Maastricht Treaty revisions needed?

[Taelas]

First, they're EU citizens. That means they can go practically anywhere in Europe to live and work. Prefer the UK? Italy? Spain? Poland? Take your pick.

Which is probably worse, right? All the same taxes, with none of the benefits.

I don't see where you come to that conclusion.

Second, nobody is forcing them to work, nor earn any given amount of income (which, by the by, is exactly what serfdom forces). If they want to be slackers and work at a cafe somewhere, getting by on as little as possible, that's their prerogative. If even that amount of tax is too much, then move elsewhere.

Right. The costs of most everything in Denmark are about triple what they are here in the US. Starvation is always an option, but I guess you only have to pay about 8% tax on the first 41000 DKK you earn.

I have no concept of what things cost outside of Denmark (aside from books and computer games, anyway), but triple sounds completely off the wall.

A homecooked meal costs equivalent to 10-20 USD for 6-8 people. My rent costs just over 450 USD a month (for a very crappy one-room apartment).

Third, if they have sufficient wealth, they can live without working just fine. I'm not sure Denmark is exactly where you'd want to hold a gigantic bank account, but if you did, you wouldn't have to worry about income taxes.

If you have sufficient wealth, then no, you wouldn't be a semi-serf within the welfare state. So, no, there is not the same feudal land lord, per se., but the level of freedom and taxation is similiar, which is why I said semi-serf. Because the serf was required to work so many days of the week on the lords land, before he worked his own small parcel. Then, there was the Christmas goose.

There are other ways of living without working. We are a welfare state, after all.

If the standard you're holding countries up to is a place where you can live without working, that's crazy. There is no such place on this ball of rock, and there wouldn't be even if governments collected no taxes whatsoever. But the ways in which you can opt out of any particular tax (by moving, by not earning, by not spending) are much the same in Denmark as anywhere else. The only difference is the rate of collection, which is determined democratically by the elected representatives of the Danes. It's not going to get much less oppressive than that.

I'm not saying one should be able to live without earning, but to have the State take the majority of your earnings in income, and VAT is crazy as well. You have to remember that here in the US, the revolution began when we tossed the tea into the harbor AFTER Britain removed the taxes from all the other products, and that tax was only 1%. You want to talk crazy? Let's look at Latvia.

You have to remember the benefits we get. We don't pay for hospital care (though if you want super-specialized treatment, you might have to go elsewhere). We don't pay for college (and are in fact paid by the government to go to college, to pay for rent and other day-to-day necessities).

That is a large part of the reason for our high income tax.

I'm not saying one should be able to live without earning, but to have the State take the majority of your earnings in income, and VAT is crazy as well. You have to remember that here in the US, the revolution began when we tossed the tea into the harbor AFTER Britain removed the taxes from all the other products, and that tax was only 1%.

Wait a moment. I don't think the amount of the tax had much to do with the revolution at all. We broke with King George for imposing taxes on us without our consent.

If the Danish subjects are being taxed without their consent, or consent of their legislature, then maybe they need to speak to Margrethe.

Heh, Margrethe has absolutely no legal power. Well, she could make up a law and legalize it (the only power she has is legalizing laws, though this is only a formality), but then she'd get kicked out of office before the law was ever put into effect.

Not that it matters, since it is entirely with our consent (no matter how much individuals might grumble).