation rewards are being rolled over into the new Honor system. So, if you are just short of exalted at the switch, you will have to 'start all over' so to speak.

Again, reputation points do not translate into new Honor points. Your reputation ranking will have almost no bearing at that point.

and this 'quick and dirty' summation of all PvP changes:

All reputation and honor rewards will be moved to one market with which Honor Points are the new currency.

Honor points are gained through the same activities as before. Difference is, they will accrue like XP in a way, so players can stock up on honor points without having to deal with decay of these points.

Arena points are gained from being in a chartered Arena group (like a guild charter) and competing in matches to achieve Arena ranks.

Arena ranking works in an ELO-type system, similar to chess. It puts the focus on winning select matches, not on continually grinding out matches.

An arena season will last about 3 months, after which, top-ranked players will gain titles reflecting their previous seasons ranking.

The best Arena rewards will be on par with top-tier raiding gear, but have stats designed more for PvP than PvE.

In summation, the approach to BG rewards is time-based in that you can devote short or long periods of time to achieving rewards. Arena rewards are competitive-based. While an arena team won't have to be logged in for extended periods, they will likely have to win every match of the 10 required to see a spotless ranking.

From
http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.h...ageNo=1&sid=1#5
(scroll down to post #15) and
http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.h...geNo=1&sid=1#10
respectively.

[Urza-DSF]

...but your current reputation won't get you there. Quotes from Tseric on the /general forums:
and this 'quick and dirty' summation of all PvP changes:
From
http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.h...ageNo=1&sid=1#5
(scroll down to post #15) and
http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.h...geNo=1&sid=1#10
respectively.

Well hot damn, it looks like they just may have made PvP a viable option for us casuals. Will definatly have to see how this pans out in the expansion.

[lemekim]

That post is not entirely correct. At least not of this moment. Outdoor PvP will have it's own rewards, and it's own set of tokens that you will need to acquire to purchase that gear. Some tokens are shared between various outdoor PvP battlegrounds, some are unique to the particular location. However, most of that gear is not level 70, so that is probably one reason for this. However, it seems no matter what, there is a complete switch to the Token system in the TBC. We will see how it plays out.

[VoiceMan]

Ok, in one sentence they say that Rep will "roll over", and next they say you'll need to "start over". I can't seem to access the forum now on it, to check for context, (something about maintenance) so I'm still wondering what that means. I have a rogue who is maxed on rep from WSG, and is partway through honored with AB. The goal I have had for her is to max out on rep in each of the 3 BG's as a way to gear her up, as I don't anticipate raiding with her much, as she's not my main. She's only level 37 right now, and I would hate to have to start all over with the WSG rep and AB rep just to buy the leather and weapon items you can currently purchase if your faction reputation is high enough. Since I can't get the forums themselves, can someone shed some light on that?

[Concillian]

As I understand rep isn't going away, but it will serve no benefit.

The items you can purchase now will still be available, but not in the current manner. They will be "purchased" through turning in mark of honor tokens from the battleground, as I understand it. And each piece will have a seperate "cost"

So while now, to get any of the epic pieces, you need to grind all the way to exalted. If all you want is the epic piece, the expansion will allow you to participate just enough to buy just that one piece, skipping all the other pieces.

It is a system that allows a bit more flexibility, but does end up screwing some people.

[VoiceMan]

So now once she caps, I'll have to play more WSG matches to get enough tokens to buy the gear I want for her, even though she currently is maxed on rep? Rats..I had maxed her on WSG rep at 29 so she could just go and buy gear as she levelled up, and not have to do more matches. Bleh...I must admit I don't like that. It's got me thinking there's no real point in doing any more PvP with her til she hits 70 and is ready for the purply gear, and then just go and do what is needed to get the pieces I want. Otherwise, I'll have to continue to PvP with her as she levels if I want to get the lower levelled versions of said gear, regardless of her rep. I had wanted to get both AB and WSG leather items for her, which now will take much much longer to obtain as the WSG rep will be useless. That doesn't make me happy. :(

[Concillian]

Also, I understand there won't be much in terms of level 70 purple gear coming from anywhere but the arena. BG will mostly be a source of blue gear with a few select purples. There has been some evidence for this, but not any definite info that I've seen.

[Monkey]

Also, I understand there won't be much in terms of level 70 purple gear coming from anywhere but the arena. BG will mostly be a source of blue gear with a few select purples. There has been some evidence for this, but not any definite info that I've seen.

Here's the lastest I have. Currently on the beta servers, players can access the following rewards:
http://bcspy.bc.funpic.de/images/screensho...arsonggulch.jpg
http://bcspy.bc.funpic.de/images/screensho...arathibasin.jpg
http://bcspy.bc.funpic.de/images/screensho...teracvalley.jpg

They appear to be the same items currently available on the live servers with different prices, no reputation required, and no level 70 versions yet. The 'Honor Points' are said to be accruing at close to 1/10 the rate seen on live servers. So an item that takes 8500 honor points and 30 tokens is comparable to earning 85,000 honor and winning 10 games (or losing 30).

[Concillian]

Here's the lastest I have. Currently on the beta servers, players can access the following rewards:
http://bcspy.bc.funpic.de/images/screensho...arsonggulch.jpg
http://bcspy.bc.funpic.de/images/screensho...arathibasin.jpg
http://bcspy.bc.funpic.de/images/screensho...teracvalley.jpg

They appear to be the same items currently available on the live servers with different prices, no reputation required, and no level 70 versions yet. The 'Honor Points' are said to be accruing at close to 1/10 the rate seen on live servers. So an item that takes 8500 honor points and 30 tokens is comparable to earning 85,000 honor and winning 10 games (or losing 30).

That actually seems pretty reasonable compared to what you have to do now.

Just comparing AB, my rogue did about 130k honor and at least 30-40 tokens so far this week, exclusively in AB. This would seem enough to get one of the L60 epic items in TBC, but right now all it got me was a few thousand reputation closer to revered.

Interesting. Seems a lot easier to just do some work for a couple items you're after and be done with it.

[Professor Frink]

Here's the lastest I have. Currently on the beta servers, players can access the following rewards:
http://bcspy.bc.funpic.de/images/screensho...arsonggulch.jpg
http://bcspy.bc.funpic.de/images/screensho...arathibasin.jpg
http://bcspy.bc.funpic.de/images/screensho...teracvalley.jpg

They appear to be the same items currently available on the live servers with different prices, no reputation required, and no level 70 versions yet. The 'Honor Points' are said to be accruing at close to 1/10 the rate seen on live servers. So an item that takes 8500 honor points and 30 tokens is comparable to earning 85,000 honor and winning 10 games (or losing 30).

Got any item-tooltips on those items? For example, is that the same level 60 Lobobomizer or a new and improved one?

[Monkey]

Got any item-tooltips on those items? For example, is that the same level 60 Lobobomizer or a new and improved one?

The post I ninja'd those pictures from at bcspy says:

We checked a few minutes ago the vendors standing in front of Warsong Gluch, Arathi Basin and Alterac Valley. First of all there are no signs of level 70 items. They're still selling the same max level 60 stuff. The only change (besides the ratings) is that many items now cost honor points and marks. Check our screenshots for exact numbers.

[Artega]

That doesn't make me happy. :(

Sure makes Blizzard's accountants happy, though. Think of all the time (e.g. monthly fees/gamecards) people will go through in order to accrue the points and tokens for the gear they want to buy!

Looks like Rob Pardo will finally be able to afford that sixth Ferrari he always wanted.

Sarcasm aside, I actually do like the new system; I just don't like the fact that they're shafting a lot of people with a flaming 2x4 wrapped in barbed wire in order to use that new system.

[oldmandennis]

Could you just buy all the items now? I'm pretty sure I bought my AV items before 60 and popped them on the minute I capped on my hunter (Don Julio, how I love you). Of course, since the items don't upgrade, it might be different in AB/WSG.

If not, then it sucks for you. Probably not a whole lot of people are in your boat - paused in leveling to work BG's to revered to make their leveling easier? The loss of rest XP makes it a pretty non optimal strategy.

[Watto44]

Could you just buy all the items now? I'm pretty sure I bought my AV items before 60 and popped them on the minute I capped on my hunter (Don Julio, how I love you). Of course, since the items don't upgrade, it might be different in AB/WSG.

If not, then it sucks for you. Probably not a whole lot of people are in your boat - paused in leveling to work BG's to revered to make their leveling easier? The loss of rest XP makes it a pretty non optimal strategy.

It's unfortunate that you can't purchase the BG reputation rewards when you've met the rep. requirement but before you meet the level requirement. That would probably placate the twinks, although I'm sure there are negative consequences there that I'm not seeing.

I'm actually in a similar boat with my mage. I've ended up leveling out of the 49 bracet earlier than I really wanted to in order to get myself positioned better as the patch approaches. I fully expect to get burnt on my AV rep. and probably my AB rep as well. (I won't be particularly heartbroken over the AV rep., but AB will be a bitter pill to swallow. 12000/21000 currently, and it will hurt to loose that progress.)

The main thing that Blizzard needs to do is give people plenty of warning before they patch the new system in. As long as I have a couple of weeks notice, I should be able to avoid getting burnt too badly. :)

On the plus side, I don't have to "earn" weapons that I'll never use to get my shiny warsong bracers! Or any other PvP item for that matter. I feel like a kid in a candy store. :w00t:

[Monkey]

It's unfortunate that you can't purchase the BG reputation rewards when you've met the rep. requirement but before you meet the level requirement. That would probably placate the twinks, although I'm sure there are negative consequences there that I'm not seeing.

I'm actually in a similar boat with my mage. I've ended up leveling out of the 49 bracet earlier than I really wanted to in order to get myself positioned better as the patch approaches. I fully expect to get burnt on my AV rep. and probably my AB rep as well. (I won't be particularly heartbroken over the AV rep., but AB will be a bitter pill to swallow. 12000/21000 currently, and it will hurt to loose that progress.)

Well, you can purchase the AB items before you've met the requirement. But given the slow speed of AB rep accrual, you'll probably get to use them faster if you purchase them under the new system. I guess they might just remove the rep requirement from all of the items, giving you a free upgrade without the rep. Only the PTR will tell!

I was disappointed I wouldn't get an automatic pass to new phat loots based on rep, but the change is really good. The new system is flat-out more sustainable and gives them the option to periodically add new items to battleground and honor vendors, which is a somewhat exciting possibility. It also levels the playing field in PvP a bit by making nice weapons and gear (truly) available to anyone.

[Watto44]

Well, you can purchase the AB items before you've met the requirement. But given the slow speed of AB rep accrual, you'll probably get to use them faster if you purchase them under the new system. I guess they might just remove the rep requirement from all of the items, giving you a free upgrade without the rep. Only the PTR will tell!

I was disappointed I wouldn't get an automatic pass to new phat loots based on rep, but the change is really good. The new system is flat-out more sustainable and gives them the option to periodically add new items to battleground and honor vendors, which is a somewhat exciting possibility. It also levels the playing field in PvP a bit by making nice weapons and gear (truly) available to anyone.

I R teh n00b. :( I would have sworn on a stack of bibles that I had already tried to purchase reputation rewards that I didn't meet the level requirement for and failed. Obviously I didn't, because I just went and bought all the phat lewts that I could get my grubbly little hands on. Now I'm just kicking myself that I leveled out. :angry: (Thanks for the tip Monkey. :blush: )

Please ignore my previous post.:)

Back on topic. I'm not really disappointed that I'll miss out on any new reputation items that blizzard introduces. To my mind that's a little like expecting free Naxx gear because you cleared MC already. Which, as you pointed out, is the real benefit of the new system. It allows for some vague form of PvP progression, unlike the current system which is really a one shot deal that offers no incentive to keep playing once you're done.

[Monkey]

Back on topic. I'm not really disappointed that I'll miss out on any new reputation items that blizzard introduces. To my mind that's a little like expecting free Naxx gear because you cleared MC already. Which, as you pointed out, is the real benefit of the new system. It allows for some vague form of PvP progression, unlike the current system which is really a one shot deal that offers no incentive to keep playing once you're done.

Let me clarify: I was disappointed in the, "ZOMG I WNAT TEH CANDY" sense. The ability to have actual progression and scaling from PvP rewards is a much better design decision and I recognize (and am pleased by) the long-term strategic value of that choice.

Doesn't change the fact that I like candy, though. ;)

[Monkey]

More information out of the beta about PvP rewards in the pre-TBC patch (which is, as yet, unnamed). Eyonix has said that the patch will be out in time for the holidays. As far as I know, the post linked below is packaging beta screenshots with Blizzard posts about the patch and a dash of speculation. In other words, this dish may require salting.

Anyway, linky:

http://www.worldofraids.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1076

Particularly of note (to me), my speculation regarding GM weapons is bourne out:

"...the 2 Handers cost 20,000 Honour Points and 40 AV Marks. The 1 Handers cost 10,000 Honour Points and 20 AB Marks. "

Even though this will be released just before TBC, somehow the opportunity to have a real chance to earn GM weapons and other gear has me excited to PvP with all my characters again. Previously, I had to let all but one languish if I wanted to advance in PvP. Good show, Blizzard.

[oldmandennis]

It's an interesting choice. It more or less closes the gap for leveling gear between good raiders and players who put in a mediumish amount of time - weather or not those players are skilled.

/scurries off to compare Warlord/High warlord items to raid epics

[Kevin]

It's an interesting choice. It more or less closes the gap for leveling gear between good raiders and players who put in a mediumish amount of time - weather or not those players are skilled.

/scurries off to compare Warlord/High warlord items to raid epics

It's also another option for raiding warriors that get tanking gear for the raid to get DPS gear. Or raiding paladins/shaman that get healing gear to get DPS gear without a complete time suck. Etc, etc.

It's really how a lot of the PvP gear should have been.

Rumors are that honor comes in 5 to 10 times slower than it used to. So 20K honor which used to take like 3 or 4 hours, is now 12 to 40 hours (depends on the honor rate slow down). That's fine by me though. It's just another option that can be solo ground to get some rewards over time.