Soooo....Mass Effect 3

[Lissa]

We're now in the final stretch to close out the series, just 5 weeks till it's released. It looks like we get a combination crew of those that survived ME 1 and those that survived ME 2. Depending on who you sacrificed on Virmire, you could have a very, very large crew.

One of the aspects I'm looking forward to, and has been shown in some of the previews, is husks from other races. So far they've show Turian Husks and Krogan Husks (with the Turian Husks having the same coloration of Saren). I'm also looking forward to which races you can save and which ones you can let die (you are soooooo dead Batarians).

Something I hope they do in ME 3 is finally show what a Quarian looks like without the suit on. It would be nice to see what their faces actually look like. I've always like Tali and seeing how she grew between ME 1 and ME 2 and how she could be both strong and vulnerable was a real coup by BioWare for character writing.

So who else is chomping at the bit to get it installed and start playing through the storyline?

[Bolty]

I see the new trend on the Lounge is start threads with "So,..."

Mass Effect 3 is a double-edged sword with me. I adore the first two games, but like many, I have serious doubts about the 3rd. It's a full-on EA game, and look what they did to Dragon Age 2. Don't tell me that Bioware's image isn't seriously damaged after that debacle. Let's look at some other factors, as well:

• Multiplayer - why? The obvious cynical answer is to combat piracy. Introducing a multiplayer component into a game that has absolutely no need for it, and for which its fans don't want it, is a classic EA move. Want to make a multiplayer Mass Effect game? Then make a multiplayer Mass Effect game. The intellectual property that Mass Effect represents allows for an endless stream of spinoff games (RTS, FPS, you-name-it). Don't mess with what works, though - your single-player Mass Effect game trilogy. EA claims that development effort on multiplayer won't affect the single-player part of the game. Bull. Then later, they say that multiplayer activities will have some (small) impact on the single-player storyline. Call me a crusty curmudgeon, but go f*** yourselves, EA.
  
• DLC. Let's say you hear about this awesome thing called Mass Effect 2, and you go out today and buy it for $5. Hey, it's an old game, they're cheap now. You play it and go "wow, that was awesome! I want to play more!" So, you look around for DLC and discover this treasure trove of gaming additions: Kasumi, Shadow Broker, Overlord, great bonus missions and new content to see. Want to get them all? That'll be $42 for years-old content. EA's new policy is clear: they will want you to shell out $50-$60 for Mass Effect 3, and you know there will be anywhere between $50-$100 of DLC released afterwards. Once again, go f*** yourselves, EA. Not buying your game, sorry. The very mechanism that EA uses to milk more cash out of a game is the same mechanism that makes me not buy it to begin with. Your DLC should be F-R-E-E as a bonus on your Origin platform for people who legitimately purchase the game. If you come out with some huge new content patch that you want to release as an expansion, fine. But don't release small 2-hours-of-gameplay patches for 10 bucks and never lower the price even when the full base game costs only half that now. They don't seem to realize that this drives away business, especially when it becomes apparent the DLC is made up of things they just cut out of the final release so they could charge for it later.
  

If you couldn't tell, I'm not buying ME3 when it comes out. And I'm a huge fan of the first two games.

[kandrathe]

I see the new trend on the Lounge is start threads with "So,..."

Mass Effect 3 is a double-edged sword with me. I adore the first two games, but like many, I have serious doubts about the 3rd. It's a full-on EA game, and look what they did to Dragon Age 2. Don't tell me that Bioware's image isn't seriously damaged after that debacle. Let's look at some other factors, as well:

• Multiplayer - why? The obvious cynical answer is to combat piracy. Introducing a multiplayer component into a game that has absolutely no need for it, and for which its fans don't want it, is a classic EA move. Want to make a multiplayer Mass Effect game? Then make a multiplayer Mass Effect game. The intellectual property that Mass Effect represents allows for an endless stream of spinoff games (RTS, FPS, you-name-it). Don't mess with what works, though - your single-player Mass Effect game trilogy. EA claims that development effort on multiplayer won't affect the single-player part of the game. Bull. Then later, they say that multiplayer activities will have some (small) impact on the single-player storyline. Call me a crusty curmudgeon, but go f*** yourselves, EA.
  
• DLC. Let's say you hear about this awesome thing called Mass Effect 2, and you go out today and buy it for $5. Hey, it's an old game, they're cheap now. You play it and go "wow, that was awesome! I want to play more!" So, you look around for DLC and discover this treasure trove of gaming additions: Kasumi, Shadow Broker, Overlord, great bonus missions and new content to see. Want to get them all? That'll be $42 for years-old content. EA's new policy is clear: they will want you to shell out $50-$60 for Mass Effect 3, and you know there will be anywhere between $50-$100 of DLC released afterwards. Once again, go f*** yourselves, EA. Not buying your game, sorry. The very mechanism that EA uses to milk more cash out of a game is the same mechanism that makes me not buy it to begin with. Your DLC should be F-R-E-E as a bonus on your Origin platform for people who legitimately purchase the game. If you come out with some huge new content patch that you want to release as an expansion, fine. But don't release small 2-hours-of-gameplay patches for 10 bucks and never lower the price even when the full base game costs only half that now. They don't seem to realize that this drives away business, especially when it becomes apparent the DLC is made up of things they just cut out of the final release so they could charge for it later.
  

If you couldn't tell, I'm not buying ME3 when it comes out. And I'm a huge fan of the first two games.

I totally agree with you Bolty.


But, since I invested so much into the first two I'm compelled to buy it anyway... if it is affordable. I may not buy the DLC content if the core ME3 game sucks. I look at it this way; These are entertainment $ from my budget -- and in comparison to the enjoyment/unenjoyment ratio per $ I get from movies, even a hohum game which immerses me for 40-100 hours is a much better investment than seeing a plethora of yet another predictable chick flick, formulaic action pablum, or sensitive oscar wannabe movies.

Oh, and I like books.

[Lissa]

I see the new trend on the Lounge is start threads with "So,..."

Mass Effect 3 is a double-edged sword with me. I adore the first two games, but like many, I have serious doubts about the 3rd. It's a full-on EA game, and look what they did to Dragon Age 2. Don't tell me that Bioware's image isn't seriously damaged after that debacle. Let's look at some other factors, as well:

• Multiplayer - why? The obvious cynical answer is to combat piracy. Introducing a multiplayer component into a game that has absolutely no need for it, and for which its fans don't want it, is a classic EA move. Want to make a multiplayer Mass Effect game? Then make a multiplayer Mass Effect game. The intellectual property that Mass Effect represents allows for an endless stream of spinoff games (RTS, FPS, you-name-it). Don't mess with what works, though - your single-player Mass Effect game trilogy. EA claims that development effort on multiplayer won't affect the single-player part of the game. Bull. Then later, they say that multiplayer activities will have some (small) impact on the single-player storyline. Call me a crusty curmudgeon, but go f*** yourselves, EA.
  
• DLC. Let's say you hear about this awesome thing called Mass Effect 2, and you go out today and buy it for $5. Hey, it's an old game, they're cheap now. You play it and go "wow, that was awesome! I want to play more!" So, you look around for DLC and discover this treasure trove of gaming additions: Kasumi, Shadow Broker, Overlord, great bonus missions and new content to see. Want to get them all? That'll be $42 for years-old content. EA's new policy is clear: they will want you to shell out $50-$60 for Mass Effect 3, and you know there will be anywhere between $50-$100 of DLC released afterwards. Once again, go f*** yourselves, EA. Not buying your game, sorry. The very mechanism that EA uses to milk more cash out of a game is the same mechanism that makes me not buy it to begin with. Your DLC should be F-R-E-E as a bonus on your Origin platform for people who legitimately purchase the game. If you come out with some huge new content patch that you want to release as an expansion, fine. But don't release small 2-hours-of-gameplay patches for 10 bucks and never lower the price even when the full base game costs only half that now. They don't seem to realize that this drives away business, especially when it becomes apparent the DLC is made up of things they just cut out of the final release so they could charge for it later.
  

If you couldn't tell, I'm not buying ME3 when it comes out. And I'm a huge fan of the first two games.

I don't know where you've been looking of late with the DLC, but if you wait, much like with the game on occassion, you can grab a large bundle of DLC off Steam for a really good price (there was a deal some time back on the original Dragon Age where you paid $20 and got everything for DA 1 -- main game, awakenings, stone prisoner, the keep, Lilianna's Song, etc. You can also find bundles that EA does. But there is a downside as well, sometime the DLC is really a miss such as the final DLC for ME 2 which was way too short for the price they wanted. It filled in a lot of the story and set the stage for 3 for sure, but was it worth the money they wanted, not really.

And the piracy isn't what they're really trying to stop, that aspect was already handled in the prior ME 2 and DA 1 and 2 requiring a persistent internet connection. The real culprit here is that of the secondary market, selling used versions of the game where EA gets nothing. I agree that this is kind of a pissy thing to do, but that's what they're trying for with the multiplayer aspect by requiring each person to have a "pass" and the "pass" comes with a new game and the code will allow you to play multiplayer, but if someone has registered the multiplayer pass, you can't play multiplayer in the secondary market. Think of it as using the MMO model where the disks are effectively useless once you use the key.

[Jester]

So who else is chomping at the bit to get it installed and start playing through the storyline?

I'm excited for Mass Effect 3. If they've kept most of the quality of ME2, then I'll be a happy camper. The odds that this game will not be worth my money seem pretty low.

I'm not so worried about it going the way of DA2 - and even that game gave me my money's worth, if only barely. Bioware's got more cred with me than to let one bad game sour me, especially when it was clear the development was rushed. But, then, I'm loyal to the company for both solid reasons (a long legacy of my favourite games) and biased (family members worked for them...)

-Jester

[Bolty]

I don't know where you've been looking of late with the DLC, but if you wait, much like with the game on occassion, you can grab a large bundle of DLC off Steam for a really good price...

Mass Effect DLC is not available on Steam. For 1 or 2.

[Lissa]

I don't know where you've been looking of late with the DLC, but if you wait, much like with the game on occassion, you can grab a large bundle of DLC off Steam for a really good price...

Mass Effect DLC is not available on Steam. For 1 or 2.

It was bundled with Mass Effect 1 for sure as that's how I bought ME 1 off Steam a couple years back. I got ME 1 along with the DLC involving the asteroid the Bataarians were planning to drop on a Human planet. So, through Bundles, you could definitely get the DLC with the base game through Steam.

[Concillian]

I think I got a fair amount of DLC for DA in the recent sale Amazon had (DA:O + EXP + DA2 for $12). That was a one day sale, and the first time I've bought a game that required a persistent internet connection that I wasn't planning on playing, you know, on the internet.

It kinda sucks that I can't put it on my laptop and play at work on my breaks like I could with DII, NWN 1/2 and Baldur's Gate 1/2.

I actually don't really know what all is included, because I haven't played it much yet. Still not quite finished with Skyrim and still raiding once a week with WoW keeps me busy on the weekdays, and re-bricking the front of the house when it's not raining and working on building new speakers when it is handles the weekends pretty well.

[Quark]

It was bundled with Mass Effect 1 for sure as that's how I bought ME 1 off Steam a couple years back. I got ME 1 along with the DLC involving the asteroid the Bataarians were planning to drop on a Human planet. So, through Bundles, you could definitely get the DLC with the base game through Steam.

Some stuff was removed from Steam in the EA vs Valve spat that's still ongoing.

Re: Multiplayer. What I heard is the galaxy is in a general state of "readiness" for the war. How ready the galaxy is helps determine endings. You can either do MP or SP optional side quests to raise "readiness". You can max it out single player only.

I'll try MP out, but be doing everything SP anyway so ...

[Bolty]

Re: Multiplayer. What I heard is the galaxy is in a general state of "readiness" for the war. How ready the galaxy is helps determine endings. You can either do MP or SP optional side quests to raise "readiness". You can max it out single player only.

I've been purposely avoiding plot spoilers, other than the obvious one that can't be missed - Earth gets its butt kicked early on in the game.

You'd think that alone would help get everyone else "ready" for the war, right? I mean, how are they going to explain that one?

*Shepard lands at Turian homeworld*
Shepard: "Hey guys! The Reapers just wiped out Earth and obliterated or enslaved most of Humanity. Pretty sure you're up next."
Turians: "pfft, whatever man. Just get Garrus to do your dirty work like always and leave us alone."

*Shepard lands at Asari homeworld*
Shepard: "Hey guys! The Reapers just wiped out Earth and obliterated or enslaved most of Humanity. Pretty sure you're up next."
Asari: "eh, what?" *continue dancing with poles*

*Shepard lands at Salarian homeworld*
Shepard: "Hey guys! The Reapers just wiped out Earth and obliterated or enslaved most of Humanity. Pretty sure you're up next."
Salarians: "Genophage what? Yadda yadda ethical concerns yadda yadda."

*Shepard lands at Krogan homeworld*
Shepard: "Hey guys! The Reapers just wiped out Earth and obliterated or enslaved most of Humanity. Pretty sure you're up next."
Wrex: "Shepard."

Shepard: "Wow, you guys suck."

[kandrathe]

You'd think that alone would help get everyone else "ready" for the war, right? I mean, how are they going to explain that one?

You forgot...

*Shepard Fly's to the Quarian armada*
Shepard: "Hey guys! The Reapers just wiped out Earth and obliterated or enslaved most of Humanity. Pretty sure you're up next."
Quarian Admirals: "Go away you infection spreading barbarian."

[Wiccan]

We're now in the final stretch to close out the series, just 5 weeks till it's released. It looks like we get a combination crew of those that survived ME 1 and those that survived ME 2. Depending on who you sacrificed on Virmire, you could have a very, very large crew.

One of the aspects I'm looking forward to, and has been shown in some of the previews, is husks from other races. So far they've show Turian Husks and Krogan Husks (with the Turian Husks having the same coloration of Saren). I'm also looking forward to which races you can save and which ones you can let die (you are soooooo dead Batarians).

Something I hope they do in ME 3 is finally show what a Quarian looks like without the suit on. It would be nice to see what their faces actually look like. I've always like Tali and seeing how she grew between ME 1 and ME 2 and how she could be both strong and vulnerable was a real coup by BioWare for character writing.

So who else is chomping at the bit to get it installed and start playing through the storyline?

Sooooo... i just played the demo.!!

from the facebook app that you can get a advance code for the demo or the Normandy prop, don't let the uk tag fool you its for everyone. i just want to post this so that people can try it{ its currently for the xbox only atm}

and its completely random if you get a code and has 2 hour cd on the app but if you have multi accounts on face book you can keep doing it , it doesn't go by ip and you get 3 chances to press 4 data core in random patterns{ took me 2 days to get my demo code} MASS EFFECT 3 DEMO CHANCE
http://apps.facebook.com/xboxmasseffect/uk

[Wyrm]

If you couldn't tell, I'm not buying ME3 when it comes out. And I'm a huge fan of the first two games.

What he said.

I've lost interest in ME3 for pretty much the same reasons. I bought ME 1&2 via Steam only to find out I don't get any DLC unless I buy points through Origin and pay more than I would for a new game. Thanks to all the impulse buyers out there that have to have the latest and greatest yesterday, EA and Activision have learned that they can sell half-finished games for $60 and then throw DLC glitter at them and double the price.

My other big problem is the DRM. Origin. Blech. I do not want/need EA snooping around my computer, no thank you.

Also, Bioware quality doesn't mean anything anymore thanks to EA. EA is the private equity of the videogaming world; buy smaller companies, stripmine their IPs for cash, discard what's left.

[Jester]

Also, Bioware quality doesn't mean anything anymore thanks to EA. EA is the private equity of the videogaming world; buy smaller companies, stripmine their IPs for cash, discard what's left.

If you were a big fan of Mass Effect 2, does it not trouble your argument that it was entirely produced on EA's watch?

I'm not a big fan of EA either. But John Riccitiello seems to have done a fairly good job with the company. It's worth noting that he spent time at BioWare before moving back to EA.

DA2 obviously had its development cycle cut way short, and suffered badly for it. But other than that, I haven't noticed any serious slide. Some of BioWare's strongest games (ME2, for instance) were made on EA's watch.

-Jester

[Wyrm]

If you were a big fan of Mass Effect 2, does it not trouble your argument that it was entirely produced on EA's watch?

I enjoyed Mass Effect 2, don't get me wrong, but it was pretty easy to see the influence of EA on the game. A lot of the customizability that Bioware has normally included was gone, and it felt more like Gears of War than it did the first Mass Effect. EA also has the tendency to milk/bleed as much out of its customers as possible, evidenced by the absurd DLC prices. If you look at Bioware games before EA and after EA, you'll see a steep decrease in overall quality.

So, yes, I enjoyed Mass Effect 2 despite the fact that it could have been so much more had EA not been involved.

[Jester]

If you were a big fan of Mass Effect 2, does it not trouble your argument that it was entirely produced on EA's watch?

I enjoyed Mass Effect 2, don't get me wrong, but it was pretty easy to see the influence of EA on the game. A lot of the customizability that Bioware has normally included was gone, and it felt more like Gears of War than it did the first Mass Effect. EA also has the tendency to milk/bleed as much out of its customers as possible, evidenced by the absurd DLC prices. If you look at Bioware games before EA and after EA, you'll see a steep decrease in overall quality.

So, yes, I enjoyed Mass Effect 2 despite the fact that it could have been so much more had EA not been involved.

I think you're assuming causes that aren't necessarily the case. You've constructed a counter-factual out of wishful thinking - that somehow, there was a better, Bioware-driven ME2, that was messed up by EA's influence. I don't think you have any cause to believe that, except by the bluntest of reasoning. Do you actually know what impact EA has had at Bioware? Or are you just guessing, based on what you think about EA?

When I go back to ME1 and 2 (and I've finished both games more than once in the last two months), the thing that drives me craziest is the inventory in ME1. The customization is worth almost nothing in terms of gameplay, but takes enormous amounts of time. How much omni-gel do I need, exactly? Why do I need eight choices of manufacturer, distinguished only by a sliding bar of stats? A couple of choices of weapons plus ammo powers is a much more sensible way to approach the problem.

The shooter aspects play so much better in ME2, it's almost comical - if the way in which Mass Effect distinguishes itself from Gears of War is by having crappier shooting mechanics, then that's a terrible thing. And that's coming from someone who hates Gears of War, and loves Mass Effect.

I don't think you do see a steep decrease in overall quality. I think you see one low point - DA2 - and business as usual otherwise.

-Jester

[kandrathe]

I don't think you do see a steep decrease in overall quality. I think you see one low point - DA2 - and business as usual otherwise.

“Our game quality was down, and our costs were high. I could see a fundamental digital transformation coming to our industry that we were not even prepared for. The hardest part was that we were in deep denial.” -- John Riccitiello, CEO EA

I'm encouraged by the changes he's made and his vision. It's hard to turn that battle cruiser around, but in general the Bioware brand has thrived and expanded under his management.

[Taelas]

Dragon Age 2 was a disappointment on many levels, but it wasn't a bad game, really.

[Bolty]

Demo's out. Tried it last night.

I disliked how they sexualized Ashley (she's supposed to be tough, not a supermodel), Wrex's voice sounded wrong on more than one line, and the UI elements seemed too small at a high resolution ("where's my targeting reticule?"). Otherwise, it was thoroughly enjoyable, and the battle system was very similar to ME2. Anderson looked older, more haggard, as you'd expect him to.

They seem to use music less than in the previous ME games. There were long stretches without any music to set the tone, whereas music is almost a constant no matter where you are in ME1 and ME2.

[Jester]

I disliked how they sexualized Ashley (she's supposed to be tough, not a supermodel)...

No kidding. Ashley is one of my favourite characters from the whole series, and they seem to have gone in the wrong direction with her. I'll reserve judgement until I see the whole thing, but I don't like the redesign.

They seem to use music less than in the previous ME games. There were long stretches without any music to set the tone, whereas music is almost a constant no matter where you are in ME1 and ME2.

Just a guess, but I think music is one of the last things to be put into a game. They may still be developing parts of it, or assembled the demo before it was done.

-Jester