Goodbye Twinkies.

[FireIceTalon]

Again, capitalism, not unions, is the problem. Unions exist because capitalism does, in an attempt (if a futile one) to give the workers some protection.

It was purely on Hostess, because the profits for the multi-gazillionaire CEO's and shareholders of Hostess are more important than the table scraps the employees get, in a capitalist system. Unions have little relevance here in the big picture of things, because they too, like governments, are subservient to the interests of private capital.

You don't get rid of the unions or the welfare state, you get rid of the material conditions that cause and necessitate them in the first place: capitalism. Much in the same way you don't try to cure cancer with pain killers.

where did i say get rid of unions?
and where did i say capitalism had no part in this?
in fact i stated it was due in part to capitalism and the changing economy.

but in this case it WAS the union that was stubborn and did not accept the plan that would keep jobs.
and now that the plant is closed, the union wants the deal.

you can defend the union all you want, but no matter what you say, nothing can change the fact that in this case, it is the union that is at fault. not completely, but they are far from blameless.
it was a 8% pay cut. if you make $30.00/hr it would cut you to $27.60/hr
sounds HORRIBLE doesnt it?
how does unemployment sound?
there was also a 20% increase in benefits cost. would you rather that or the 100%+ that you now have to pay if you were an employee?

right, i forgot, the strike was all due to capitalism and nothing to do with the union not accepting a deal that would keep 18k+ jobs for union members, as well as the other union employees, non union employees, as well as all of their suppliers that may need to cut back now.

I'm not defending unions, I like them about as much as I like welfare states, borders, governments or other instruments of class based systems (which isn't very much, in case you didn't know). I am attacking capitalism, which more working people need to start doing if they know what's good for them.

Blaming unions here is just parroting right-wing propaganda, but has little basis to reality - it's like blaming Chinese workers for outsourcing of American jobs. You are having difficulty distinguishing between cause and symptom it seems. It's time for people to stop scapegoating other workers (union or non-union, domestic or foreign), immigrants, politicians, and start looking at the reality of the system they live in, and recognize who their true oppressors are. Workers shouldn't have to choose between ANY pay cut or unemployment to begin with, because of the social relationships that result from private property. It isn't due to capitalism in part, it is due to capitalism entirely, and its volatile processes.

Bottomline: The livelihood and dignity of people is important. The maximization of profits for private CEO's and shareholders is NOT. Not in the least bit.