06-07-2013, 09:18 PM
(This post was last modified: 06-07-2013, 09:49 PM by FireIceTalon.)
[quote='Hammerskjold' pid='206591' dateline='1370628052']
[quote]
Impossible, since religions presuppose a belief in the supernatural, and have a specific set/system of values and doctrines.
[/quote]
A magical belief in Marx and Hegelian Diuretics will cure all that is wrong in the world.
A lack of self awareness and monomaniacal belief that everyone else's viewpoint is always wrong, but I'm always right.
Oh woe is me, my everflowing tears of impotent rage will cease if only the proles\non-believers will see The True Way.
Yep. Night, and Day.
[quote]
I don't go around in real life spouting my atheist (or Marxist for that matter) views to people. If I'm in a social setting and it comes up in discussion, fine, but I don't seek out people to go and preach to.
[/quote]
Even though I have you on ignore and haven't replied to one of your idiotic (and unwitty) diatribes in like well, oh over a year, I feel this post warrants a reply.
First off, no one said anything about Marx and Hegelian Dialectics (not to mention Marx was highly critical of Hegelian Dialects, but aye, that is another topic), nor did anyone say they are the be all end all cure of the world. You brought that up, and YOU put the words in my mouth, because you, as usual, want to make assumptions and change what things mean so it fits YOUR narrow view of the world. Or maybe you just want to be intellectually dishonest? I don't know....
But now that you brought it up, no, it isn't the same. Marxism and its materialist interpretation of the world may or may not be right - I view it as the most logical and rational way of understanding the world in a physical and material way that can be observed. It makes the most sense to me, thus why I am a Marxist. Again, it may or may not be the correct view - I'm not dogmatic enough to say one way or the other - I will leave such rigid thinking to religious nut jobs, who claim it was all figured out and predestined 14 billion years ago (or, according to some of them, 6000 years ago give or take). But either way, that doesn't matter so much. What DOES matter is this: Marx and Engels at least made a serious attempt to understand the laws of motion that govern historical development and how social relationships function in a particular mode of production by analyzing the material conditions of society. They were fascinated with capitalism and its social relations, as well as with human nature in general, and wanted to know and understand it as full as possible. Religion (especially Christianity), on the other hand, is dogmatic and says basically "god created the world and man, it never changes, man is inherently selfish and sinful by nature, and will always live in estrangement" - so according to most religious zealots, we all just may as well kill ourselves now just like Jim Jones told us to do so
It offers NO material explanation of the world and how it works, or of human nature, because it relies on the faith that some great deity oversees all our thoughts and actions and that most of us are destined to chaotic pits of fire land, and a divine few of us get to go to the promised land and chill with The Great Invisible Man (those who subjugate themselves as slaves to HIS/HER worldview). Gee, how convenient At least Marxism makes a honest attempt (whether it is right or wrong), which is far more than I can say for any religion.
You equating Marxism with a religion (especially when they are based on fundamentally opposing philosophies - materialism and idealism) just shows how intellectually brain dead, shallow minded, and simplistic your thought process is. It doesn't matter which one is right or not.
I have a lack of self-awareness? Right, because having class consciousness is the ultimate lack of self awareness. At this point, I'm beginning to think you aren't even a troll, and actually a complete buffoon, and part of me regrets taking 5 mins out of my life to respond to you. Oh well.
[quote]
Impossible, since religions presuppose a belief in the supernatural, and have a specific set/system of values and doctrines.
[/quote]
A magical belief in Marx and Hegelian Diuretics will cure all that is wrong in the world.
A lack of self awareness and monomaniacal belief that everyone else's viewpoint is always wrong, but I'm always right.
Oh woe is me, my everflowing tears of impotent rage will cease if only the proles\non-believers will see The True Way.
Yep. Night, and Day.
[quote]
I don't go around in real life spouting my atheist (or Marxist for that matter) views to people. If I'm in a social setting and it comes up in discussion, fine, but I don't seek out people to go and preach to.
[/quote]
Even though I have you on ignore and haven't replied to one of your idiotic (and unwitty) diatribes in like well, oh over a year, I feel this post warrants a reply.
First off, no one said anything about Marx and Hegelian Dialectics (not to mention Marx was highly critical of Hegelian Dialects, but aye, that is another topic), nor did anyone say they are the be all end all cure of the world. You brought that up, and YOU put the words in my mouth, because you, as usual, want to make assumptions and change what things mean so it fits YOUR narrow view of the world. Or maybe you just want to be intellectually dishonest? I don't know....
But now that you brought it up, no, it isn't the same. Marxism and its materialist interpretation of the world may or may not be right - I view it as the most logical and rational way of understanding the world in a physical and material way that can be observed. It makes the most sense to me, thus why I am a Marxist. Again, it may or may not be the correct view - I'm not dogmatic enough to say one way or the other - I will leave such rigid thinking to religious nut jobs, who claim it was all figured out and predestined 14 billion years ago (or, according to some of them, 6000 years ago give or take). But either way, that doesn't matter so much. What DOES matter is this: Marx and Engels at least made a serious attempt to understand the laws of motion that govern historical development and how social relationships function in a particular mode of production by analyzing the material conditions of society. They were fascinated with capitalism and its social relations, as well as with human nature in general, and wanted to know and understand it as full as possible. Religion (especially Christianity), on the other hand, is dogmatic and says basically "god created the world and man, it never changes, man is inherently selfish and sinful by nature, and will always live in estrangement" - so according to most religious zealots, we all just may as well kill ourselves now just like Jim Jones told us to do so
It offers NO material explanation of the world and how it works, or of human nature, because it relies on the faith that some great deity oversees all our thoughts and actions and that most of us are destined to chaotic pits of fire land, and a divine few of us get to go to the promised land and chill with The Great Invisible Man (those who subjugate themselves as slaves to HIS/HER worldview). Gee, how convenient At least Marxism makes a honest attempt (whether it is right or wrong), which is far more than I can say for any religion.You equating Marxism with a religion (especially when they are based on fundamentally opposing philosophies - materialism and idealism) just shows how intellectually brain dead, shallow minded, and simplistic your thought process is. It doesn't matter which one is right or not.
I have a lack of self-awareness? Right, because having class consciousness is the ultimate lack of self awareness
. At this point, I'm beginning to think you aren't even a troll, and actually a complete buffoon, and part of me regrets taking 5 mins out of my life to respond to you. Oh well.
https://www.youtube.com/user/FireIceTalon
"Your very ideas are but the outgrowth of conditions of your bourgeois production and bourgeois property, just as your jurisprudence is but the will of your class, made into law for all, a will whose essential character and direction are determined by the economic conditions of the existence of your class." - Marx (addressing the bourgeois)
"Your very ideas are but the outgrowth of conditions of your bourgeois production and bourgeois property, just as your jurisprudence is but the will of your class, made into law for all, a will whose essential character and direction are determined by the economic conditions of the existence of your class." - Marx (addressing the bourgeois)