09-05-2007, 02:55 PM
Personally, I think the guy is an idiot for pulling this sort of thing when he had people waiting on him and it sounded like he had much better things to be doing. Also, the guy could certainly have taken pretty mild mitigating actions (letting them look at his recipt, cooperating more with the police, etc) that would have prevented the incident from happening. That said, I do not think that the officer or store personnel are at all innocent in creating the situation.
First, I sympathize with the stores about wanting to try and prevent theft, particularly in electronics stores where very small things are often very expensive. However, it seems to me that following someone out of your store and preventing a car from driving away is not a good policy. It seems that obstructing a car (both in front and behind) should be illegal. If you had a similar situation with a group of gangsters or other hoodlums, it would certainly put a different light on the situation. A better plan for the employees would probably have been to get the license plate number and then go back inside to talk to the checkers and figure out if he had actually come from the registers. Since it sounds like he did, I imagine this situation would have just ended there.
Second, it really sounds like the police officer did not understand the laws he was trying to enforce. He seemed to think that there was a law that requires anyone to give him ID, but it sounds like that is not the case. The charges they brought the guy up on are very weak. If you read the section the guy quoted in the blog, the section requires both that the person not have the privilege to obstruct an officer (which this guy did not) AND be doing so "with purpose to prevent, obstruct or delay the performance" of the officer. The second part is where I think the charges will fall through. It sounds like the guy was perfectly willing to provide information, he just felt he was not required to provide a license just because the officer asks (and it sounds like he didn't since they didn't bring him up on those sorts of charges).
It also seems that there are things that Circuit City could do, as a store, that would prevent ever needing to engage in questionable actions like obstructing cars such as setting up the registers in full view of the exit (so the guys can see anyone who pays and immediately goes to leave), giving some way to prevent people from leaving (perhaps a lock on the sliding doors that is accessible to the recipt checkers) or any other engineered solution.
The one big question this leaves in my mind is whether or not it IS legal for stores to require that you let them search your bags and whether they are allowed to restrain you if you do not comply. It doesn't seem like a big deal to have people check recipts, but it DOES seem like the consequences of refusing are very much on the shady side of business.
So overall, I think the guy was being an idiot in how he chose to assert his rights. However, it sucks to get put through so much stuff if you were in the right, all along, so if it turns out that he was right in his interpretation of the laws, I would hope that the guy sticks it to the store and police since it sounds like they were being stupid as well. I also hope he never has any kids because we don't need any more whiny morons running around in this country. :)
First, I sympathize with the stores about wanting to try and prevent theft, particularly in electronics stores where very small things are often very expensive. However, it seems to me that following someone out of your store and preventing a car from driving away is not a good policy. It seems that obstructing a car (both in front and behind) should be illegal. If you had a similar situation with a group of gangsters or other hoodlums, it would certainly put a different light on the situation. A better plan for the employees would probably have been to get the license plate number and then go back inside to talk to the checkers and figure out if he had actually come from the registers. Since it sounds like he did, I imagine this situation would have just ended there.
Second, it really sounds like the police officer did not understand the laws he was trying to enforce. He seemed to think that there was a law that requires anyone to give him ID, but it sounds like that is not the case. The charges they brought the guy up on are very weak. If you read the section the guy quoted in the blog, the section requires both that the person not have the privilege to obstruct an officer (which this guy did not) AND be doing so "with purpose to prevent, obstruct or delay the performance" of the officer. The second part is where I think the charges will fall through. It sounds like the guy was perfectly willing to provide information, he just felt he was not required to provide a license just because the officer asks (and it sounds like he didn't since they didn't bring him up on those sorts of charges).
It also seems that there are things that Circuit City could do, as a store, that would prevent ever needing to engage in questionable actions like obstructing cars such as setting up the registers in full view of the exit (so the guys can see anyone who pays and immediately goes to leave), giving some way to prevent people from leaving (perhaps a lock on the sliding doors that is accessible to the recipt checkers) or any other engineered solution.
The one big question this leaves in my mind is whether or not it IS legal for stores to require that you let them search your bags and whether they are allowed to restrain you if you do not comply. It doesn't seem like a big deal to have people check recipts, but it DOES seem like the consequences of refusing are very much on the shady side of business.
So overall, I think the guy was being an idiot in how he chose to assert his rights. However, it sucks to get put through so much stuff if you were in the right, all along, so if it turns out that he was right in his interpretation of the laws, I would hope that the guy sticks it to the store and police since it sounds like they were being stupid as well. I also hope he never has any kids because we don't need any more whiny morons running around in this country. :)
-TheDragoon