04-17-2008, 09:51 PM
Quote:Not every woman is opposed to a patriarchical social model. Why would you assume that all women are?
Some are very comfortable with their role in such a set up. I am unwilling to buy into the imbedded assumption in your remark. I am also leary of applying this meme of "mind control" as an explanation for adherence, or buy in, to such roles.
You have totally gone out to left field on misinterpreting my remarks. As the saying goes, "Projecting much?".:)
I made no such sweeping generalizations about a patriarchal model. In fact, I didn't even mention it. I didn't even imply or base any conclusions on it. It's all you, bud.
However, since you've obviously missed what I'm saying, let me try to clarify it for you.
My original statement was "My position is that the emotional control the FLDS has over these women is so strong that this is not a valid metric." I was referring to the fact that most of the adult women had returned to the compound, and rebutting your conclusion that this was a sign the conditions were not bad.
To expand, the conditions may be very, very bad, but they could view returning as the best option because:
1. They are intentionally deprived of news from outside the compound, so any relative informed judgement is impossible.
2. The outside world is continually demonized, again tilting the balance. Outside information is pre-judged to be wrong.
3. They are taught from birth that their place in the culture is a subservient one.
4. In their experience, there is no second authority. Decisions are unchallengable, and not their job.
5. They are conditioned to practices that make them feel different or better than outsiders. They are told they are a privileged elite. They dress differently and speak differently, so on occasions when they do interact with nonmembers, they are greeted with some adverse reactions.
6. They are faced with ample fears that limit their behavior
6a: The fear of being ejected from the community. They have no friends, allies or contacts outside the FLDS.
6b: The fear of losing their status in the community.
6c: The fear of losing their immortal soul, since only FLDS members are saved.
6d: The fear of outsiders in general.
So based on what they believe to be true, returning to the compound is a rational choice even in the worst case, even if abuse is prevalent. No need to call them brainwashed or mind-controlled. They are information-starved.
This applies in a patriarchal model, a matriarchal model, just about any model you can think of that imposes a sole source of authority. The fact that the FLDS organizes patriarchally only defines one underclass; indeed, all of the above applies to the men, too.