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+--- Thread: So now, it seems non-conformity is a form of mental illness (/thread-15925.html)
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So now, it seems non-conformity is a form of mental illness - FireIceTalon - 05-09-2014
according to our bourgeois pseudoscience practicing psychiatrists.
http://www.naturalnews.com/044862_psychiatrists_mental_illness_oppositional_defiant_disorder.html
"the ruling ideas in every society have ever been the ideas of its ruling class"
I guess I have a mental illness now, according to these clowns. And the sad thing is, probably half of people will actually believe this pseudoscientific garbage.
RE: So now, it seems non-conformity is a form of mental illness - Taem - 05-09-2014
(05-09-2014, 06:26 PM)FireIceTalon Wrote: according to our bourgeois pseudoscience practicing psychiatrists.
http://www.naturalnews.com/044862_psychiatrists_mental_illness_oppositional_defiant_disorder.html
"the ruling ideas in every society have ever been the ideas of its ruling class"
I guess I have a mental illness now, according to these clowns. And the sad thing is, probably half of people will actually believe this pseudoscientific garbage.
Regarding the 'Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders', in lieu of overhauling the entire psychology system (read this), I suspect most psychiatrists will take what they hear with a grain of salt!
RE: So now, it seems non-conformity is a form of mental illness - kandrathe - 05-09-2014
(05-09-2014, 09:09 PM)Taem Wrote: Regarding the 'Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders', in lieu of overhauling the entire psychology system (read this), I suspect most psychiatrists will take what they hear with a grain of salt!The DSM-IV, which the Natural News guy is kvetching about was published in 1994. Evidently, Natural News is slow news. Like decades slow. ODD is diagnosed in children, adults are just anti-social or sociopaths. I also find myself frustrated with a society that doesn't understand that people's giftedness (pick a skill) is on a bell curve, not a square.
However, I too find ODD is often over used by non-psychiatrist teachers to label students who aren't little angels, often tween boys. I've been told my oldest has ODD by a few myself. Rather, he's different in a different way. He does have mild ADHD, but more is impacted by a genetic neural developmental difference affecting the delaying the maturation of his executive functioning and sensory processing at the same rate as his peers. It comes from my mom. People from that lineage don't mentally become adults until early to mid 20's, and they live into their early hundreds. As Dr. Temple Grandin wrote, "Different ... not less."
I had a final thought on the irony, of a political science guy... nvm.
RE: So now, it seems non-conformity is a form of mental illness - DeeBye - 05-10-2014
I just can't take seriously a news article that uses the word "sheeple".
RE: So now, it seems non-conformity is a form of mental illness - Bun-Bun - 05-10-2014
naturalnews.com? Really?
RE: So now, it seems non-conformity is a form of mental illness - FireIceTalon - 05-10-2014
Well, a simple google search will show that naturalnews.com isn't the only source on this, and there are plenty that do not use the word "sheeple" in the title if that is such an issue.
RE: So now, it seems non-conformity is a form of mental illness - Bun-Bun - 05-11-2014
(05-10-2014, 08:50 PM)FireIceTalon Wrote: Well, a simple google search will show that naturalnews.com isn't the only source on this, and there are plenty that do not use the word "sheeple" in the title if that is such an issue.
And such a search reveals this is nothing new; the diagnostic criteria were refined in DSM-5, not created anew. So, apparently, you choose to take NaturalNews at its word. And you choose to trumpet it as an exemplar of your viewpoint.
That excludes you from the group of rational humans worth discussing matters with. If you can't figure out that 99% of NaturalNews is tripe, you're so far down the conspiracy-theory rabbit hole there's nothing more to say.
RE: So now, it seems non-conformity is a form of mental illness - kandrathe - 05-12-2014
More to the bottom line; according to Mayo clinic... "Many people have mental health concerns from time to time. But a mental health concern becomes a mental illness when ongoing signs and symptoms cause frequent stress and affect your ability to function."
Everyone has life challenges due to circumstances, but they don't require intervention until the person becomes a danger to themselves and those around them. People can seek mental health help any time they feel they might need it.
RE: So now, it seems non-conformity is a form of mental illness - shoju - 05-12-2014
Oppositional Defiant Disorder, is a little more than what that article makes it out to be. Once you have spent time around someone who is truly ODD, it's pretty easy to differentiate.
The problem is, it is a blanket diagnosis given, when parents complain and complain and complain, similar to how ADHD is diagnosed (wrongly) quite frequently. As the husband of a mental health professional, I look at articles like this, and the reaction that it has caused in some, and I just shake my head. Misinformation, misdiagnosis, mistreatment of a misdiagnosed patient, and the awesome terms like "pseudo-science" that get bantered around in conjunction with this, only serves to make the job harder. I hear about. Oh, do I hear about it.
My son exhibited ODD type traits for a long time. It wasn't ODD. It was a natural reaction to the awful shit that his mother had put him through. Eventually, he grew out of it. We figured he would. I mean. What 9 year old kid isn't going to exhibit some very frustrating behavior after their mother loses custody because she kicked out her husband (step dad), moved in her boyfriend (Crack Dealer), and started cooking rock in the home?
Yeah... That's going to mess with you.
RE: So now, it seems non-conformity is a form of mental illness - kandrathe - 05-14-2014
(05-12-2014, 09:26 PM)shoju Wrote: Yeah... That's going to mess with you.Add to that our societies need to label people as that one thing, and forever you become known as that one thing. Plus, the mystery of the human condition where subconsciously we live up to others expectations of us.
RE: So now, it seems non-conformity is a form of mental illness - Tal - 05-14-2014
(05-10-2014, 08:50 PM)FireIceTalon Wrote: Well, a simple google search will show that naturalnews.com isn't the only source on this, and there are plenty that do not use the word "sheeple" in the title if that is such an issue.
Basing internet research around google searches is not good research. You have to examine the content, the sources for that content, the author's authority amongst other factors. It is entirely too easy to drive up similar news stories and sites in google's search results.
This is why society needs Libraries and Librarians. This is why higher education needs an overhaul that doesn't include teaching to the test but also critical thinking and solid research skills.
This is why you will remain a pseudo-intellectual poseur with delusions that your voice means anything more than farting in a wind tunnel.
RE: So now, it seems non-conformity is a form of mental illness - kandrathe - 05-14-2014
I did find the article referenced by the NaturalNewz article, "Political Abuse of Psychiatry in the Soviet Union and in China: Complexities and Controversies" by Richard J. Bonnie, LLB to be a more interesting read than the original article.
The other sources were tin-foil hat opinions (i.e. crap).
RE: So now, it seems non-conformity is a form of mental illness - FireIceTalon - 05-15-2014
(05-14-2014, 02:21 PM)Tal Wrote: This is why you will remain a pseudo-intellectual poseur with delusions that your voice means anything more than farting in a wind tunnel.
Pffft. Dream on.
The only pseudo-intellectuals here are the psychiatrists who come up with incorrect diagnosis or make up new ones entirely based on pure ideological pandering to what the ruling class deems to be "the norm" or "acceptable". If you deny that this takes place in our society, you either A. gullible/naive with a very rosy picture of things, or B. you are an apologist for it.
Also, you can sit here and throw around idealist statements like "society needs more libraries and librarians" or that "education needs a complete re-haul that teaches critical thinking" all you want, and it means nothing - at the end of the day the capitalist system will have these things as IT deems necessary to be in line with profitability, not as to what YOU (or pretty much anyone else) thinks it ought to be. If you think any major meaningful changes to education are going occur under the current way of things, better snap out that dream and get back to reality, because you will be sorely disappointed I'm afraid.
RE: So now, it seems non-conformity is a form of mental illness - FireIceTalon - 05-15-2014
(05-11-2014, 02:52 PM)Bun-Bun Wrote: And such a search reveals this is nothing new; the diagnostic criteria were refined in DSM-5, not created anew.
Irrelevant to my larger point.
Quote:So, apparently, you choose to take NaturalNews at its word. And you choose to trumpet it as an exemplar of your viewpoint. That excludes you from the group of rational humans worth discussing matters with. If you can't figure out that 99% of NaturalNews is tripe, you're so far down the conspiracy-theory rabbit hole there's nothing more to say.
Or perhaps, they aren't too far off the mark in this particular instance, regardless of how right or wrong they may be in anything else they publish!? Nor is anyone trumpeting any particular viewpoint. I am very anti-ideological and I was critiquing how some psychiatrists or any neurological doctor can, have, (AND DO) use their profession for ideological purposes rather than scientific ones. I guess you could call that "trumpeting a viewpoint", but perhaps it is a viewpoint that should be trumpeted more often by more people? If you are so shallow as to not be able to understand that, the problem is on YOUR end, not mine. There is nothing conspiracy theory about this, it is in fact a sad (and dangerous) reality. Which is why I don't think it is so much a "viewpoint" as it is an observation.
RE: So now, it seems non-conformity is a form of mental illness - Hammerskjold - 05-15-2014
(05-09-2014, 06:26 PM)FireIceTalon Wrote: according to our bourgeois pseudoscience practicing psychiatrists.
When someone strives to be literate, that usually does not mean being literal, or alliterate. Though hey, good job on that last one, worthy of an Adam West Batman line.
Maybe add 'Philandering' to it too. Or Philadelphian. Nothing against people from Philadelphia, but if you're going to be true alliterate, might as well go all out.
Eg: 'Prozac Prescribing Pill Popping Philandering Philadelphian Philharmonic Pseudoscience Practicing Psychiatric Pusillanimous Poppinjay Pretenders!'
Quote:I guess I have a mental illness now,
Well, the first step is admitting you have a problem.
But don't worry comrade, being a -true- rebel is not always easy. Pay no attention to these bourgeois capitalist conformist, they have no idea how hard it is being a Real Rebel.
Here's a diagram for all you no clue having, rebel hatin' conformists!
![[Image: rebels-rebels-everywhere_c_3129657.jpg]](http://global3.memecdn.com/rebels-rebels-everywhere_c_3129657.jpg)
RE: So now, it seems non-conformity is a form of mental illness - FireIceTalon - 05-15-2014
(05-15-2014, 06:27 PM)Hammerskjold Wrote:(05-09-2014, 06:26 PM)FireIceTalon Wrote: according to our bourgeois pseudoscience practicing psychiatrists.
When someone strives to be literate, that usually does not mean being literal, or alliterate. Though hey, good job on that last one, worthy of an Adam West Batman line.
Maybe add 'Philandering' to it too. Or Philadelphian. Nothing against people from Philadelphia, but if you're going to be true alliterate, might as well go all out.
Eg: 'Prozac Prescribing Pill Popping Philandering Philadelphian Philharmonic Pseudoscience Practicing Psychiatric Pusillanimous Poppinjay Pretenders!'
Quote:I guess I have a mental illness now,
Well, the first step is admitting you have a problem.
But don't worry comrade, being a -true- rebel is not always easy. Pay no attention to these bourgeois capitalist conformist, they have no idea how hard it is being a Real Rebel.
Here's a diagram for all you no clue having, rebel hatin' conformists!
Eh, fuck you.
No other reply is appropriate for the quoted post.
EDIT - I will add this: People like you are exhibit A in confirming the original article correct, so job well done.
RE: So now, it seems non-conformity is a form of mental illness - Hammerskjold - 05-15-2014
(05-15-2014, 07:43 PM)FireIceTalon Wrote: Eh, fuck you.
No other reply is appropriate for the quoted post.
Such. A. Rebel.
By the way, you should probably return the thesaurus when you're done.
Keeping it this long from the library can probably rack up quite the fine. Bourgeois I know, but the other rebels needs their resource of alliterative ammo too, comrade.
RE: So now, it seems non-conformity is a form of mental illness - Hammerskjold - 05-15-2014
(05-14-2014, 02:21 PM)Tal Wrote: This is why society needs Libraries and Librarians. This is why higher education needs an overhaul that doesn't include teaching to the test but also critical thinking and solid research skills.
I will ignore the fact that you capitalized the word "libraries" and "librarian", therefore outing your obvious capitalist letterist agenda.
Having said that, libraries should really have more literacy and reading comprehension programs. I know one little rebel who got swindled from his "College Level Reading Comprehension 101" class. I sincerely hope he held on to his receipt for dear life. There's a solid case for a refund I think.
I may have mentioned this little rebel mayhaps kept a thesaurus way past it's due date. I was mostly joking, I completely forgot that his current reading abilities is more pamphlet sized.
I guess what I'm saying is, do you know of any local libraries that can take him in for a reading remedial review? He is a precious (or is that precocious, I can never remember which is which) little rebel, but can act cranky when he misses his nap time and juice. I know, don't we all right.
He already knows how to write with a pen and pencil, struggling with script, but he switches to his favourite crayon when he gets overly excited.
I know we are all in this together, because it takes a village to raise a child, (or a potato) and thank you for your attention on the matter.
Bonjour, Bonsoir, Bourgeois.
Signed,
Reb Ell Esq, the Third.
RE: So now, it seems non-conformity is a form of mental illness - Tal - 05-16-2014
(05-15-2014, 05:15 PM)FireIceTalon Wrote:(05-14-2014, 02:21 PM)Tal Wrote: This is why you will remain a pseudo-intellectual poseur with delusions that your voice means anything more than farting in a wind tunnel.
Pffft. Dream on.
The only pseudo-intellectuals here are the psychiatrists who come up with incorrect diagnosis or make up new ones entirely based on pure ideological pandering to what the ruling class deems to be "the norm" or "acceptable". If you deny that this takes place in our society, you either A. gullible/naive with a very rosy picture of things, or B. you are an apologist for it.
Also, you can sit here and throw around idealist statements like "society needs more libraries and librarians" or that "education needs a complete re-haul that teaches critical thinking" all you want, and it means nothing - at the end of the day the capitalist system will have these things as IT deems necessary to be in line with profitability, not as to what YOU (or pretty much anyone else) thinks it ought to be. If you think any major meaningful changes to education are going occur under the current way of things, better snap out that dream and get back to reality, because you will be sorely disappointed I'm afraid.
No what I'm pointing out is that your education and critical thinking skills are sorely lacking. You are very much a product of the system you decry.
RE: So now, it seems non-conformity is a form of mental illness - kandrathe - 05-16-2014
The irony in the OP article is that the best source, the one I linked to above, points out that the very thing FIT is alleging occurs with the BPPP DSM IV ODD diagnosis (hmmm, acronym bingo FTW), was documented in the places that are more communist (yeah, yeah, we know no real communism actually exists outside FITs imagination). Where the State has ultimate power, they abuse it... also with psychiatry, against their political opponents. If we're saying, "we want the State to have less power", then I'm in agreement.
I would also point out that the "capitalist" K-12 education system is predominantly not. It is an agency of the State, and in fact, suffers the common problems that plague State (democratic, socialist or communist, you pick) run institutions. Every day we blithely pack up our children to go get collected by the machinery of State education, who then determines what they should learn for that day, and then returns them back to us in the evening. If anything goes wrong with the child, it's the parents (fault) problem. The only control as a citizen I have is to attempt to influence my local school board (having limited oversight) or State government. The curriculum, and resultant potential employee is so obviously not at all guided by capitalists (we might argue that NCLB is one place the "ruling elite" have Federally reached their long arms into the State run bureaucracy of education.
Yah, yah, I know what he's thinking... It's still enveloped in the broader society... Pffft. What about these so-called communist radicals? Do they have a job? Do they attend a college and pay tuition? What about their supposedly radical extremist splinter cell? I would guess they "buy" their groceries, not grow them. I would guess they "buy" their clothing, not weave it and sew it. I would guess they maybe have a car, and if so, probably pay for licenses, insurance, and "buy" gas from the evil oil companies. I would guess they take out loans from the evil bankers for school. I would guess they've also got their hands out for every possible government subsidy they can get.
So, I would say they should look in the mirror and tell us what makes any of these comrades not part and parcel of the Capitalist system? If they want change, then they need to change their lifestyle to their bloviated ideals, or continue to flog everyone around them and come off as yet another angry self-hating hypocrite who is deluded into thinking their incoherent rants are making a difference. Don't tell me communism is better. Show me.
The sad thing is they (and every other closed minded political partisan unwilling to respect their opponents as equals) really are making a difference. They make the world an angrier, hateful place. The OP is a great example. Evidently, the entire field of psychology is psuedo-science, or at least the ones who (risk malpractice suits, and act against their Hippocratic oath) practice ideological misdiagnosis. And, seemingly, everyone is bourgeois, which I just mentally substitute for the communist version of expletive or epithet. As in, "Enough is enough! I've had it with these bourgeois capitalists on this bourgeois pseudoscience system! You better strap in, I'm about to open some bourgeois ideological pandering windows!"