Bolty,Dec 12 2005, 10:17 AM Wrote:WE BEAT A SONS PACK on Saturday.  We're close.

-Bolty
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Bolty,Dec 12 2005, 08:17 AM Wrote:Resurrecting this.  Legedi over at the CA forums pointed out this strategy guide for Ragnaros which is very close to what we've been doing already.

We just need everyone to study this, understand it, and be ready to do it.  One or two people who come to the next Rag attempt and have no clue what to expect can blow it for everyone.

WE BEAT A SONS PACK on Saturday.  We're close.

-Bolty
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Lissa,Dec 12 2005, 12:03 PM Wrote:To tell the truth, I think we just need a little more FR and Rag is a walking deadman.  If we can get the two main tanks to around 275 unbuffed FR, with the Pally aura, knock backs should be extremely rare.[right][snapback]96801[/snapback][/right]

Bolty,Dec 12 2005, 12:46 PM Wrote:3) DPS'ers need to bandage whenever possible
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Bolty,Dec 12 2005, 01:46 PM Wrote:1) Everyone needs more FR

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Ruvanal,Dec 12 2005, 04:57 PM Wrote:I second more stress on this.  A players lack of FR is not just going to effect his survival, but also possibly the survival of those near them.  If you are hit by the Fireball ("By Fire be Purged!") and do not resist, then you can end up taking damage and sending nearby character flying for impact damage and possible lava baths. 

On our best run Saturday, this is what lead to killing Littledude prior to the Sons getting spawned.  There were 4 times I was blown away and it was always from an explosion to my right the sent me flying to the left.  The first time was not too serious, but left me at an uncomfortable level of life, but too little damage to want to burn bandage right away.  The second impact did somewhat more damage and I managed to get about a third of the effect of the bandage off prior to a lava surge interupting it.  The third was about the same as the second for damage but I only got like 2 ticks of bandaging off prior to a lava suge interuption.  I then had to chug a healing pot to even have a risky amount of health to continue with.  Just as I got back into postion, I got hit with the fourth blast effect; only this time it dumped me in a bad spot in the lava.  My choices there were to try to hop out onto land (did not work, too high a ledge in that area) hop out onto the land area with melee DPS (mana user around there=big no-no) or try to swim around to find another spot with lower ledges to hop out at.  I died from the lava swiming after about 6 seconds and getting hung up on some crag in there.  At no point in this was directly damaged by Ragnaros, it was all incidently damage from being flung into the air and taking falling damage or having to take an extended lava bath.  Also note that during the times that I was flung around and having to heal and try to get back into position, that my DPS was effectively ZERO.  Not my lack of FR per se, but the lack of the group overall.

My add into to this though is that we need to take some time on a run and make more players go take some lava dips.  See what you can take with your FR gear on.  See where to try to head if you do get thrown in.  Be more aware of where all the easy egress points out of the lava are so that players can spend a minimal amount of time in it.  Know which route to take to get out and back to position so that you do not risk the melee DPS or MTs when you head back.

But overall I would say we did good.  Get the overall FR up across all the raid and then it will be time to start looking at getting the consumables to use like the Greater Fire Protection potion; till then save the mats till we are really ready for this step.
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• Fire resistance<>
  
• Proper Positioning<>
  
• DPS<>
  [st]As far as fire resistance is concerned, the two main tanks should have at least 300 FR unbuffed. Melee DPS should be at around 150 FR unbuffed, and all ranged DPS and healers should be at 80 FR unbuffed. It also helps to organize a quick trip into UBRS to buff your raid group with the fire resistance buff (+83 FR if I recall correctly) from the Spellbinder mobs in the first room (priests have to mind control them and buff the raid, so it helps to split the main raid group into 3 separate groups). The UBRS buff helps build up confidence among your raid group, makes the encounter a bit easier, and serves as a temporary band aid for those who are not still within their correct FR bracket.
  
  Positioning is also a key part of this fight, and you always have to make sure all the members in your raid group are 100% aware of what happens when they are not correctly spaced. As you might know by now, when Ragnaros yells “By fire be purged!” he targets one random raid member and makes him the center of an AoE fire explosion. The person that gets targeted takes minimal fire damage, but everyone in a ~10 yard radius around him gets knocked high in the air (and probably into the lava). Ranged DPS should be positioned closer to the edge of the lava like a firing squad, with enough space between each member to not screw up the person right next to him. The healers assigned to each ranged DPS group should always be standing BEHIND them, making sure to be at a safe enough distance to not screw up anyone else. Melee DPS should start off the fight spaced out on the opposite side of where the main tank will be tanking Ragnaros. When it’s time to DPS Ragnaros, melee DPS also has to be properly spaced out from each other to minimize collateral damage from these AoE explosions. The healers assigned to the melee DPS group have to use the remaining space left by the ranged DPS at the edge of the lava in the outer ring to get in healing range of the melee DPS, and some of them will have to position themselves at the edge of the lava in the inner circle due to space limitations. The healers that will be taking care of the MT have to position themselves directly behind him, properly spaced out to avoid the random AoE explosions that could potentially spell the death of one of the MT’s. In short, if more than one or two people get knocked into the air during the fight, you have a positioning problem.
  
  It’s also a good idea to give at least each member two Greater Fire Resistance potions. Have them drink their first potion before the fight starts so the potion cooldown is clear by the time the fight starts, and have them drink the second potion just before the sons. The fire potions really help minimize damage taken to your raid group and thus mana spent on healing people.
  
  One important thing to point out here is that if your ranged DPS is properly equipped with FR gear and properly positioned, they should be taking next to NO damage at all and if they do, they should bandage up. Speaking of bandages, melee DPS should do so in between AoE knockbacks to help save up the healer’s mana.
  
  Lastly, there’s the issue of DPS. It’s probably a good idea to maximize your guild’s damage output by asking your members to properly spec for maximum DPS just for this fight. For example, mages should be specced into Arcane Power, Artic Reach, Improved Frostbolt, Ice Shards and Piercing Ice to maximize their damage output during this fight. It’s basically the same deal for all the other classes. Your first ever Ragnaros kill is a guild effort, and as much as I hate to tell people how to play their characters, everyone should be willing to sacrifice some gold in order to be properly specced for maximum performance during this fight. When it comes to melee DPS, it’s just an issue of making sure they back up before the AoE knockback happens and making sure they give the secondary tank some seconds of aggro building in case the main tank gets punted. Make sure every single class that can debuff does so to maximize damage (Shadow Word: Pain, Corruption, Serpent Sting, heck, even Moonfire if you don’t have that many debuffers in your raid group). If you want to push it to the extremes, have your guild farm mats for Flasks of Supreme Power for your ranged spell casters, and give your melee DPS sharpening stones. If everything goes well and people are doing their DPS job correctly and debuffing, Ragnaros should be at less than 40% before the first submersion (our best is 26% so far). By the time he comes back up, he will fall into Execute range and this will make his health go down faster. Basically, you want to kill him before he submerges for a second time.
  
  Regarding the Sons of Ragnaros, have all your ranged DPS collapse 10 to 15 seconds before he submerges. Have your MT’s with their huge FR pick up as many sons as possible, Warlocks banish one son but never rebanish, and give a hunter a MT window so he can mark one for the raid to assist. Dealing with the sons is fairly trivial if your raid group is properly equipped with FR gear since they deal strictly 100% fire damage. If the ranged DPS and healers collapse properly, the warriors manage to keep the sons in the center and away from all mana users and if people are properly assisting on the hunter and focusing fire, the sons should go down real fast. All forms of crowd control work on them, be it Frost Nova, War Stomp, Banish, etc. Use anything in your power to slow them, and if a mana user has aggro he should run to the warriors instead of pulling the son closer to other mana users. Even a single mage spamming Rank 1 Improved Blizzard to keep the sons slowed down and tight can make all the difference.
  
  Just remember, correct positioning and correct FR (don't forget the UBRS buff!) will be a huge asset to your raid group and will give a huge break to your healer's mana pools. Once again, if more than two people get knocked into the air at the same time, you've got a positioning problem in your hands!
  
  Anyway, I hope some of what I wrote in here helps you out with Ragnaros, and I honestly hope you don't get an Essence of the Pure Flame on your first kill. :)

Quark,Dec 12 2005, 09:22 PM Wrote:One thing to note -> Lava Surges, a random attack, can be nasty to anyone trying to bandage.&nbsp; With two bandages on our good run, I got a total of 600 health (out of 4000) by bad timing.
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Quark,Dec 13 2005, 07:52 PM Wrote:CMs have confirmed it's not an exploit, even in a post where they linked a picture of a GM claiming it was.&nbsp; I've never heard of anyone punished for it, either.

I think, if Blizzard wanted to consider it exploiting, it would already be gone.
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Quote:As the others have stated, this is considered creative use of game mechanics and is legitimate.

Quote: This is a creative use of game mechanics... not an exploit. It wouldn't be on the mind control options if we didn't intend for it to be there. Funny, isn't it, how these spellcasters are located right inside an instance that's very, very close to two raid dungeons where fire resistance plays a big role, hm? ;)