10-19-2007, 10:17 PM
I think the problem with AV, when it comes to the drawn out turtles, is mostly due to the graveyard rez and flag cap design not fitting well in AV. As Skan pointed out, you have to eradicate all defenders to capture a flag; and not just eradicate them all, but eradicate them all for 10 seconds. When it's a 40v40 like the AVs of the past, this becomes somewhat impossible, requiring mass dominance (premade vs pug) or a fluke.
Let's examine the rez/cap mechanic as it works in AB, and how it doesn't work in AV.
In AB, everyone starts off without any bases capped. Thus, the game starts fair in the beginning from a reinforcements perspective, which gives neither side a turtling ability. Additionally, once bases are capped and turtling is enabled, the name of the game is then defense - not offense. AB is also non-linear, which allows pugs especially to be disorganized enough to give up on one base and take another (the musical chairs syndrome). Lastly, AB involves a lot less players - and even less at each base - which diminishes the probability of someone you kill getting lucky and catching the respawn immediately, giving them just enough time to run back and tap the capper.
AV, however, is a very different game design, and yet attempts (and fails) to use the same exact ressurection and flag capping mechanics.
The ressurection mechanics for AV encourage turtling, period. And they do so VERY strongly. I haven't timed the time it takes to ride from one GY to the next, but I'd guess it's something around 30 seconds on an epic mount. The average time to ressurect after death at a GY is more along the lines of 17 seconds. So, the offensive force get reinforcements after ~47s, while the defensive force get reinforcements after ~17s. This is not only significant in and of itself, it's significant in relation to the 30 seconds it takes to drink.
Ressurection at a GY is also very random. In AV's current design, this is to the great advantage of any large defensive force. In the time it takes to eradicate a force of 40 players, there's a strong chance that some of the players that were killed will catch the respawn just in time to get an instant rez - and run right over to the flag capper and tag them.
The objective of the game is to push past defensive map points, and ultimately get to the main base of the opposing faction. This is obviously in sharp contrast to what the rez/cap system encourage.
The flag capping mechanic could be fixed in one of two ways. Either the GY ressurections could be derandomized, or it could be changed to an EotS style mechanic.
Fixing the GY rez times may not be as cut and dry. I've mulled over several ideas, including a system similar to the world ressurections - the more you rez, the more time you have to wait between rezzes. Or simply increases the rez times significantly. Or increasing the rez times slightly, but de-randomizing them, for example, when you die you'd gain a debuff that'd count down x seconds, at which point you'd rez, instead of the GY rezzers having their own universal timer.
Let's examine the rez/cap mechanic as it works in AB, and how it doesn't work in AV.
In AB, everyone starts off without any bases capped. Thus, the game starts fair in the beginning from a reinforcements perspective, which gives neither side a turtling ability. Additionally, once bases are capped and turtling is enabled, the name of the game is then defense - not offense. AB is also non-linear, which allows pugs especially to be disorganized enough to give up on one base and take another (the musical chairs syndrome). Lastly, AB involves a lot less players - and even less at each base - which diminishes the probability of someone you kill getting lucky and catching the respawn immediately, giving them just enough time to run back and tap the capper.
AV, however, is a very different game design, and yet attempts (and fails) to use the same exact ressurection and flag capping mechanics.
The ressurection mechanics for AV encourage turtling, period. And they do so VERY strongly. I haven't timed the time it takes to ride from one GY to the next, but I'd guess it's something around 30 seconds on an epic mount. The average time to ressurect after death at a GY is more along the lines of 17 seconds. So, the offensive force get reinforcements after ~47s, while the defensive force get reinforcements after ~17s. This is not only significant in and of itself, it's significant in relation to the 30 seconds it takes to drink.
Ressurection at a GY is also very random. In AV's current design, this is to the great advantage of any large defensive force. In the time it takes to eradicate a force of 40 players, there's a strong chance that some of the players that were killed will catch the respawn just in time to get an instant rez - and run right over to the flag capper and tag them.
The objective of the game is to push past defensive map points, and ultimately get to the main base of the opposing faction. This is obviously in sharp contrast to what the rez/cap system encourage.
The flag capping mechanic could be fixed in one of two ways. Either the GY ressurections could be derandomized, or it could be changed to an EotS style mechanic.
Fixing the GY rez times may not be as cut and dry. I've mulled over several ideas, including a system similar to the world ressurections - the more you rez, the more time you have to wait between rezzes. Or simply increases the rez times significantly. Or increasing the rez times slightly, but de-randomizing them, for example, when you die you'd gain a debuff that'd count down x seconds, at which point you'd rez, instead of the GY rezzers having their own universal timer.
Less QQ more Pew Pew