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Basic Party Strategy - Printable Version

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Basic Party Strategy - Artega - 03-01-2005

Skandranon,Mar 1 2005, 05:14 AM Wrote:Nope.  They're unpolymorphable, so they're not critters.  They're classified as simply "no type", like the Silithids (which are also unpolymorphable).  And even if you could polymorph one, there'd be no point to it.
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Nurfed claims they're Critters. Either way, I can't autotarget them.

Basic Party Strategy - Professor Frink - 03-02-2005

Xanthix,Feb 28 2005, 01:57 PM Wrote:Maybe we should also put together a list of all mobs that can be controlled/removed from a fight, since this is a common need for good groups. Here are the ones I know of:
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  • Mages: can polymorph humanoids, beasts, and critters
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  • Druids: can hibernate beasts and dragonkin
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  • Warlocks: can banish elementals and demons, can enslave demons, their Succubi can seduce humanoids
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  • Rogues: can sap humanoids
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  • Priests: can shackle undead and mind control humanoids
    <>
    [st]
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Hunters can freeze trap (not sure what can be frozen, skill says "enemy")
Engineers can (occaisonally) Gnomish Universal Remote mechanicals

-- frink

Basic Party Strategy - Icebird - 03-02-2005

I believe the druid's Entangling Roots skill works against most monsters, albeit only outside, which rules out most instances (Zul'Farrak being an exception).

Fear spells are rarely the first choice for crowd control, but they can be useful when Things Go Wrong. Warlocks have Fear and Howl of Terror. Priests have Psychic Scream.

Most of my experience has been playing a warlock, and I haven't reached the endgame yet. But I agree with the niche-filler comments - they provide a bunch of useful features which are usually welcome in groups.

Pets: You can change pets to fit the needs of the group and the situation. Imps have firepower and the Stamina buff (you can also leave them Phase Shifted as a mana battery with Dark Pact). Succbus is useful for Seduction. Use a Void Walker when the group needs an additional body on the front lines. Felhunters are great against casters.

To the list of ways of removing Debuffs, you can add the Felhunter's Devour Magic ability. It will also remove buffs from enemy targets.

Utility skills: Eye of Killrog for scouting. Ritual of Summoning for gathering a group. Unending Breath. The essential Soul Stone which is welcomed by any party. Health Stones.

Combat: In the instances I've done, my first task is to keep out of harm's way to make the healer's life easier. The warlock's DoT spells are fairly mana efficient, and generate aggro slowly. While Curse of Agony gets the most use in solo play, in groups other curses may be more useful: Curse of Tongues for casters, Curse of Recklessnss on runners, Curse of Shadow or Curse of the Elements if your party does a lot of spell damage.

You're also in a good position for back-up crowd control. Pets can be redirected if monsters threaten your casters. Warlocks also have some very good CC skills against the right monsters (I think Banish is one of the best in the game because it can't be broken by enthusiastic party members).

Chris

Basic Party Strategy - Xanthix - 03-03-2005

Thanks Icebird and Professor Frink for the additional updates - I edited my lists again.

Regarding Icebird's list of utility spells, I'd like to add a few. Mind Vision for priests is good for scouting. And Mind Sooth is good for sneaking past patrols or groups you don't want to fight. Shield Bash (Warrior), Silence (Priest), and Counterspell (Mage) are all great for shutting up enemy casters (and getting them to run to your melee guys). And Warlocks have underwater breathing - great for some areas/instances.

Basic Party Strategy - MongoJerry - 03-04-2005

Icebird,Mar 2 2005, 04:41 PM Wrote:Fear spells are rarely the first choice for crowd control, but they can be useful when Things Go Wrong. Warlocks have Fear and Howl of Terror. Priests have Psychic Scream.

This is an underused category of crowd control, in my humble opinion. People are so used to being afraid of getting adds after fears that they don't even think of the idea of using them when there is no danger of getting adds. Anyway, warriors have intimidating shout which causes the targeted mob to stay and fight and all other mobs nearby to flee for 8 seconds.

Basic Party Strategy - Artega - 03-04-2005

MongoJerry,Mar 4 2005, 02:19 AM Wrote:This is an underused category of crowd control, in my humble opinion.&nbsp; People are so used to being afraid of getting adds after fears that they don't even think of the idea of using them when there is no danger of getting adds.&nbsp; Anyway, warriors have intimidating shout which causes the targeted mob to stay and fight and all other mobs nearby to flee for 8 seconds.
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Intimidating Shout is superior to Psychic Scream in every way other than the cooldown (and possibly duration; not certain about Scream's.) Unlike Scream, Shout has no limit on numbers of targets. It's pretty useful when you're getting zerged by lots of normal mobs.

Basic Party Strategy - kandrathe - 03-04-2005

Savingsupertokyo,Feb 28 2005, 02:03 AM Wrote:One of my biggest disappointments with WoW so far is the lack of people that are good in parties.&nbsp; I've played on several of my friend's accounts until I got my own two weeks ago, so I've not progressed beyond level 20.&nbsp;
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Many have answered to the specifics of what each class can bring to the team, but what I'm missing in many of my "pick-up" party experiences is any pre-instance discussion of how the party will operate, looting rules, etc. I think as a rule we "smart" players should take the 5-10 minutes pre-instance to go over the particulars of how this new team will work. It saves from frustration mid-instance and having some disgruntled party member drop out. Some veterans of many battles might find the "planning" phase boring, but I still think it would be good to cover the bases and get all the players in agreement beforehand.

Anyway, my point is that intelligent play under fire is one aspect of good party play, but the other is understanding your role in the team and endeavoring to accomplish that goal. Everyone wants to leave the instance richer in both loot and experience, so a good team insures that all members are feeling satisfied with the mission. Maybe there was a particular item that someone wanted, but did not get. I feel it is their responsibility to express themselves to either, a) request a schedule to do the instance again, b) negotiate to trade for the item, or c) suck it up.

Anyway, here are some of my pet peeves.

I hate being in the middle of some quest work and have a blind invite pop up on my screen. It tells me two things, some player(s) saw me working my quest (effectively perhaps) and decided I would be able to help them, and second they lack the communication skills to use chat to engage me in conversation. I often will join the random pickup group because I feel it is only fair to share an area so that all can accomplish their acquisition quests equally. But, often then I find that they are not insuring that the "Gather X" items are being distributed fairly, and/or change to looting rules to thier favor. Then I tell them, "Sorry, this isn't working for me. You guys need to learn to share." and drop out to accomplish the quest solo.

I'm more forgiving with how the team works as I figure they will learn by doing, or with some tactical discussion during play. I've been in teams where my initial thought is, "There is no way this team will succeed." Sometimes I am surprised how we do pull it off, and it is usually do to heroics on someones part.

In the end, practice makes perfect (if the participants are willing to learn).

Basic Party Strategy - Drasca - 03-06-2005

MongoJerry,Mar 4 2005, 01:19 AM Wrote:This is an underused category of crowd control, in my humble opinion.&nbsp; People are so used to being afraid of getting adds after fears that they don't even think of the idea of using them when there is no danger of getting adds.&nbsp;
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I very much agree. This fear usually comes from the non-caster crowd too. "Don't fear don't fear". Well, fear has a range limit. It varies from mob to mob with creatures set with larger patrol limits having increased fear run range. Once they hit that brick wall, they start going sideways or backwards. So when you have enough room, fear will paralyze the enemy like it should.

I've trained warriors in my guild to work with me in creationg a situation where fear will not create adds. Warriors need to charge, but warriors don't have to be in the front lines to charge. Standing just behind the group is just as good. Or, charge and fight walking backwards to bring them out of fear-add distance. Doing this proves extremely effective. As a Warlock, I can fear-lock individual enemies without a fear skill use cooldown. For me, this has made otherwise impossible (pure stats vs stats) battles winnable, and hard battles made easy.

My favorite is taking out elite dragonkin in Dustwallow Marsh with fear. . . and particularly that chicken Overlord Mok. . . he had no resistence to fear. Reason? He's a total utter coward. No wonder he couldn't help but run the village around in circles while I taunted him and threw tomatoes at him until he ran far far away.

Basic Party Strategy - bkelly1984 - 03-08-2005

Savingsupertokyo,Feb 28 2005, 12:03 AM Wrote:A general summary of what other classes are expected to do in a party situation would be great.&nbsp;
One thing I think any basic party strategy guide should have is a list of things not to do. Not everyone is going to pick up the finer aspects of group play, but I would still be happy to adventure with them if they don't sabotage everyone else. Perhaps I should mail myself a copy of this list and hand it out to the really clueless ones.

As a warrior, a few examples of don'ts quickly come to mind:

Never Start a Fight – It's important for a group to handle one group of monsters at a time, so to prevent two people attacking two different groups, a “puller” is designated. If this is done in your group, and it is not you, then you should never initiate combat.

Mind Your Aggro – Wandering around a dungeon for ore, herbs or sightseeing is asking for a wipe. Everyone needs to stay together and preferably behind the tank. If you want to go a direction, ask. Also keep in mind that a lower level characters have a larger aggro radius and should hang back a little towards safer areas.

Let the Puller Work – The puller's job is to bring as few monsters as possible to everyone else. Not only can this break up challenging groups but allows the fight to occur in already cleared areas where there will be no “adds” even if the monster runs. Running forward and attacking the beast en-route will short-circuit the pull, requiring the group to move up as well and fight in a more dangerous area.

Pick Your Target Carefully – A tank can keep the attention of a large number of monsters, provided they are not being attacked by someone else. So, don't open fire on one of the beasts around the tank at random as it will likely turn its attention to you. This not only creates more work for the tank and healer but confusion for all. Instead, assist another party member with their target. Since more people are attacking the same monster, it is less likely to attack you, and even if it does, it will die sooner.

Kill One at a Time – I know the large group of monsters around the tank is just begging to be Flamestriked or Multi-Shot. Resist the urge. The last thing you may see through the ensuing chaos is the tank scrambling to pull all the monsters off you while the healers exhaust their mana trying to keep you alive. Pick one target, kill it and then move on to the next.

You'll Get No Cheese Either – Don't whine. None of us always win the roll for the equipment we want and we all get stuck following a plan we know is doomed to fail. Express your desire or concern once, and then shut up and do your best for the group. There may be a better piece of equipment on the next monster and the plan might actually work.

Any additions from the other classes?

Brian