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+--- Thread: Amazing - the brand new 997 (/thread-8675.html)
Amazing - the brand new 997 - Fragbait - 05-13-2004
Hi everybody,
Just wanted to share my excitement for the all new porsche 997 with you. Although it's just a further development of the 996 series, in terms of style and design it's one pace back. And I don't mean it negatively - the design resembles the 993 series much more, and I find it awesome!
Here are is a pic that shows the Carrera with 325 BHP and the Carrera S with 355 BHP. Both (!) will be released in July.
Quote:The design of the Porsche 911 is a logical continuation of the 911 story, now over 40 years old. The result of the new exterior design â including a wider track and more emphasis on the waist â is a 911 which is even more dynamic, clear, powerful and, at the same time, elegant. Other striking features of the evolutionary design are the new circular headlamps with separate additional headlamps in the nose area, more prominent fenders, dual-arm exterior mirrors, altered seam characteristics and a more aerodynamic rear spoiler.(from www.porsche.com)
Gentlemen, start your engines :)
Greetings, Fragbait
Amazing - the brand new 997 - Nicodemus Phaulkon - 05-13-2004
It's four wheels and a vector, and gets your butt from Point A to Point B.
Why spend the money on this sort of thing when you can buy another that costs 10% of the purchase price, a fraction of the insurance costs, can be serviced anywhere at anytime and actually has somewhere to put your groceries/luggage/children?
Amazing - the brand new 997 - Fragbait - 05-13-2004
Hail Nicodemus,
Quote:Why spend the money on this sort of thing when you can buy another that costs 10% of the purchase price
Why do some people play tennis? Go diving? Climb Mt. Everest?
They have fun doing it.
It really is as simple as that. When you go to work and earn your money, when you aren't in financial trouble, then you want to use some of the money you have to make your life 'better'. Better, of course, lies in the eyes of the beholder, so it's perfectly ok too, if you want to donate all that you don't really need for living to social organizations or save it for your children. It's just that everybody has another idea of what makes life worth living.
What concerns Porsche - well, it stands for some of the finest quality sports cars in the world. It has an amazing history. If you're interested, it would be a good choice to play EAs Need For Speed: Porsche. Contrary to its name, it's not only about the need for speed, but about the myth Porsche.
What fascinates me about Porsche is the persistence with which they refuse to adapt the windtunnel-shaped forms of modern supercars, and focus on their relatively small engines (6-cylinder mostly, apart from the Carrera GT and the Chayenne), and extraordinary chassis.
Some people feel pure luck when accelerating and race around turns, others when they indulge in collecting stamps. I can at least relate to one of these two... :)
Greetings, Fragbait
Amazing - the brand new 997 - Wapptor - 05-13-2004
Loving the new 997. I know exactly what you mean when you say it resembles the old 993, especially with the round headlamps. A beautiful car, the 996 was beautiful of course, but I like this too. Can't decide which I like more now. I think I'd be sold on this one though (assuming I had that kind of money) just for the newer chassis and engines. I read a 4.8 second sprint to 60 for the S and about 5 seconds for the normal model. Looking forward to a Turbo :D
Porsche. Beautiful, German, Fast. Whats not to love?
-Wapptor
Amazing - the brand new 997 - Zarathustra - 05-14-2004
Some people just love to drive. I am one of them. And some people love Porsche's line of cars. Again, I am one of them. I became an impromptu Porsche fan about 5 years ago, and one of these days I'll be able to afford another. :D
So to those who love cars because they love to go out and drive, I say the appeal is great. What I don't understand is the people who try to use the car as an extension of their... *ahem* I blame the "Fast and Furious" movies, in part. (or at least that's a recent target to place the blame).
Amazing - the brand new 997 - kandrathe - 05-14-2004
If we had an Autobahn it would make loving fast cars easier.
I want more freedom. I want a free public zone where unlimited velocity is allowed.
![[Image: evo7_bmw1.jpg]](http://home.mchsi.com/~russerickson/evo7_bmw1.jpg)
I'd take the Evo 7. A used Porsche 911 Carrera is > 65K$, but the brand new Evo 7 is ~$28K. If I want to dream about cars I will never own, how about the 2004 Porsche Carrera GT 2dr Convertible (5.7L V10 6M) with a sticker of $440K.
Amazing - the brand new 997 - Walkiry - 05-14-2004
I actually really like driving cars, it's a fun activity.
On the other hand, I loathe the fact that there are many many people who also like to drive and need to do so in the same public roads we have to share.
Concentrating on the other cars and constant monitoring of what the other people are doing, up to and including the kids that jump under your vehicle when they throw the ball to the road, is far too stressing for my liking.
Therefore I currently don't own a car. To get my butt to work every morning I sit back and relax in the train reading a book.
Amazing - the brand new 997 - kandrathe - 05-14-2004
The trains in Germany (and Europe in general) are great. But, in America very few cities have commuter rail transit, and inter-city transit by train (AmTrak) is very very unappealing. By unappealing, I mean it is not dependable, on-time, clean, or safe. As an example, my mom decided to try once to come to see me by train. The train broke down about half way, they came to get them off the train with a school bus, then brought them 200 miles to Chicago, where they could wait for 2 days to continue their train journey, or get a refund. Getting off the school bus at the Chicago Bus terminal, her purse and luggage were stolen at gun point. I'm not saying that is typical, but it is indicative of the poor service attitude of AmTrak.
The city where I live is getting it's first commuter rail line this summer, between the Minneapolis city center and the airport, and will then extend to the "Mall of America". I'm hopeful that they will continue to extend it along the high traffic volume corridors in the future.
That still wouldn't help me, as I live on the extreme west side of the metro area and I work 40 miles on the diagonal at the extreme south side of the metro area. I doubt they will ever have a train that would suit my needs.
Amazing - the brand new 997 - yangman - 05-14-2004
Wapptor,May 13 2004, 04:34 PM Wrote:Porsche. Beautiful, German, Fast. Whats not to love?The tremendous thirst for gasoline that these cars typically have?
As much as I love going fast in fast cars, the recent ridiculous rises in gas price has made public transit much more appealing, and even the prospect of owning a cheap little Echo Hatchback a financial impossibility.
According to a fairly reliable source the highest reported gas price in Greater Vancouver today is over a dollar per litre. Yes, over a dollar per litre for regular unleaded 87-octane gasoline, which places the price of premium gasoline, which high-compression and high-horse-power engines typically need, almost at $1.50 per litre. It's a doubling in price compared to even just a few months ago.
*sigh*
Amazing - the brand new 997 - kandrathe - 05-14-2004
![[Image: Gas20040514.gif]](http://home.mchsi.com/~russerickson/Gas20040514.gif)
That would make me want to walk or ride a bike too.
Amazing - the brand new 997 - Baylan - 05-15-2004
I recently made a trip to Scotland (Edinburgh exactly, though we drove all the way back down to London to get on our plane back to the states) with my school band. The cost was about 75-80 pence per liter, converted to US dollars comes to approximately 1.50-1.60 and in a dollar per gallon ratio it is near 4 dollars a gallon.
Simply put, we shouldn't be complaining. In fact, if we want to find the real solution to the oncoming oil/gas crisis, we should continue to raise prices so that the automobile companies start developing that darned hydrogen fuel cell car already :-p...
Ah well
Cest la vie, right?
Baylan
Amazing - the brand new 997 - kandrathe - 05-15-2004
Quote:Simply put, we shouldn't be complaining. In fact, if we want to find the real solution to the oncoming oil/gas crisis, we should continue to raise prices so that the automobile companies start developing that darned hydrogen fuel cell car already :-p...
I was looking into hydrogen fuel recently, and I found that the current hydrogen economy is also based on cracking petroleum. Doh. There is some research at the university here that has developed a very efficient method of generating hydrogen from ethanol, but getting the ethanol still requires the petroleum for cultivation, fertilizers, etc.
Ok, so two problems. The first is to eliminate the dependance on hydrocarbon fuels in vehicles. We need to convert not only commuter vehicles, but also our tractors, combines, etc to hydrogen fuel. Electricity generation from fuel oil, or coal is also a huge problem, and in my opinion was a short sighted decision. Again, this is not popular, but my opinion is that we should convert all electrical power generation to nuclear. Solving the waste storage problem, and moving to fusion reactors are also important and requires more attention.
The second, what to do about petroleum based fertilizer? My answer is that I'm afraid that the world is going to need to get over their fear of genetically modified plants. Yes, do the studies to insure they are safe for human consumption. Focus also on preventing the dispersion of GM plant DNA into the natural gene pool. A significant research effort in genomics is to develop hardy plants with large yields that need little or no hebicides and fertilizers. This makes food crops cultivation hydrocarbon free, cheaper to grow, and eliminates the damaging runoff of nutrients or herbicides into streams, rivers and lakes.
The answers are out there, just politically unpalatable for many.
Amazing - the brand new 997 - yangman - 05-15-2004
kandrathe,May 15 2004, 06:28 AM Wrote:Focus also on preventing the dispersion of GM plant DNA into the natural gene pool.The only ways, as far as I can see, to truely prevent GM plants from "infecting" other organically-natural crop is to modify them to such that their reproductive systems no longer function, or create mini-eco systems, totally seperate from others, to grow the plants in. Neither is very practical.
Quote: A significant research effort in genomics is to develop hardy plants with large yields that need little or no hebicides and fertilizers.A fundemental law of the universe, paraphrased, is that in any closed system, you can only get out as much as you put in. This is also true for farming. Simply put, you cannot expect crop yield of acceptable nutrient value unless the soil, or what ever substance the plants are grown in, is replenished with nutrients before and during the growth cycle. Most vegetables and fruits produces today already have relatively low levels of nutrients, and no amount of generic engineering is going to change the fact that your crop is only as good as the soil you grow them in.
Although it is easy to put more emphasis on quantity, quality must also play a large role if a solution is going to be effective in the long run.
Amazing - the brand new 997 - kandrathe - 05-16-2004
Quote:The only ways, as far as I can see, to truely prevent GM plants from "infecting" other organically-natural crop is to modify them to such that their reproductive systems no longer function, or create mini-eco systems, totally seperate from others, to grow the plants in. Neither is very practical.Barbara McClintock belatedly won the Nobel Prize for discovering that genes in corn plants would jump through cell walls. Even preventing reproduction would not prevent genetic materials from seeping from the GM plants. The only possible way I can see is to prevent the two populations from coming into contact with each other.
Quote:A fundemental law of the universe, paraphrased, is that in any closed system, you can only get out as much as you put in. This is also true for farming. Simply put, you cannot expect crop yield of acceptable nutrient value unless the soil, or what ever substance the plants are grown in, is replenished with nutrients before and during the growth cycle. Most vegetables and fruits produces today already have relatively low levels of nutrients, and no amount of generic engineering is going to change the fact that your crop is only as good as the soil you grow them in.I think by far the most common hydrocarbon fertilizer used by farmers is Anhydrous ammonia. This only supplies nitrogen and so I think most farmers must supplement their land with other nutrient sources. What I was getting at is that genetic selection and alterations can produce plants that do better in poorer soils. The nutrients taken from the land need to be replaced, usually by animal wastes or other chemical sources. Selecting plants that produce higher yeilds given the same nutrient levels in the soil can offset the need to fertilize as heavily, which IMHO is a good thing.
Quote:Plants require 13 mineral nutrient elements for growth. The elements that are required or necessary for plants to complete their life cycle are called essential plant nutrients. Each of these nutrients has a critical function in plants and are required in varying amounts in plant tissue (Table 1). Macronutrients (nitrogen, phosphorus, potassium, calcium, magnesium and sulfur) are plant nutrients required in the largest amount in plants. Micronutrients (iron, copper, manganese, zinc, boron, molybdenum and chlorine) are required in relatively smaller amounts. Additional mineral nutrient elements which are beneficial to plants but not necessarily essential include sodium, cobalt, vanadium, nickel, selenium, aluminum and silicon.
Amazing - the brand new 997 - Rhydderch Hael - 05-16-2004
Yeah! Of course, if we're going purely by the numbers of economics, then the Model T is the way to go. I mean, why even bother paying for such unneccessary frills such as a water pump? Gravity is free, and it'll supply the feed pressure for the fuel system just fine. Ford proved you can make a car that has four wheels and can get you from A to B at the barest minimun of resource cost. So, anyone who isn't driving something as simple as a Tin Lizzie is flagrantly succumbing to the excesses of life! :angry:
Amazing - the brand new 997 - Nicodemus Phaulkon - 05-16-2004
No T