10-10-2005, 10:35 PM
Okay, to elaborate on this further:
You seem to think there's an overabundance of good daggers in the end game. I am of the mind that Blizzard really messed up dagger itemization. Here's my reasoning:
It starts in BRD. If you know to attack a mob that people wouldn't know to attack unless they were told ahead of time, or just really curious, you have a chance at Barman Shanker. Congratulations, you're done. Yep, that's it. Until you reach MC (or now Zul'Gurub) there's no dagger upgrade. Don't believe me?
LBRS - Keris of Zul'Serrak. Faster than Shanker, has the same annoying proc, and worse damage (since it's faster).
Scholomance - Specter's Blade. Basically same damage range as Shanker, faster. Therefore worse, unless you're fighting against undead. And let's not forget, it's freaking hard to get this weapon. You need either an epic-riding paladin or a crazy shaman.
Stratholme - Bonescraper. Strictly offhand weapon. Use it in main hand only to deliberately gimp yourself.
Dire Maul - Distracting Dagger. Defined 'Off Hand'.
UBRS - Nada.
There's all the instances. How about BGs?
Arathi Basin - Nada.
Warsong Gulch - Sentinel's Blade. 1.7 Speed is a deadzone for daggers. Nice stats, but still can't keep up in damage.
Alterac Valley - Glacial Blade/Electrified Dagger. This is a toss up. You lose yellow damage but gain white damage. Take out the proc and it makes it worth it over Shanker. Lobo is an upgrade, and rightly so. It's epic. Of course, many servers never see AV, so it's not a good argument to use.
Anything else? Heartseeker, forever stuck in 1.7 land. At lower attack powers it's better than some of these blues, but at highers it's worth much less.
Final list (in my opinion):
Glacial Blade
Barman Shanker
Specter's Blade
Keris of Zul'Serak
Heartseeker
Sentinel's Blade
So out of all these possibilities you're still left with a dagger from a level 54 instance. Note that I'm not arguing class balance / overall class damage or anything here. There is absolutely no item progression going on here. Since 60 is supposed to be a game of item progression instead of character progression, where is it?
Admittedly, 1.8 fixes one of my pet peeves and helps mitigate this problem by changing the way some instant attacks work. Damage Range is still the number one factor, but now overall dps matters more too. So how does it turn out?
Glacial Blade
Specter's Blade
Heartseeker - stats make it better than those below
Barman Shanker / Keris of Zul'Serak - near equal, both have annoying procs. I'd slightly take Keris because it's proc also lowers mob DPS, and has sligtly better white damage.
Sentinel's Blade - damage range still lacking, but a much closer last now.
So you still don't have a clear upgrade that's a straight drop. It is much, much better after the patch. But Glacial Blade and Specter's Blade are either really hard or impossible to get, and Heartseeker is cost prohibitive. There's only one dagger on that entire list that's from an "end game instance" and it's just about equal to the farmable dagger still.
You seem to think there's an overabundance of good daggers in the end game. I am of the mind that Blizzard really messed up dagger itemization. Here's my reasoning:
It starts in BRD. If you know to attack a mob that people wouldn't know to attack unless they were told ahead of time, or just really curious, you have a chance at Barman Shanker. Congratulations, you're done. Yep, that's it. Until you reach MC (or now Zul'Gurub) there's no dagger upgrade. Don't believe me?
LBRS - Keris of Zul'Serrak. Faster than Shanker, has the same annoying proc, and worse damage (since it's faster).
Scholomance - Specter's Blade. Basically same damage range as Shanker, faster. Therefore worse, unless you're fighting against undead. And let's not forget, it's freaking hard to get this weapon. You need either an epic-riding paladin or a crazy shaman.
Stratholme - Bonescraper. Strictly offhand weapon. Use it in main hand only to deliberately gimp yourself.
Dire Maul - Distracting Dagger. Defined 'Off Hand'.
UBRS - Nada.
There's all the instances. How about BGs?
Arathi Basin - Nada.
Warsong Gulch - Sentinel's Blade. 1.7 Speed is a deadzone for daggers. Nice stats, but still can't keep up in damage.
Alterac Valley - Glacial Blade/Electrified Dagger. This is a toss up. You lose yellow damage but gain white damage. Take out the proc and it makes it worth it over Shanker. Lobo is an upgrade, and rightly so. It's epic. Of course, many servers never see AV, so it's not a good argument to use.
Anything else? Heartseeker, forever stuck in 1.7 land. At lower attack powers it's better than some of these blues, but at highers it's worth much less.
Final list (in my opinion):
Glacial Blade
Barman Shanker
Specter's Blade
Keris of Zul'Serak
Heartseeker
Sentinel's Blade
So out of all these possibilities you're still left with a dagger from a level 54 instance. Note that I'm not arguing class balance / overall class damage or anything here. There is absolutely no item progression going on here. Since 60 is supposed to be a game of item progression instead of character progression, where is it?
Admittedly, 1.8 fixes one of my pet peeves and helps mitigate this problem by changing the way some instant attacks work. Damage Range is still the number one factor, but now overall dps matters more too. So how does it turn out?
Glacial Blade
Specter's Blade
Heartseeker - stats make it better than those below
Barman Shanker / Keris of Zul'Serak - near equal, both have annoying procs. I'd slightly take Keris because it's proc also lowers mob DPS, and has sligtly better white damage.
Sentinel's Blade - damage range still lacking, but a much closer last now.
So you still don't have a clear upgrade that's a straight drop. It is much, much better after the patch. But Glacial Blade and Specter's Blade are either really hard or impossible to get, and Heartseeker is cost prohibitive. There's only one dagger on that entire list that's from an "end game instance" and it's just about equal to the farmable dagger still.
Trade yourself in for the perfect one. No one needs to know that you feel you've been ruined!