Question about the Diablo Universe

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Question about the Diablo Universe - Fragbait - 06-18-2003

Hail fellow lurkers,

Supposing that Unique Items with incredible strong powers must have been owned or forged by outstanding personalities,too,
I was wondering who Naj and Aguinara are? They'd have to be talented and potent magicians, I guess.
Messerschmidt and Schaefer must be great warriors.
Civerb and Arkaine must have had interesting lives, too... And who is 'The Overlord' ?
I'm pretty interested in any infos you can come up with. Perhaps there are even stories and essays out there, written by Diablo Fans and contributing to the overall gloomy ambiance (of Diablo I, that is; I have a strong feeling that Diablo II does not contribute much to it, and logically contradicts Diablo I in some parts, especially concerning the power of some unique items).
I'd really like to read about these persons / the universe itself.
I'm agog to learn what you know.

Greetings, Fragbait

Question about the Diablo Universe - Yogi_Baar - 06-18-2003

Fragbait,Jun 18 2003, 09:02 AM Wrote:I have a strong feeling that Diablo II does not contribute much to it, and logically contradicts Diablo I in some parts, especially concerning the power of some unique items

Well I haven't played DII much, but from what I could discern from people who have, is that the uniques (most, all?) are much more powerful there. Which, IMHO, is good. I mean, most of uniques in Diablo 1 are worthless, and are only useful in IronMan games and for variant characters. Some are useless even for IronMan. So I think it's quite OK for DII to tweak the uniques up a bit.

Question about the Diablo Universe - Fragbait - 06-18-2003

Hail Yogi Baar,

I don't think so. While there are very powerful DII items, that's for sure, there are also so many Uniques that they are not really rare anymore. This depredates themselves from their main aspect: being rare and strong or somewhat odd, so that players actually appreciate finding them. They would have to create a triumphant and simultaneously enigmatic feeling, but in DII, you generally find them, screenshot them and sell them / throw them in your stash.
And items were powerful back in DI, too, you just have to see them in the right context.
Messerschmidts Reaver for example did huge damage, compared to normal DI values, not DII:

Messerschmidt's Reaver [edited]

Uniques that give skill boni are much more valuable when there are very few that only give very slight boni:

Dreamflange [edited]
Aguinara's Hatchet [edited]
Naj's Light Plate [edited]
Thinking Cap [edited]

Furthermore, there are the Cruels in DII, which are very powerful and often outrule the uniques. Plus the 40%ed/15%ias charms are magical, too.
It is clear that you cannot exactly compare DI and DII, but I feel that the ambiance of DiabloII/LoD is nowhere near the gloomy atmosphere of Diablo. The mythical books that can be found in the levels alone create such a dense feeling of uncanniness, it fascinates me everytime. It may very well be that DiabloII is the 'better' game with somewhat perfected features, but if you want that gloomy and uncanny feeling, better pick DiabloI.
Just my 2 cents.

Greetings, Fragbait

Edit: Forgot to mention what I actually wanted to say. With "and logically contradicts Diablo I in some parts, especially concerning the power of some unique items", I meant that some Uniques in DiabloII that already were there in DiabloI are significantly weaker if seen in the whole context. I may mention Griswold's Edge and Undead Crown.
Doesn't it also seem weird, that in ONE Diablo Universe, Unique Items with the same name can have totally different attributes within 2 games(DiabloI and DiabloII), or even within one game(Azurewrath in DiabloII)?

Edit2: Agreed. I don't have to list the attributes of the uniques.

Question about the Diablo Universe - Jane - 06-18-2003

What I have been wondering?
How did Wirt loose his leg?
Did he sell it to monsters to get sweet deals?

Question about the Diablo Universe - Cytrex - 06-18-2003

I do believe Wirt lost his leg in the dungeons. If you chat with Pepin, he sometimes tells how he saved Wirt but it he couldn't save his leg(or something along these lines). My memory is qetting fuzzy too.

Question about the Diablo Universe - Jane - 06-18-2003

I should have remembered that :unsure:

Question about the Diablo Universe - Yogi_Baar - 06-18-2003

Fragbait,Jun 18 2003, 10:35 AM Wrote:While there are very powerful DII items, that's for sure, there are also so many Uniques that they are not really rare anymore.

And uniques in Diablo are? If you go and check Jarulf's Guide, you'll notice that the rarest uniques are usually the pitiful ones - if 200% dmg vs demons worked on bows, then Deadly Hunter would be the prize of all prizes for rogues, as things are now, it's not. I have found lots and lots of instances of uniques you mentioned in your post - they're quite common you know, "not really rare" as you put it. If you had mentioned the Staff of Shadows, Sharp Beak or something of that sort, now THAT is rare.

BTW, you didn't have to list the unique stats here, most Diablo players (including me) know exactly what TC, DF, NLP and other good uniques do. Oh, and also, I find Aguinara's Hatchet a joke. IMHO, if you had to go for a two-handed unique with a +spell levels, you should've chosen Mindcry.

And also, the only enigmatic feeling I get from most uniques in Diablo is - "why the hell did they bother with this crap?" Mainly when I get a Black Razor from Butcher. A long sword of vitality with 5 durability? No thanks.

Maybe I'll think different when I start playing DII more.

Question about the Diablo Universe - LemmingofGlory - 06-18-2003

Quote:I do believe Wirt lost his leg in the dungeons. If you chat with Pepin, he sometimes tells how he saved Wirt but it he couldn't save his leg(or something along these lines).

Griswold's to blame for Wirt's continued breathing. Gris yanked Wirt out of the dungeon after monsters took his leg. Then Gris carted Wirt over to Pepin who kept the boy alive, but the healer couldn't save his leg.

[o: *LEMMING* :o]

Question about the Diablo Universe - LemmingofGlory - 06-18-2003

Quote:I was wondering who Naj and Aguinara are? They'd have to be talented and potent magicians, I guess.

Nobody rightly knows. NLP has a Holy Defender/Blackoak Shield for a beltbuckle, but that's about as close as we get to any identifying marks.

But I contest your assertion that Aguinara was a talented magician. I believe Aguinara was retarded or insane. No lucid mage would do that to an axe.

Quote:Messerschmidt and Schaefer must be great warriors. Civerb and Arkaine must have had interesting lives, too... And who is 'The Overlord' ?

Great warrior? Pfft, Messerschmidt learned the folly of his ways the first time he took his axe for a spin in Hell/Hell.

I suspect Schaefer's Hammer is named after either Erich Schaefer or Max Schaefer. Civerb's Cudgel is probably named after either Peter or David Brevik.

"OverLord's Helm" doesn't contain "The," so it could refer to any generic overlord.

As for Arkaine, ask the townies about him! :p

Quote:I'm pretty interested in any infos you can come up with. Perhaps there are even stories and essays out there, written by Diablo Fans and contributing to the overall gloomy ambiance

Certain variants assign importance to certain uniques. Check the Goth and the Amazon.

Quote:I have a strong feeling that Diablo II does not contribute much to it, and logically contradicts Diablo I in some parts, especially concerning the power of some unique items.

The biggest contradiction that comes to mind is Cathan. D1 manual pg 45 mentions Cathan as a "devout priest who was also a fierce warrior." (He invented Holy Bolt.) In D2, however, the Cathan set items are *sorceress* items. :p

Hey, how come you didn't mention Rod of Onan? :p

[o: *LEMMING* :o]

Question about the Diablo Universe - Rhydderch Hael - 06-18-2003

Yogi_Baar,Jun 18 2003, 09:45 AM Wrote:... Mainly when I get a Black Razor from Butcher. A long sword of vitality with 5 durability? No thanks. ...

Black Razor's a dagger. The 5 Dur longsword's Ice Shank, is it not?

Question about the Diablo Universe - the Langolier - 06-18-2003

I think the unique item system in D1 is far superior to uniques in D2. There are far fewer good uniques in D1 than D2, and this is a good thing. I hate when I look at some of my D2 characters and they are virtually dressed in nothing but gold items. D1 has a great balance of useful magical items versus useful unique items.

Of course that black razor can't be the godliest item of them all, it dropped from the butcher (not only a low level monster, but low level characters have access to him as well). If you are trying to see good use in the end game for all uniques, you are looking at it the wrong way. My mage found the immolator after killing the butcher just after getting to dlvl 2. 4-8 fire damage in the dungeons, yes please! He went mostly melee nearly until dlvl 4. Or how about all those Ring of Engagements you get from Lazarus' chamber - mostly useless, true. But a Ring of Engagement at clevel 15, don't mind if I do! This is exactly how unique items were meant to be. When you happen to find one that matches your level, it is a great aid when you do even though you will eventually grow out of it.

Then of course, there are the few extremely useful uniques that everybody has. +1 to skills, +50 to mana, +30 to magic on a *one-handed weapon*!? Holy smokes! 40 AC, +40 to mana, +10 to all attributes on a crown with (inherent) *no strength requirement*!? Sign me up! These are a few of the high-end uniques that don't make uniques as a whole worthless in the end game. Sure, you will eventually have them all, but look for any specific one in the dungeons and you will see they don't exactly grow on trees.

Question about the Diablo Universe - Hammerskjold - 06-18-2003

>But I contest your assertion that Aguinara was a talented magician. I believe Aguinara was retarded or insane. No lucid mage would do that to an axe.

I thought Aguinara was a she, specifically the female assistant to Zhar the Mad Magician.

>Messerschmidt and Schaefer must be great warriors. Civerb and Arkaine must have had interesting lives, too... And who is 'The Overlord' ?

>Great warrior? Pfft, Messerschmidt learned the folly of his ways the first time he took his axe for a spin in Hell/Hell.

Well the spelling is slighly different, but Messerschmidt was definitely a Fighter. Here's some pictures, brief history, and some stats.

http://www.aviation-history.com/messerschm...hmitt/bf109.htm

Though some players who found the Messy (Axe) to be wanting in H\Hell, might say it was based on this one instead.

http://www.aviation-history.com/messerschm...mitt/bf110.html

Question about the Diablo Universe - LemmingofGlory - 06-19-2003

I always thought of "Aguinara" as a "she" also, but I don't recall any references to her in-game. How do you tie her to Zhar?

[o: *LEMMING* :o]

Question about the Diablo Universe - LemmingofGlory - 06-19-2003

Yogi meant Black Razor does approximately the same damage as a Long Sword. In essence, Black Razor's a Long Sword of Vitality with really crappy dur.

Both Black Razor (Dagger) and Ice Shank (Long Sword) have "Altered Durability"; Shank has 15 and Razor has 5.

[o: *LEMMING* :o]

Question about the Diablo Universe - Zyr - 06-19-2003

Check "The Hisory (sic) of Naj -- The Amazonian Annals by Charisena, Queen of the Bhagwalli" at http://www.geocities.com/daslonghorn/najnew.html ...

And there are some first-rate dark and gloomy tales at http://www.realmsbeyond.net/diablo/tales.html -- enjoy!

Question about the Diablo Universe - Hammerskjold - 06-19-2003

>I always thought of "Aguinara" as a "she" also, but I don't recall any references to her in-game.

And no one probably ever will, since it's just my guess and poor attempt at humour. When I said she was an assistant to Zhar, I didn't mean a Horadric type of magic. I meant it in a Sigfried & Roy kind of magic.

>How do you tie her to Zhar?

With magic of course! *Rimshot*. Ok that's my last attempt at a joke. Time to get my diploma refunded at Klown Kollege.

Question about the Diablo Universe - Yogi_Baar - 06-19-2003

the Langolier,Jun 18 2003, 10:37 PM Wrote:Of course that black razor can't be the godliest item of them all, it dropped from the butcher

I gave the Black Razor as an example. There are many uniques that fit into the same category. Oh, and by the way, I like the Butcher. After all, it was him who gave me a HOS.

the Langolier,Jun 18 2003, 10:37 PM Wrote:If you are trying to see good use in the end game for all uniques, you are looking at it the wrong way.  My mage found the immolator after killing the butcher just after getting to dlvl 2.  4-8 fire damage in the dungeons, yes please!  He went mostly melee nearly until dlvl 4.

OK, but most players get to level 25 or so in 2 days, maybe 3 (if they're really slow). And that's when most move on to Nigthmare difficulty, where most uniques get useless. I stated in my previous post that most uniques are only good for IronMan games, simply because I cannae see why anyone would always play on Normal difficulty if it's not an IronMan character or one of its derivatives.

the Langolier,Jun 18 2003, 10:37 PM Wrote:This is exactly how unique items were meant to be.  When you happen to find one that matches your level, it is a great aid when you do even though you will eventually grow out of it.

I understand this is what they wanted, my problem is, "eventually" usually means a day. The set of useful items expanded a bit when I started playing ironman, now I'm actually hoping for a Shadowhawk, Executioner's blade or something of that normal-only uniques.

Also, I think this doesn't lead anywhere.

Question about the Diablo Universe - Fragbait - 06-20-2003

Hail Zyr,

Thanks for the links. These are some mighty entertaining stories. I enjoyed reading them very much :) .
Thanks everyone for the input.
As to what concerns Unique Items: It might lead nowhere, but as long as that, I'll second Lang's point of view.

Greetings, Fragbait

Question about the Diablo Universe - Something Dutch - 06-20-2003

Stop dissing the diablo 1 uniques!!! :huh:
Currently my warrior is at lvl 35 and sure has a hard time fighting the hell/hell monsters. Yesterday i faced a balrog/azure drake combo and they kicked my ass back to town in no time. I was about to visit some higher lvls when i suddenly noticed my stashed uniques. RAWR! Went back to hell and caused a massacre! :lol: Gotterdamerung + Civerbs Cudgel is one lethal melee combination! (takes some gold rings/amu offcourse)
I just think sorcerors have MUCH better uniques at their disposal, that dreamflange thing is just overpowered :angry:

Oh and i agree with fragbaits statement about the d1/d2 atmosphere, diablo 2 is NOTHING!