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+--- Thread: Werewolf Hunger (/thread-11479.html)
Werewolf Hunger - devzero - 04-30-2003
As far as i have understood, hunger has its own animation sequense that can be brought as low as 4 frames. The stuff ive read over on amazon basin (hungry hunter thread) and Dragoons guides are all particular to the werebear form. I also have some other questions, so here we go:
Does anyone know how the speed enchantment from werewolf form affects hunger? Also, is one and two handed weapons the same? Will off weapon ias have any effect at all when im trying to reach 4 frames attack speed or is the only option getting 125% wias?
I guess 75% dammage reduction means that its applied after all other enchantments are done? Or is it applied together with the other dammage modifiers?
Looking forward to any replies.
devzero
Werewolf Hunger - Kharohz - 04-30-2003
I am also curious about this matter.
Does the 75% damage reduction only effect physical? Thanks.
Werewolf Hunger - Tommi - 05-01-2003
According to Chippydip's skill information site, Hunger has "Damage Penalty: -75 percent". This is the same property as with Multiple Shot, and it affects all damage types. Check my weapon damage calculations page for details.
Cheers,
Tommi
Werewolf Hunger - devzero - 05-01-2003
Far as i know thats not true for hunger, altho i havnt tested it. According to the hungry hunter thread its only physical dammage thats affected. Therefore this is a good skill to use with a fast weapon and lots of elemental dammage. I have not tested it myself yet tho so i would need someone to verify this.
Werewolf Hunger - Sporky Smurf - 05-01-2003
Tommi,May 1 2003, 03:52 PM Wrote:According to Chippydip's skill information site, Hunger has "Damage Penalty: -75 percent". This is the same property as with Multiple Shot, and it affects all damage types.Actually, Multishot is only -25% damage. It's the arrows doe 75% of what a single shot does.
Cheers,
Tommi
Werewolf Hunger - Ruvanal - 05-01-2003
Tommi,May 1 2003, 11:52 AM Wrote:According to Chippydip's skill information site, Hunger has "Damage Penalty: -75 percent". This is the same property as with Multiple Shot, and it affects all damage types. Check my weapon damage calculations page for details.It is not the same property.
Cheers,
Tommi
The damage adjustment for Multishot is done through the SrcDmg column in skills.txt and will apply its effects to all the damage that is derived from using the weapon needed for the skill to work. This column uses values in 8ths to set the damage scaling (MS has a 6 for 6/8=75% adjustment). This can be applied to all skills that require a weapon as focal point to use the skill. For the most of the skills this in normally set at 8 (for 8/8=100% damage adjustment).
The damage adjustment for Hunger is a property of the skill itself and the factor is a percentage set up through one of its parameters in skills.txt (param5=-75, % damage penalty). This is special to the skill itself and cannot just be used with other skills. The incremental amounts that this can be adjusted by is 1% and presumably could even be set to adjust the damage in a positive manner. Also the effect with Hunger is that only the physical damage is adjusted not any non-physical damage that is also applied with the skill. The damage adjustment is done in a manner similar to what will happen with a Deadly Strike blow in that the physical damage is reduced to 25% independently of the other damage adjustments such as strength or other types of damage enhancements from skills.
Werewolf Hunger - Brista - 05-01-2003
Could I just confirm how Deadly Srike stacks with Hunger please?
1.00 * 0.25 * (100 + Deadly Strike%)%?
Werewolf Hunger - Kharohz - 05-01-2003
Quote:The damage adjustment for Hunger is a property of the skill itself and the factor is a percentage set up through one of its parameters in skills.txt (param5=-75, % damage penalty). This is special to the skill itself and cannot just be used with other skills. The incremental amounts that this can be adjusted by is 1% and presumably could even be set to adjust the damage in a positive manner. Also the effect with Hunger is that only the physical damage is adjusted not any non-physical damage that is also applied with the skill. The damage adjustment is done in a manner similar to what will happen with a Deadly Strike blow in that the physical damage is reduced to 25% independently of the other damage adjustments such as strength or other types of damage enhancements from skills.
Sorry for being rude here. But I had a very long long week. My brain no longer functions properly. So I cannot translate this gibberish into layman's terms.
Let me get this straight, Hunger only effects your PHYSICAL damage correct? Thanks.
Werewolf Hunger - Brista - 05-02-2003
Yes, quarter of what your physical damage would be using normal attack but full value from elemental damage bonuses as well as a frame faster attack speed and the rather healthy leech
Werewolf Hunger - Kharohz - 05-02-2003
Are you sure about the frame faster?
That would be saying its possible to have a 3 frame hunger
Werewolf Hunger - FenrisWulf - 05-02-2003
Not a frame faster...Hunger just reaches faster frames with slightly less IAS.
Werewolf Hunger - devzero - 05-02-2003
Actually the test done in the hungry hunter thread says that it will get down to 4 frames, witch is 2 frames faster than most other single click single attack. It is also faster than fury, since fury have a "charge upp" animation (the first animation in the 5 squence attack cycle). Hunger is therfor the fastest wereform attack mode.
Thanx for the info Ruvynal. Informative as ever :)
Werewolf Hunger - FenrisWulf - 05-02-2003
Maul and Fire Claws, and even the normal attack in Werebear Form, all can also go at 4 frames. Hunger just gets there a bit quicker.
Werewolf Hunger - devzero - 05-02-2003
my bad then. I was not aware of this. Do you by any chance have any speed tables for these attacks?
Werewolf Hunger - FenrisWulf - 05-02-2003
I don't have any, but TheDragoon has a ton. :D Check the Weapon Section.
EDIT: Just so you know, though, Phase Blades and Repeating XBows/Chu-ko-nus/Demon XBows are (I think) the only known weapons that can actually hit a 4 frame general attack on a Werebear.
Werewolf Hunger - devzero - 05-02-2003
Ok, ive put the forumlas Dragoon uses into a excel spread sheet and done some calculations. (this still dosnt answer my question about hunger tho, since it might reach 4 frames on a lot more weapons).
any one handed weapons (and 2handed swords) with a total of 130 WIAS should reach 4 frames (150 total ias needed)
any 2-handed other with a total of 100 wias should also reach 4 frames (150 total ias needed)
werewolf is slower :( only viable is 2handed other
2handed other needs 140 wias, with 11% additional ias from wolf form.
The other weapons need 180 wias to reach 4 frames, 3% ias from wolf :lol: (i dont think there is any weapons that can reach 180% wias, phase blade is 150 max isnt it?)
chu ku no is -60 and 5 sockets = 160% wias, 1 shael to spare :)
now if only someone could explain the diffrence between the hunger and the other attacks. If anyone wants the excel sheet, leave a message and ill post it.
Werewolf Hunger - TheDragoon - 05-02-2003
Please don't use that formula as it's not correct. :) The attack speed tables have been all experimentally tested so I'm fairly confident that they are correct. I'll try to let you know everything I know about Hunger later, but I've got to head to class right now. B)
Werewolf Hunger - Olon97 - 05-03-2003
In response to the original question, werewolves generally aren't going to get much mileage out of non-weapon IAS sources.
If you compare the speed tables in Dragoon's guides for Wolves and Bears, you'll see that there isn't even a column for outside IAS for wolves on some of the tables, and when there is, often you only see the animation length changing for very low amounts of weapon IAS (looks like on a wolf - anything with more than 25 weapon IAS can't be sped up by outside IAS).
The exact calculations aside, it's pretty clear that there must be a capped "effective IAS" term, which a high werewolf skill helps to max out with just a little weapon IAS. Wherever the speed boost from hunger is coming from, I suspect it's even less likely that non-weapon IAS will make any dent at all in attack animation length.